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Largely its just the marines being so cheap problem, i compare with xenos, chaos, or even admech and i dont feel like orks got mega shafted, just cut down a peg.

Also im finding this amusing. In 8th, i think i used MANz like....5 times? so far i havnt been able to make a list that doesnt feature atleast 1 squad of 3-4 killsaws lol it feels so wrong to not include them.
MANZ MISSILES ARE BACK BOYZ!!! (sorta not really, trukks arent remotely as fast and cant move+disembark)

I posted this in the old thread but seems we are migrating to here.

Chinorks are great, with 4D6 S5 -2 D3 damage shots each, plus free bombs and then your choice of rokkit launcha or big shoota at 90 pts for the big shoota variant. It's fantastic.
As GW no longer produces a model I'm converting mine using the Hobbyboss 1:48th scale Hueys with pilots, orky door gunners and orky bolt on bits from Kromlech and Ramshackle games. Won't be allowed to use them in GW stores or events but I think they are among the best thing in our dex now.
Being able to keep 10 boyz and a claw inside is a bonus.

Ghaz seems good in this edition though he could probably come down 50 pts. He does soak a ton of enemy attention that would otherwise be focused on your other stuff and is surprisingly mobile on the new smaller board.

For me though its still about Ork boyz and I think there is a solid argument still for horde, particularly if the meta shifts towards anti-vehicle.

I just hade 3 matches and went 1 1 1 Vs hands down the best player I can spar in this area. We really need to abbandon all way of thinking, because scoring at the start of your turn change completely how the mechanics works.
Staying power for Orks is not a thing to wager. We have no real way to spam cheap invu, no minus to hit or w, no stratagems to hide squads and ATM nothing that is worth hide behind a grot wall.

So I believe trukk boyz, kommandos, fast mobile unit like koptas and RAW firepower are the staples of our army right now.

I'm running this list and it works pretty good, since is not CP hungry at all


I invest 4 CP pregame, 8 left for exploding, wildfire, Green tide, autopass, fight twice and maybe fight in death with warboss. Is more than enough.
I m not sold on the MANz and some point s were off, so I think I'll add a 10 man boyz instead of one grot unit and remove the 5 MANz for 2x10 kommando or 2 SJD or MSJ.
Having so much obs sec is very important. I actually am gonna try a trukk boyz list with ALL the Smashaguns I own and maybe 2 KFF + Makari

So Saga of the Beast FAQ is up.

Big non sense.
- kff is back to normal (including cost), which sucks because the inv in CC was the only reason I found to bring a kff nowadays.
- to use kustom jobs we MUST include a mek workshop. Which is 85 and 1cp in 9th. Just the mere fact of having to bring the mek workshop around is insulting. And don't get me started on how 80% of the rules of PA are toilet paper now.

On the brigth side, Ghaz can now run and charge (and so does a Squiggorth close to him, wtf?).

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/kA6zZq83YtZHZ9Ea.pdf

Praise Gork (Or possibly Mork?)!
Ghaz got his adv+charge back.

Makari can be in non-goff along with Ghaz now

KFF is back to old-wording (ORK unit, shooting only, embark still works)
KFF costs 75pts to reflect the fact they kept the wording for somer eason to not require the wargear...? ok...odd..

And...possibly the biggest punch in the gut ever to orks... we cannot use kustom jobs unless we have a workshop... ... ... i have no words, just a large red palm-print on my face...

edit: Do note that the Mekshop does NOT cost you a CP, it has the same keyword the army does so you get that refunded.
It is, however, 85 completely and utterly wasted points. The fact it gives you a free kustomjob thus saving a cp does not remedy that pain at all.
So our PA book had 2 amazing things about it, Subkultures were great for side-detachments (now expensive as hell to run thanks to new format) and Kustom Jobz were amazing for the most part. Both are huge taxes now on an already hurting army. Really, GW?

Pickled_egg wrote:
I posted this in the old thread but seems we are migrating to here.

Chinorks are great, with 4D6 S5 -2 D3 damage shots each, plus free bombs and then your choice of rokkit launcha or big shoota at 90 pts for the big shoota variant. It's fantastic.
As GW no longer produces a model I'm converting mine using the Hobbyboss 1:48th scale Hueys with pilots, orky door gunners and orky bolt on bits from Kromlech and Ramshackle games. Won't be allowed to use them in GW stores or events but I think they are among the best thing in our dex now.
Being able to keep 10 boyz and a claw inside is a bonus.

Ghaz seems good in this edition though he could probably come down 50 pts. He does soak a ton of enemy attention that would otherwise be focused on your other stuff and is surprisingly mobile on the new smaller board.

