We was made ta fight an’ win! - 9th Edition Ork Tactics

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**Tomsug**

Jidmah wrote:
So, looking at our HQ choices, I guess the top choices for my buggy líst are...

Thrakka and Badrukk in a trukk?

Mega Big Meg with Tellyportblasta to jump out of Morks belly to shoot down unprotected injured characters.....

**Blackie**

Standard Warboss is cheap and good enough to be justified in a mechanized list, just give him a ride with some boyz.

Big mek with KFF is decent for giving the 5++ to a second wagon (since Forktress is one use only) and to all the embarked models once they abandon the transport, while the Big Mek in Megarmor with KFF and Da Kleverest Boss isn't trash either.

**DrGiggles**

The 'Look Out Sir' nerf just means I will have to run a 6 man unit of Kanz to hide my KFF now. At least the 5++ should help them survive turn one.

**Vineheart01**

Yeah ive been having that issue a LOT lately where i got 10-20pts lying around i simply cant use.
Wagon has bigshootas already, axing the bigshootas still doesnt let me bring anything.

Thats...like the only real options in the codex atm aside from more bodies. But more bodies break transport limits, so thats a nogo, and not enough points for another squad.
So annoying. And i thought it was annoying in 8th having 2-6pts lying around i couldnt use.

**Jidmah**

DrGiggles wrote:
The 'Look Out Sir' nerf just means I will have to run a 6 man unit of Kanz to hide my KFF now. At least the 5++ should help them survive turn one.

Make it 5 kanz. You don't want plasma kannons and battlecannons getting 3 hits against your kanz, believe me...

**Lysit**

Vineheart01 wrote:
Yeah ive been having that issue a LOT lately where i got 10-20pts lying around i simply cant use.
Wagon has bigshootas already, axing the bigshootas still doesnt let me bring anything.

Depending on your list I've been using the odd points to upgrade trukks big shootas to rokkit launchas.
However I run deathskullz so they have an ok chance of doing something from time to time.

**DrGiggles**

Jidmah wrote:
DrGiggles wrote:
The 'Look Out Sir' nerf just means I will have to run a 6 man unit of Kanz to hide my KFF now. At least the 5++ should help them survive turn one.

Make it 5 kanz. You don't want plasma kannons and battlecannons getting 3 hits against your kanz, believe me...

That's a good point, thanks.

**Vineheart01**

Lysit wrote:
Vineheart01 wrote:
Yeah ive been having that issue a LOT lately where i got 10-20pts lying around i simply cant use.
Wagon has bigshootas already, axing the bigshootas still doesnt let me bring anything.

Depending on your list I've been using the odd points to upgrade trukks big shootas to rokkit launchas.
However I run deathskullz so they have an ok chance of doing something from time to time.

Would normally do that automatically but orks cant have nice things: thats a Legends option now.

**tulun**

Oh man.. if Deathskull Trukks could get full re-roll rockets, that would be the best.

**Jidmah**

Lysit wrote:
Vineheart01 wrote:
Yeah ive been having that issue a LOT lately where i got 10-20pts lying around i simply cant use.
Wagon has bigshootas already, axing the bigshootas still doesnt let me bring anything.

Depending on your list I've been using the odd points to upgrade trukks big shootas to rokkit launchas.
However I run deathskullz so they have an ok chance of doing something from time to time.

That's no longer an option.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Vineheart01 wrote:
Would normally do that automatically but orks cant have nice things: thats a Legends option now.

Actually, it's not. You simply aren't allowed to upgrade the trukk gun anymore. Oh you bought the official rokkit upgrade sprue for that? Well, too bad, filthy xenos.

**RedNoak**

so what about two patrols? one with zadsnark as a semi warbossbiker with bíggest boss and one as buggy deathskullz spam?

could bring the bonebreaka with forktress (maybe some meganbobz?) in the evil sunz list and the gunwagon as deathskullz

**Jidmah**

I really don't see much reason to do that, you lose 2 CP for almost no gain. The power of the biker warboss came from carrying the killa klaw, he also is locked into the ES trait, so Zardsnark cannot be used in the same way you were using the biker warboss.

