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I can see warlock skyrunner's cost going up, currently they are only 12 PTS more for the bike which is a big buff over the infantry version.

Guess the other Orkz ain't got here yet, but while most of our stuff is overcosted for what you get, the Smasha is definitely under-priced. Problem is, it's hard to fix. Raise the price of the weapon and everything else that has it (and can't opt out) will suffer. Raise the price of the chassis and the other loadouts will be even more over-priced (aside from the Traktor Kannon, which is pretty close to dead-on, all the other options are too expensive to bother with).

So you'd either have to raise the cost of Mek Gunz and drop the price of the other loadouts (which will affect some units which can take them), or raise the price of the Smasha and lower the price of the other units which can take it (which may make them undercosted). It's a pretty weird thing, though unless your opponent has a few hundred bucks to spend on Mek Gun spam, you probably ain't usually got to worry about it.

I think vanilla marines need lots of looks at, currently. If they are going to keep the super doctrines they need price tweaks if using them. Not all marine units are created the same when using those.

That said I'll be thrilled to have Infantry squads go up to 5 ppm as soon as guard get some units made maybe less meh and there are more actual choices to make. As well as when they get their super doctrine then raise all the points.

 Insectum7 wrote:
Sternguard with a SI Bolter are probably a point light.

I was surprised those went down at all, the SIB is pretty darn good.

The issue with CSM is:

Take x Trait + x stratagem specific to X god. THe unit is now overly effective.

Don't do that and the unit is not effective.

And i believe that that is a issue in more then one book.

But he, all traits are equally worth it right guys`?
Guys? Why are the WB players standing up and readying their hardcoxer dexes?

Not Online!!! wrote:
The issue with CSM is:

Take x Trait + x stratagem specific to X god. THe unit is now overly effective.

Don't do that and the unit is not effective.

And i believe that that is a issue in more then one book.

But he, all traits are equally worth it right guys`?
Guys? Why are the WB players standing up and readying their hardcoxer dexes?

Pretty much, right combo makes the units very good, the wrong one makes them meh. I love using my obliterators are always slanesh for the fire twice stratagem, drop them with abandon and delete 2+ units in the shooting phase and possibly another in assault.

Ehh - Levithan dread needs increased cost. At least the storm cannons do.

I feel like there are a lot more units that need drops than units that need increases though.

BrianDavion wrote:

ccs wrote:
Oh, that's easy.

If my opponent is using it, then it needs an increase.
If I'm using it, then no increase required (a decrease though might definitely be in order)

DakkaDakka balance arguments in a nutshell

Unlike the others though I'm saying it in jest..

Valkyrie, Most of IG HQ's, infantry squad,

 skchsan wrote:
Valkyrie, Most of IG HQ's, infantry squad,

How much have you used the Valkyrie since it was nerfed? I thought that killed it more or less, I played a couple of games against a guy who topped a few tournaments with his Valkyrie spam list and a large part of how devastating was how close he could deploy, move 19,5", get out just within 3" move 6", now you're 29" from your deployment zone T1. I guess it might still be better than a Drop Pod, but you're only transporting infantry. What do you put in your Valks?

I feel like the Catachan melee list would be entirely killed if you nerfed all the HQs and the Infantry Squad, I'd like to see a nerf to the Commander and Infantry Squads because I think they'd still be used (assuming other armies get nerfs as well), but if you also want to make all the other support HQs used in Catachan melee lists then I don't see that list working at all. I might be wrong, it was after all used as part of some of the most powerful lists in the history of 8th, but I still think it's cool that the codex allows such an unorthodox strategy. I love running my Necrons into melee with Novokh and Anrakyr giving them re-rolls in the Fight phase when they charge/get charged and an extra attack.

I cannot fathom what about a Valkyrie needs an increase. I have seen almost none on tables for the last 3 editions. They have little meaningful firepower of their own, and there's almost nothing in the army capable enough to make much effective use out of a Valks mobility when the Valk typically costs as much or more than whatever its transporting

 Vaktathi wrote:
I cannot fathom what about a Valkyrie needs an increase. I have seen almost none on tables for the last 3 editions. They have little meaningful firepower of their own, and there's almost nothing in the army capable enough to make much effective use out of a Valks mobility when the Valk typically costs as much or more than whatever its transporting

Yeah and sicons can just deep strike.

The Newman wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:
Sternguard with a SI Bolter are probably a point light.

I was surprised those went down at all, the SIB is pretty darn good.

Wait...what? Good god. I expect my IBGs to be 0 points in CA now.

A few things I can think of from my various armies.

Tanks commanders - need a bit of an increase as they are just too efficient a choice. Perhaps raise them by 15 and drop a normal russ by 10.

Infantry squad - increase to 5 to make conscripts have a place again and at 4 they are just too good for their points. Perhaps reduce the cost of special weapons a little and make the vox a free upgrade to compensate them.

Space marines are hard to balance atm, everything is too cheap with their new bonuses unless the other factions also get a hand up. Perhaps assault centurion stand out as just too cheap for their profile and weapons.

Leviathan dreads are well costed but the stormcannon is not, you dont see any of the other weapons as they cost more and are worse, increase these by 10-15 each.

Not Online!!! wrote:
The issue with CSM is:

Take x Trait + x stratagem specific to X god. THe unit is now overly effective.

Don't do that and the unit is not effective.

And i believe that that is a issue in more then one book.

But he, all traits are equally worth it right guys`?
Guys? Why are the WB players standing up and readying their hardcoxer dexes?

That's fair. Also not exclusively a CSM issue either. Assault Centurions look very good for the points, until you're trying to play them as Ultramarines and you don't have a good way to get them where they want to be. The Phobos Captain is kind of meh under anyone except Ravenguard. Libbys are now wildly dependent on chapter and army composition because the basic Marine powers are still jank and you can't mix-and-match with the Tome of Malcadore anymore.

That's kind of the real issue with Marines at the moment. It's not that it's all good, it's that they have a deeper bench than anyone else and even though a lot of that bench is janky they've got six different blends of turd-polish to choose from.

 WisdomLS wrote:


Tank Commanders - need a bit of an increase as they are just too efficient a choice. Perhaps raise them by 15 and drop a normal russ by 10.

Infantry squad - increase to 5 to make conscripts have a place again and at 4 they are just too good for their points. Perhaps reduce the cost of special weapons a little and make the vox a free upgrade to compensate them.

+1 these would be sensible changes to Imperial Guard.

Now if we were talking points decreases, I could make a list with half of the Necron Codex.

Basilisks could probably stand a slight increase in points, considering how cheap they are.