For me though its still about Ork boyz and I think there is a solid argument still for horde, particularly if the meta shifts towards anti-vehicle.

I wouldn't invest too much time and energy to convert a model that might be legend in two weeks. Just a word of a advice. I might be wrong but....

Orkimedez_Atalaya wrote:
So Saga of the Beast FAQ is up.

Big non sense.
- kff is back to normal (including cost), which sucks because the inv in CC was the only reason I found to bring a kff nowadays.
- to use kustom jobs we MUST include a mek workshop. Which is 85 and 1cp in 9th. Just the mere fact of having to bring the mek workshop around is insulting. And don't get me started on how 80% of the rules of PA are toilet paper now.

On the brigth side, Ghaz can now run and charge (and so does a Squiggorth close to him, wtf?).

Lol so much for the people claiming the invuln working in combat was an intended change. Was just another in a long line of GW cock ups.

Oh well, won't be bringing one now.

So that's the KFF down powered, the Souped up Shokka gone from GT play . Jesus did somebody win an event with orks or something in 8th?

 Vineheart01 wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/kA6zZq83YtZHZ9Ea.pdf

And...possibly the biggest punch in the gut ever to orks... we cannot use kustom jobs unless we have a workshop... ... ... i have no words, just a large red palm-print on my face...

Christ. I remember when I argued this point as a slight joke.

85 points just so you can use Kustom Jobs. Welp, buggy lists are probably dead eh?

Edit: I was honestly pretty excited about a list I built that includes like... 6 kustom jobs. Dead in the water. I don't own a mek workshop and wasn't planning on buying one...

 Emicrania wrote:

Pickled_egg wrote:
I posted this in the old thread but seems we are migrating to here.

Chinorks are great, with 4D6 S5 -2 D3 damage shots each, plus free bombs and then your choice of rokkit launcha or big shoota at 90 pts for the big shoota variant. It's fantastic.
As GW no longer produces a model I'm converting mine using the Hobbyboss 1:48th scale Hueys with pilots, orky door gunners and orky bolt on bits from Kromlech and Ramshackle games. Won't be allowed to use them in GW stores or events but I think they are among the best thing in our dex now.
Being able to keep 10 boyz and a claw inside is a bonus.

Ghaz seems good in this edition though he could probably come down 50 pts. He does soak a ton of enemy attention that would otherwise be focused on your other stuff and is surprisingly mobile on the new smaller board.

For me though its still about Ork boyz and I think there is a solid argument still for horde, particularly if the meta shifts towards anti-vehicle.

I wouldn't invest too much time and energy to convert a model that might be legend in two weeks. Just a word of a advice. I might be wrong but....

You are probably right mate, but they've gutted just about everything else that made us vaguely competitive in 8th. Barring the Smasha gun which survived largely intent.

Perhaps they will throw us a bone?

The fact that the smasha gun is still so awesome is a shocker to me. I expected that to be the first one to get hit, presumably in the max model department so you cant just totally spam them.

Orkimedez_Atalaya wrote:
So Saga of the Beast FAQ is up.

Big non sense.
- kff is back to normal (including cost), which sucks because the inv in CC was the only reason I found to bring a kff nowadays.
- to use kustom jobs we MUST include a mek workshop. Which is 85 and 1cp in 9th. Just the mere fact of having to bring the mek workshop around is insulting. And don't get me started on how 80% of the rules of PA are toilet paper now.

On the brigth side, Ghaz can now run and charge (and so does a Squiggorth close to him, wtf?).

You got to be fething gaking me. Where ??????

 Emicrania wrote:

Orkimedez_Atalaya wrote:
So Saga of the Beast FAQ is up.

Big non sense.
- kff is back to normal (including cost), which sucks because the inv in CC was the only reason I found to bring a kff nowadays.
- to use kustom jobs we MUST include a mek workshop. Which is 85 and 1cp in 9th. Just the mere fact of having to bring the mek workshop around is insulting. And don't get me started on how 80% of the rules of PA are toilet paper now.

On the brigth side, Ghaz can now run and charge (and so does a Squiggorth close to him, wtf?).

You got to be fething gaking me. Where ??????

Page 70 – Ghazghkull Thraka, Great Waaagh!
Change the first line of this ability to read:
‘Friendly Ork Infantry and Monster units within 6" of this
model can be chosen to charge with even if they Advanced
this turn.’

At the bottom,

Q: Can I use the Kustom Job Stratagem if I do not have a Mekboy
Workshop in my army?
A: No.