That said, if you have already committed yourself to ES, you might as well bring a weirdboy and buff your gunwagon with visions in the smoke.

**tulun**

Jidmah wrote:
I really don't see much reason to do that, you lose 2 CP for almost no gain. The power of the biker warboss came from carrying the killa klaw, he also is locked into the ES trait, so Zardsnark cannot be used in the same way you were using the biker warboss.

That said, if you have already committed yourself to ES, you might as well bring a weirdboy and buff your gunwagon with visions in the smoke.

If you swap the Klaw to a MA Big Mek or something though, Da Rippa for 100 points isn't terrible... it's just a definite down grade. He can get Da Biggest boss for 6 attacks at least, though. But yeah. He won't blender everything anymore. Hell, transhuman will make him laughably weak, he only kills like maybe 2-3 intercessors.

I was chatting with a buddy of mine about the gunwagon +weirdboy.

Honestly? I sort of feel like for that 250 point investment, with a chance to have the power fail / be denied, I'd rather pay 20 more points and take 3 KBB.

Consistent 18 shots, 3 rerolls to hit and wound, and the main loss is 1 strength. Also the buggies aren't totally immobile. Get a CP back, too, for not taking a kustom job.

**tneva82**

Got to face ghaz himself. Bit tough matchup as i got first turn and had perfect tarpit for ghaz(2++ wraiths. Sure every 1 kills 45pts wraith but 2++) but damn that thing gave me good scare. On bigger games could see it doing better. Now since he went and charged my wraiths with ghaz i got better in objectives(to be fair second game for him).

Only reason i got near killing was　he had missed painboy stratagem doesn't work in tinheads mob and declined offer to change to goff detachment.

Got to paint ghaz myself

**some bloke**

There's a taktik that I was employing through 8th, which I thought I would share with the group as it may still hold water in 9th, and that was having sacrificial transports.

Eary in 8th, I was running battlewagons, and trying to kill my opponents anti-tank off, and then getting beat as the anti-infantry killed my boys when they were finally turfed out.

I then switched it up and focussed on their anti-infantry. The opponents often commented, when I'd killed their anti-chaff, that they would have gone for their anti-tank, as all I had were vehicles. But then he blew up a couple of wagons, and the boys spilled out, and he realised he had no way to deal with them.

So my Taktik is to start mech, then switch to chaff when the anti-chaff is dead (assuming you're given the option!)

Anyone else play like this?

**tneva82**

Interesting idea and i can see logic behind it. Definitely worth a try

**Wakshaani**

Vineheart01 wrote:

Also, the scoring additional hits blurb...
"If a hit roll scores additional hits, those additional hits
do not benefit from any other rule that triggered on
the original attack’s hit roll."

Uh...does this mean you cant use any rules at all for additional hits? Or did they word this really, really badly to mean you cant generate from generated attacks?

They generate extra attacks or hits, without special rules.

The big thing this hits is Death Guard flails, which were getting situations where Death to the False Emperor (more attacks on a 6) would first trigger extra hits from the flail rule, then those extra attacks could generate even *more* flail hits. This puts that back in the can.

I can't think of anything Orky that this impacts off the top of my head.

**Jidmah**

some bloke wrote:
There's a taktik that I was employing through 8th, which I thought I would share with the group as it may still hold water in 9th, and that was having sacrificial transports.

Eary in 8th, I was running battlewagons, and trying to kill my opponents anti-tank off, and then getting beat as the anti-infantry killed my boys when they were finally turfed out.

I then switched it up and focussed on their anti-infantry. The opponents often commented, when I'd killed their anti-chaff, that they would have gone for their anti-tank, as all I had were vehicles. But then he blew up a couple of wagons, and the boys spilled out, and he realised he had no way to deal with them.

So my Taktik is to start mech, then switch to chaff when the anti-chaff is dead (assuming you're given the option!)

