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 Aaranis wrote:
Other highlights from the GT Rulebook:

- Deployment: both players declare their Reserves, then alternate deployment one unit at a time, then roll off to know who gets 1st turn
- Reserves: same as 8th, no Reserves on 1st round, and not after 3rd round
- Rule of Two at 1000 pts and Rule of Three at 2000 pts

Doesn’t sound terrible. No more steal the initiative. Deploy with the assumption that you’re going second.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

 Aaranis wrote:
Other highlights from the GT Rulebook:

- Deployment: both players declare their Reserves, then alternate deployment one unit at a time, then roll off to know who gets 1st turn
- Reserves: same as 8th, no Reserves on 1st round, and not after 3rd round
- Rule of Two at 1000 pts and Rule of Three at 2000 pts

For what it's worth, those are all the same as with the Eternal War missions in the main rulebook, except for the "Rule of Two at 1000pts" part. Eternal War is Rule of 3 at every level.

Uh, I was convinced having read that the Reserves rules were gone for 9th, and that they only added them back for Competitive.

Deploying whole army LESSENS risks of alpha strike. If you go first you go first and thus aren't alpha striked. If you go 2nd you KNOW you go second and furthermore knows where opponents threats are and thus can put your favourite unit(s) into safety.

Power of alpha strike got reduced when GW went to one army deploys first and goes first. That change reversed is unlikely thus to further that trend...rather reverses.

 Aaranis wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

 Aaranis wrote:
Other highlights from the GT Rulebook:

- Deployment: both players declare their Reserves, then alternate deployment one unit at a time, then roll off to know who gets 1st turn
- Reserves: same as 8th, no Reserves on 1st round, and not after 3rd round
- Rule of Two at 1000 pts and Rule of Three at 2000 pts

For what it's worth, those are all the same as with the Eternal War missions in the main rulebook, except for the "Rule of Two at 1000pts" part. Eternal War is Rule of 3 at every level.

Uh, I was convinced having read that the Reserves rules were gone for 9th, and that they only added them back for Competitive.

Nah the sections are the exact same pretty much word for word between the Eternal War and GT 2020 Missions for the "Declare Reserves and Transports" step.

But what's the point of this book then ? Charging money for a few missions ?

New Missions, swapping a couple of Secondaries (and changing Titan Hunter), the Rule of Two and banning Specialist Detachments. There's also apparently "much, much more" according to the webstore... but who knows what that refers to (notice how the leak jumps from page 11 to page 38? EDIT: On second thought, those pages are probably just the Incursion missions). It's apparently 96 pages so we're missing just under half of the contents.

That and all the points changes you get in the accompanying Field Manual.

 Aaranis wrote:
But what's the point of this book then ? Charging money for a few missions ?

For me it's a cheaper alternative to the BRB in a format better suited for use during playing.

 Aaranis wrote:
But what's the point of this book then ? Charging money for a few missions ?

Good question. I think this book is only worth it if you want to organize tournaments. I know for my means the crusade book will be much more interesting.

 Aaranis wrote:
But what's the point of this book then ? Charging money for a few missions ?

It has all the 40K rules from the core book. The real question would be "what's the point of the core book then?", which is useless unless you care for the fluff, the artwork or the crusade system.

Sgt. Cortez wrote:

 Aaranis wrote:
But what's the point of this book then ? Charging money for a few missions ?

Good question. I think this book is only worth it if you want to organize tournaments. I know for my means the crusade book will be much more interesting.

What crusade book? They only announced that journal so far and that is only blank roosters for you to fill out

Ragnar69 wrote:

Sgt. Cortez wrote:

 Aaranis wrote:
But what's the point of this book then ? Charging money for a few missions ?

Good question. I think this book is only worth it if you want to organize tournaments. I know for my means the crusade book will be much more interesting.

What crusade book? They only announced that journal so far and that is only blank roosters for you to fill out

There will inevitably be crusade expansions.

So am I understanding this correctly, that the Rule of 2/3 is not a general matched play rule, but a rule unique to tournament play?

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
So am I understanding this correctly, that the Rule of 2/3 is not a general matched play rule, but a rule unique to tournament play?

Correct in a way. The Eternal War missions still use their own Rule of 3 (which doesn't scale at different points levels).
Future matched play mission packs might also have a different take.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
So am I understanding this correctly, that the Rule of 2/3 is not a general matched play rule, but a rule unique to tournament play?

The only difference is that the matched play missions from the BRB allow 3 datasheets independent of how large your army is, while the tournament rules limit you to 2 datasheets when playing 1000 points

the one big difference with the tournament rule is that we have 2 standard sizes now

1000 points and 2000 points
if you want to play 1250 or 1500 points tournament you cannot use the official tournament rules but need houserules

on the other hand, there is no need for special 2000 points ITC tournament rules any more

1250 and 1500pts and both Strike Force level, same as 2000pts.