There is no text restricting this. 1 addition includes starting with 0. This is purely a middle finger to orks.
If they'd redo the mekshop so it actually DOES SOMETHING i wouldnt be so pissed about this.

Oh and Ghaz did not get the Supreme Commander keyword, unless i missed it somewhere. So....who the hell is supposed to have that keyword GW?

The funniest thing about the KFF points change...

Since the CA20 is the most recent points update, KFFs are still 60 points. Okay?

But now it works like it should. Good. Melee invul was silly.

I can totally see myself spending 85 pts on a mek workshop so i can take Sparkly bitz on my already over costed Morkanaut.

Said absolutely no one ever.

Would love to know what they are smoking at GW right now.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

tulun wrote:
The funniest thing about the KFF points change...

Since the CA20 is the most recent points update, KFFs are still 60 points. Okay?

But now it works like it should. Good. Melee invul was silly.

It's 75 points

Also in the FAQ

Orkimedez_Atalaya wrote:
So Saga of the Beast FAQ is up.

Big non sense.
- kff is back to normal (including cost), which sucks because the inv in CC was the only reason I found to bring a kff nowadays.
- to use kustom jobs we MUST include a mek workshop. Which is 85 and 1cp in 9th. Just the mere fact of having to bring the mek workshop around is insulting. And don't get me started on how 80% of the rules of PA are toilet paper now.

On the brigth side, Ghaz can now run and charge (and so does a Squiggorth close to him, wtf?).

If by 1cp you refer to det if fortification has same faction keyword as warlord lt gets refunded

And no supreme commander　keyword in ghaz as expected

Pickled_egg wrote:


Automatically Appended Next Post:

tulun wrote:
The funniest thing about the KFF points change...

Since the CA20 is the most recent points update, KFFs are still 60 points. Okay?

But now it works like it should. Good. Melee invul was silly.

It's 75 points

Also in the FAQ

Incorrect.

The latest points update for 9th was CA20 -- which lists it at 60. Saga was written in 8th edition.

So the intent is obviously it should be 80, but by their current rules, it's still 60 points. Of course, it's going to change eventually.

This is getting fething ridiculous.
We have basically nothing left from PA beside the bombers.
The rest is trash.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
At the bottom,

Q: Can I use the Kustom Job Stratagem if I do not have a Mekboy
Workshop in my army?
A: No.

There is no text restricting this. 1 addition includes starting with 0. This is purely a middle finger to orks.
If they'd redo the mekshop so it actually DOES SOMETHING i wouldnt be so pissed about this.

Oh and Ghaz did not get the Supreme Commander keyword, unless i missed it somewhere. So....who the hell is supposed to have that keyword GW?

It's future use for new codexes. Just as they said

tulun wrote:

Pickled_egg wrote:


Automatically Appended Next Post:

tulun wrote:
The funniest thing about the KFF points change...

Since the CA20 is the most recent points update, KFFs are still 60 points. Okay?

But now it works like it should. Good. Melee invul was silly.

It's 75 points

Also in the FAQ

Incorrect.

The latest points update for 9th was CA20 -- which lists it at 60. Saga was written in 8th edition.

So the intent is obviously it should be 80, but by their current rules, it's still 60 points. Of course, it's going to change eventually.

You are correct.

But its 80 points in the Munitorum field Manual (CA) 60 pts is the base cost on page 33 excluding wargear.
on page 34 the Kustom force field is 20 pts

 Emicrania wrote:
This is getting fething ridiculous.
We have basically nothing left from PA beside the bombers.
The rest is trash.

Da Biggest Boss came out fine.

The SJD is okay too -- you can fire and fade with the strat. The auto advance on a 4+ was nice but it's useable. KBB didn't take the Kustom Job. Mega trakk really likes Korkscrew, but it still functions as a gunboat.

What is dead, though...

1) BS4 Mork
2) Slug Gubbins Gork
3) Forktress
4) Actual good Wartrike
5) Da Boomer
6) Deff Dreads with swanky upgrades
7) if you somehow decided to field a stompa, Stompa with 2 Damage gun.

In order to take any of this, you have to spend 4.5% of your army total just to start using it. Like, why?

Pickled_egg wrote:

But its 80 points in the Munitorum field Manual (CA) 60 pts is the base cost on page 33 excluding wargear.
on page 34 the Kustom force field is 20 pts

Except pa mek has no kff wargear. Just ability.

Gw can't get things done right to save their life

Pickled_egg wrote:

But its 80 points in the Munitorum field Manual (CA) 60 pts is the base cost on page 33 excluding wargear.
on page 34 the Kustom force field is 20 pts

Still 60. KFF is not listed wargear.