Anyone else play like this?

When I think about it, this is basically how I ran my battle wagon bash in 5th and 6th. So, yes it makes a lot of sense, especially anti-chaff has a tendency to be infantry-based so you are also taking away your opponent's ability to score or perform actions.

**Vineheart01**

Wakshaani wrote:
Vineheart01 wrote:

Also, the scoring additional hits blurb...
"If a hit roll scores additional hits, those additional hits
do not benefit from any other rule that triggered on
the original attack’s hit roll."

Uh...does this mean you cant use any rules at all for additional hits? Or did they word this really, really badly to mean you cant generate from generated attacks?

They generate extra attacks or hits, without special rules.

The big thing this hits is Death Guard flails, which were getting situations where Death to the False Emperor (more attacks on a 6) would first trigger extra hits from the flail rule, then those extra attacks could generate even *more* flail hits. This puts that back in the can.

I can't think of anything Orky that this impacts off the top of my head.

That makes sense.

The interpretation i had was the new attacks had NO rules, as in even deathskull rerolls wouldnt affect them.
Which given the amount of bullcrap hitting orks lately i wouldnt put it behind GW to do that. That would maaaaasively hurt deathskullz and even badmoonz/goffs.

**Jidmah**

Wakshaani wrote:
Vineheart01 wrote:

Also, the scoring additional hits blurb...
"If a hit roll scores additional hits, those additional hits
do not benefit from any other rule that triggered on
the original attack’s hit roll."

Uh...does this mean you cant use any rules at all for additional hits? Or did they word this really, really badly to mean you cant generate from generated attacks?

They generate extra attacks or hits, without special rules.

The big thing this hits is Death Guard flails, which were getting situations where Death to the False Emperor (more attacks on a 6) would first trigger extra hits from the flail rule, then those extra attacks could generate even *more* flail hits. This puts that back in the can.

I can't think of anything Orky that this impacts off the top of my head.

The flail is not affected at all by this - DotFE generates extra ATTACKS and the flail rule tells you to make d3 hit rolls for each attack. As with all similar rules, it has the "these attacks cannot generate further attacks" clause, so it can't go infinite but it could generate up to 3d3 additional hits per attack.

Basically, they just re-implemented a fix that was already in place for 8th, a rule that handles things like "on a hit roll of 6, improve this attack's AP by one" or "on a hit roll of 6, this attack deals a mortal wound" by clarifying that the extra hit indeed does not count as having rolled a 6 and therefore does not get improved.
Extra ATTACKS like Goff, DakkaDakkaDakka or Dreaded Death Machine are not affected in any way.

**Wakshaani**

Jidmah wrote:
Wakshaani wrote:
Vineheart01 wrote:

Also, the scoring additional hits blurb...
"If a hit roll scores additional hits, those additional hits
do not benefit from any other rule that triggered on
the original attack’s hit roll."

Uh...does this mean you cant use any rules at all for additional hits? Or did they word this really, really badly to mean you cant generate from generated attacks?

They generate extra attacks or hits, without special rules.

The big thing this hits is Death Guard flails, which were getting situations where Death to the False Emperor (more attacks on a 6) would first trigger extra hits from the flail rule, then those extra attacks could generate even *more* flail hits. This puts that back in the can.

I can't think of anything Orky that this impacts off the top of my head.

The flail is not affected at all by this - DotFE generates extra ATTACKS and the flail rule tells you to make d3 hit rolls for each attack. As with all similar rules, it has the "these attacks cannot generate further attacks" clause, so it can't go infinite but it could generate up to 3d3 additional hits per attack.

Basically, they just re-implemented a fix that was already in place for 8th, a rule that handles things like "on a hit roll of 6, improve this attack's AP by one" or "on a hit roll of 6, this attack deals a mortal wound" by clarifying that the extra hit indeed does not count as having rolled a 6 and therefore does not get improved.
Extra ATTACKS like Goff, DakkaDakkaDakka or Dreaded Death Machine are not affected in any way.