After the Indomitus ‘launch set’ I hope we can expect smaller starter sets comparable to Dark
Imperium, Know No Fear and First Strike. Presumably these would be Primaris- and Necron-themed, but the prominence of the Sisters in the animated trailer and ‘faction focus’ on the Warhammer40000.com site gives a glimmer of hope there might be some ETB sisters (maybe with eviscerators?). A man can dream.

The purpose of this CA is to provide a small compendium to bring with you during games, and to finally separate tournament rules from matched play rules, which was one of the most requested features during 8th, especially on this board.

Now you know that for tournaments there is either 1000 points or 2000 points, there aren't other point levels.

The secondaries were tweaked to take into account that the lists used will be highly optimized, so obtaining kill more is more achieavable and should be worth less. Killing 2 Titanic units is definitely doable, so shouldn't be rewarded with the full 15 points. Killing 3 is more of a challenge.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
1250 and 1500pts and both Strike Force level, same as 2000pts.

for matched play, for tournament play there is only 1000 and 2000 points

and tournament play has nothing do to with matched play any more

 Daedalus81 wrote:


No. We're not allowed to disagree. In the 41st millennium there is only bitching.

And in the 3rd millenium there is only trolling.

as the other pointed out orks are getting srewed left and right.

we had four staples of competitive play
SSAG
gretchin
orkboyz
Flashgitz

all of em got nerfed into oblivion. be it by the general rules, point increases or in case of the SSAG all that was mentioned plus it got canned on top xD
Not to mention, orks had at least 18 CP's per game to spend, more than most armies could manage... now thats gone too.

the only things that remain really good are buggies, mekgunz and the burnabomber

Spoletta wrote:
The purpose of this CA is to provide a small compendium to bring with you during games, and to finally separate tournament rules from matched play rules, which was one of the most requested features during 8th, especially on this board.

Now you know that for tournaments there is either 1000 points or 2000 points, there aren't other point levels.

The secondaries were tweaked to take into account that the lists used will be highly optimized, so obtaining kill more is more achieavable and should be worth less. Killing 2 Titanic units is definitely doable, so shouldn't be rewarded with the full 15 points. Killing 3 is more of a challenge.

They weren't tweaked that much. Mechanized lists still vomit points thanks to bring them down, GK and Tsons lists still start the game giving their opponent 15VP if they're Tau, Necrons, Sisters, dark eldar, etc.

They're better but some are probably eirher going to be reworked by TOs or banned.

ERJAK wrote:

Spoletta wrote:
The purpose of this CA is to provide a small compendium to bring with you during games, and to finally separate tournament rules from matched play rules, which was one of the most requested features during 8th, especially on this board.

Now you know that for tournaments there is either 1000 points or 2000 points, there aren't other point levels.

The secondaries were tweaked to take into account that the lists used will be highly optimized, so obtaining kill more is more achieavable and should be worth less. Killing 2 Titanic units is definitely doable, so shouldn't be rewarded with the full 15 points. Killing 3 is more of a challenge.

They weren't tweaked that much. Mechanized lists still vomit points thanks to bring them down, GK and Tsons lists still start the game giving their opponent 15VP if they're Tau, Necrons, Sisters, dark eldar, etc.

They're better but some are probably eirher going to be reworked by TOs or banned.

Actually I think the TO's will probably follow FLG's stance and leave them alone atleast for the first while.

I think the reason mech lists and a smite spam list vomit VP is because they can counter score 15VP's very easily on certain secondary missions too.

But every army is going to give secondary VPs, they're varied enough that there's an objective fit to use against your opponent every time. I don't see why Abhor the Witch is any easier to do than Assassinate, Thin their ranks or Bring it down. We still have to kill those Psykers, often being Characters and so harder to target in the first place. I mean I play AdMech, I expect my opponents to take Thin their ranks and Bring it down every game because I play lots of Skitarii and Vehicles. And I'll do the same if my opponent has the same kind of list. Of course I'll take Titan Hunter against Knights etc. Every army has to bring units to the table as far as I'm aware and these units can be destroyed during the game.

Each objective is limited to 15 pts too so yeah if you managed to destroy 5 of my 11+W vehicles you deserve points that's normal.

 Jidmah wrote:

And no the SSAG is banned

In tournaments.

Are you acting as if you know gak about orks again? Have a look at the "embark" section of the new rules, passengers count as moved if the transport moved, open topped doesn't matter at all.

I play against Orks 80% of my games, but excuse me for missing a rule that is totally unrelated to Orks. And I even said I wasn't sure! I guess people don't read these days.

Well, good thing they didn't miss the other 15 weapons with grot gunners and other static bonuses to their hit rolls so that freebootas aren't screwed out of their army trait.

Seriously? Those gunners are all +1 and not subject to being cut out as a result of too many bonuses bar Freebooters, but its not like they also change traits on the regular or that it becomes entirely redundant. CSM says hi.