Again -- this will 100% go to 80 points. Just they haven't made the KFF 80 yet. He's 60 by RAW.

tulun wrote:

 Emicrania wrote:
This is getting fething ridiculous.
We have basically nothing left from PA beside the bombers.
The rest is trash.

Da Biggest Boss came out fine.

The SJD is okay too -- you can fire and fade with the strat. The auto advance on a 4+ was nice but it's useable. KBB didn't take the Kustom Job. Mega trakk really likes Korkscrew, but it still functions as a gunboat.

What is dead, though...

1) BS4 Mork
2) Slug Gubbins Gork
3) Forktress
4) Actual good Wartrike
5) Da Boomer
6) Deff Dreads with swanky upgrades
7) if you somehow decided to field a stompa, Stompa with 2 Damage gun.

In order to take any of this, you have to spend 4.5% of your army total just to start using it. Like, why?

I suspect its a pre-cursor to brand new mek workshop rules in our future codex that we can't plan around as we have no idea if we will be waiting 3 months or a year for it.

In the here and now its just another nerf to an already weak faction that is going to struggle to compete with anything but the lowest tiered armies.

The SJD strenght was in the autoadvance .
The MSJ would double it's efficiency.

Considering that we lost the SSAG, 90% of the stratagems in PA, the grots at 5pts, nerf to hordes, Flashgitz and lootas viability; the only thing we got since Orktober is :
Ghazkull
Makari
Biggest boss .

This is it. Shall we compare what other codex got?
How are we gonna compete with anyone ?

tulun wrote:

Pickled_egg wrote:

But its 80 points in the Munitorum field Manual (CA) 60 pts is the base cost on page 33 excluding wargear.
on page 34 the Kustom force field is 20 pts

Still 60. KFF is not listed wargear.

Again -- this will 100% go to 80 points. Just they haven't made the KFF 80 yet. He's 60 by RAW.

The asterix clearly says the big mek is sans wargear. The intent is 100000% obvious that you have to buy the KFF for an additional 20 pts.

Not sure who you play but I don't know anyone who would let you get away with that lol

All the other changes I'm okay with, the mek boy work shop is a punch in the mushroom.

I'll expect the KFF change to appear in a FAQ/Erratta for CA 2020 in a week or so.

I am excited for the changes to Ghaz and Makari, I am not a fan of playing Goffs but I really do love the models and think there's potential for them as units.

Pickled_egg wrote:

tulun wrote:

Pickled_egg wrote:

But its 80 points in the Munitorum field Manual (CA) 60 pts is the base cost on page 33 excluding wargear.
on page 34 the Kustom force field is 20 pts

Still 60. KFF is not listed wargear.

Again -- this will 100% go to 80 points. Just they haven't made the KFF 80 yet. He's 60 by RAW.

The asterix clearly says the big mek is sans wargear. The intent is 100000% obvious that you have to buy the KFF for an additional 20 pts.

Not sure who you play but I don't know anyone who would let you get away with that lol

Intent is so but thanks to gw being gw not how it works. And i know　i won't prevent ork from using 60 pts　kff. Orks have　been　hit　hard enough i'm happy to give them any break they can get

why are you guys arguing the price of the KFF Mek?

The FAQ specifically says it costs 75pts, 4pl. The FAQ overrides any of the new publications, including CA2020, since the FAQ is newer.
BigMek w/ KFF does not have KFF listed as wargear and the rule is not written "unit with this wargear" like the KFF normally is.

Its not the first time the same exact rule has had different verbage (see explosion or the admech repair rule)

He costs 75pts, and that includes the KFF since its not a wargear option and neither does it need to be to use the rule.

tneva82 wrote:

Pickled_egg wrote:

tulun wrote:

Pickled_egg wrote:

But its 80 points in the Munitorum field Manual (CA) 60 pts is the base cost on page 33 excluding wargear.
on page 34 the Kustom force field is 20 pts

Still 60. KFF is not listed wargear.

Again -- this will 100% go to 80 points. Just they haven't made the KFF 80 yet. He's 60 by RAW.

The asterix clearly says the big mek is sans wargear. The intent is 100000% obvious that you have to buy the KFF for an additional 20 pts.

Not sure who you play but I don't know anyone who would let you get away with that lol

Intent is so but thanks to gw being gw not how it works. And i know　i won't prevent ork from using 60 pts　kff. Orks have　been　hit　hard enough i'm happy to give them any break they can get

I will agree that we have been absolutely gutted as a faction, my Saga of the beast book which i bought all of three months ago is rendered largely pointless now.

So glad I keep feeding GW my hard earned....nom nom