That's the thing... with the new rule from the FAQ, those extra attacks that are generated from DttFE do *not* get the flail rules to make a D3 hit rolls.

So, you get it for the first volley, then the extra attacks don't get the D3, they only get 1 swing.

It's not to stop infinite attacks, it's to stop that shotgun-style explosion from the bonus attack.

**tneva82**

Except as he said faq only speaks about extra hits. Special rule doesn't grant extra hits.

**popisdead**

Elfric wrote:I've had pretty good success with small squads of 5 man Kommandos and Stormboyz. I think big units are out for now

Are you taking several 5-man units of Stormboyz? or 10-man?

**gungo**

I wouldn’t take evil suns just for zhardsnark but he’s a good value HQ at 100pts.. his biggest issue was he was easy to kill and the t6, +1 wound plus 4++ fixes that.

Luckily evil suns helps other units such as mega nobs or da jumped boys make assault ranges..
And visions is useful not just on da boomer but any vehicle even kans/Mek guns or shooty dreads.... So there is some helpful theme toward an evil suns list...
But as others have said it’s likely not worth the 2cp unless you want to build a specific type of deepstrike assault list.

Honestly I’m sure his datasheet will change in the near future so who knows..

**Jidmah**

Wakshaani wrote:
That's the thing... with the new rule from the FAQ, those extra attacks that are generated from DttFE do *not* get the flail rules to make a D3 hit rolls.

So, you get it for the first volley, then the extra attacks don't get the D3, they only get 1 swing.

It's not to stop infinite attacks, it's to stop that shotgun-style explosion from the bonus attack.

No, that's not "the thing". You are just plain wrong.

Page 363 – Rare Rules
Add the following sub-section:
SCORING ADDITIONAL HITS
When a model makes an attack, some rules will let that attack
score one or more additional hits on a particular hit roll (e.g.
‘each time an attack is made with this weapon, an unmodified
hit roll of 6 scores 1 additional hit’). If the attacking model is
also benefiting from any other rules that trigger on a particular
hit roll (e.g. ‘each time an attack is made with this weapon,
an unmodified hit roll of 6 automatically wounds the target’),
then only the original attack benefits from those rules. If any
additional hits are scored as the result of a particular hit roll,
those additional hits are not considered to have been made with
any hit roll – they simply hit the target and you must continue
the attack sequence for them (i.e. make a wound roll).
If a hit roll scores additional hits, those additional hits
do not benefit from any other rule that triggered on
the original attack’s hit roll.

Color for emphasis. This rule does not apply to additional attacks.

**RedNoak**

eehhhmm can zhad charge after he advanced?

**tulun**

RedNoak wrote:
eehhhmm can zhad charge after he advanced?

No. Not from his aura, anyway.

**Grimskul**

tulun wrote:
RedNoak wrote:
eehhhmm can zhad charge after he advanced?

No. Not from his aura, anyway.

Yeah, FW didn't update his WAAAGH! rule to include bikers. We'll see when FW rereleases the Indices if that's fixed or not, but I wouldn't be holding my breath.

**Singleton Mosby**

One positive thing we can take from the faq (although I will really miss my bikerboss); the Chinork Rattler cannon is still zero points. Thus the Chinork is a viable transport. Although the new look out sire rule means you can't protect them with a KFF Mek anymore, they are still amazing as deepstriking transports with bustas or nobs.

**Grimskul**

Singleton Mosby wrote:
One positive thing we can take from the faq (although I will really miss my bikerboss); the Chinork Rattler cannon is still zero points. Thus the Chinork is a viable transport. Although the new look out sire rule means you can't protect them with a KFF Mek anymore, they are still amazing as deepstriking transports with bustas or nobs.

True, though one thing you have to remember that I almost forgot from other games is that unlike trukks, since they have the aircraft keyword, they can't perform any actions with regards to objectives. And if anything, they might be in an even worse spot than the Warboss on Bike, since the Chinork hasn't been available on the store for a long time.