... and no one would have cared at all if it didn't. The only reason to bother rolling for this rule was when your unit was going to be wiped out by moral and a single six meant that you could hold an objective or green tide the unit.
You know it's looking grim for orks if you have to list this as a benefit.

It's a literal god damn benefit. Oh but sure that time I roll a 6 to keep a MANZ or KK on the table from both morale and attrition losses, yea, totally not worth it. But let's just turn everything into a complaint.

 Aaranis wrote:
But every army is going to give secondary VPs, they're varied enough that there's an objective fit to use against your opponent every time. I don't see why Abhor the Witch is any easier to do than Assassinate, Thin their ranks or Bring it down. We still have to kill those Psykers, often being Characters and so harder to target in the first place. I mean I play AdMech, I expect my opponents to take Thin their ranks and Bring it down every game because I play lots of Skitarii and Vehicles. And I'll do the same if my opponent has the same kind of list. Of course I'll take Titan Hunter against Knights etc. Every army has to bring units to the table as far as I'm aware and these units can be destroyed during the game.

Each objective is limited to 15 pts too so yeah if you managed to destroy 5 of my 11+W vehicles you deserve points that's normal.

Tsons/gk every unit is psyker. Killing any unit gives vp.

Everybody has units but not all are as easy. 9th army lists will be more about denying secondaries than scoring yourself

 Aaranis wrote:
But every army is going to give secondary VPs, they're varied enough that there's an objective fit to use against your opponent every time. I don't see why Abhor the Witch is any easier to do than Assassinate, Thin their ranks or Bring it down. We still have to kill those Psykers, often being Characters and so harder to target in the first place. I mean I play AdMech, I expect my opponents to take Thin their ranks and Bring it down every game because I play lots of Skitarii and Vehicles. And I'll do the same if my opponent has the same kind of list. Of course I'll take Titan Hunter against Knights etc. Every army has to bring units to the table as far as I'm aware and these units can be destroyed during the game.

Each objective is limited to 15 pts too so yeah if you managed to destroy 5 of my 11+W vehicles you deserve points that's normal.

Will be interesting to see if that makes people spam certain things less - if you only have 4 vehicles and 4 character etc then you cap any potential VP to the enemy at 12 and not 15 etc. A force that is more mixed maybe harder to choose secondaries against (or the ones that try to take advantage of the enemy force specifically).

 addnid wrote:

gungo wrote:
Someone at GW really hated orks last edition.

Both the SSAG and shoot twice strat is gone
I don’t think any army relied on vigilus detachments to be competitive as much as orks... the SAG in any form is dead this edition...

Gen cult relied more, I play both armies, so I know

I agree orks got hit extremely hard, but I think the star of the nerfbat this start of 9th is gen cult. I was expecting it. GW had shown they hate that army with last CA

Genecult was hosed overall by 9th. I was speaking more vigilus stuff but ya GC is basically not competitive at all with the 9th changes. You guys pretty much got the reward for worst army.

Also I think GW convulted game rules to much. How many versions of 40k do we need? Over half of which is likely never to see much play since most people will just stick to 1-2 standard rule sets.
Open play
Narrative play
Crusade play
Matched play
Tournament play

The SSAG is effectively dead.. it’s basically legends at this point as vigilus is all but retired....
I’m not even saying that’s a bad idea... I think it’s good for GW to retire older books. This doesn’t change the fact 9th completely hosed armies orks genecult, ynnari with complete dismantling of rules, units, etc.... and points changes that is roundly claimed to be half arsed and lazy. They took very little effort individualizing points and appears to have mostly used a formula to just add points to everything and placing min point values on certain units... mostly invalidating any attempt at balancing points in 8th.

I guess Gw feels if you throw enough gak at the wall something will stick.

puree wrote:

 Aaranis wrote:
But every army is going to give secondary VPs, they're varied enough that there's an objective fit to use against your opponent every time. I don't see why Abhor the Witch is any easier to do than Assassinate, Thin their ranks or Bring it down. We still have to kill those Psykers, often being Characters and so harder to target in the first place. I mean I play AdMech, I expect my opponents to take Thin their ranks and Bring it down every game because I play lots of Skitarii and Vehicles. And I'll do the same if my opponent has the same kind of list. Of course I'll take Titan Hunter against Knights etc. Every army has to bring units to the table as far as I'm aware and these units can be destroyed during the game.

Each objective is limited to 15 pts too so yeah if you managed to destroy 5 of my 11+W vehicles you deserve points that's normal.

Will be interesting to see if that makes people spam certain things less - if you only have 4 vehicles and 4 character etc then you cap any potential VP to the enemy at 12 and not 15 etc. A force that is more mixed maybe harder to choose secondaries against (or the ones that try to take advantage of the enemy force specifically).

Oh yes. Either you deny or you go full out spam. Which is why my 1 squadron of mortificators is looking lonely

Anyone else notice that almost half of the GT missions are some form of hammer and anvil?

Hmm, no? They look like quite different from each other.