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So CK3 is coming out next week, and the videos and previews have been piling up.
They unleashed it on a pile of youtubers today, but helpfully provided a playlist, plus their own playthrough in spain, and various brief tip videos talking about individual features.

Paradox, Iberian Intrigue Playthrough (incest and murder warnings):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_wKAvyPJ5M&list=PL_3rLv22kp6RiRZHdxcPeqtNGu593kZ3h

Introducing CK3 series (tips and explanations, in absurdly brief overviews):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26vR8IdZmGQ&list=PL_3rLv22kp6T7YGF35GcXgqE7814GTUUm

Sponsored youtubers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=289TqIqDLJQ&list=PL_3rLv22kp6TJGpYqtG0HHuq7phA0slJT
(including the Spiffing Brit's immediate exploits video, among others).

Downside to the play-throughs is Spain gets a bit over-exposed.
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It looks good. I like the new UI and more options to accomplish tasks, bring in other people, and a general rise in clarity.
CK2 was the big paradox game that I never managed to get into, and 3 seems to solve a lot of my issues. As a bonus it doesn't seem to immediately devolve into the spreadsheet simulator of Imperator or Stellaris. And obviously isn't suffering from EUIV's current state of overdevelopment and revision.

Despite ending up owning most of it from bundles years after release, I too have never got on with CK2. I can see the fun and appeal but when playing it I could never find the fun moment. It also always felt like it never had a comfortable speed. I always felt like one some speeds nothing was happening, but tip it too far and suddenly everything is happening too fast. Which made me feel that it would have been better turn based rather than real time.

I suspect a poor tutorial didn't help, but it also had some things that just felt messy.


Stellaris was a breath of fresh air to me with their system. I hope CK3 might revise many of my niggles and provide a more inviting and fun way to get on with the game through a better interface and some revised mechanics. Fingers crossed it does well.

That was basically my beef with CK2. (I'm not entirely sure it changed later, to be honest, some of it may have). But most of my memories of CK2 involve twiddling my thumbs and waiting for the random number generator to grant me fabricated claims.

I was also often playing with small nobles, so alliances were often declined with no real way to influence decisions.

The hook and scheme systems in 3 seems to get around a lot of the passivity.

The game could be troublesome like that, with you standing back and waiting for a claim to go through, while your current targets of opportunity all got picked up by someone else.


As for CK3 -

A lot of fans are a bit wary after the Imperator mess. But a lot of potential players also seem to think that the gameplay sections that have been revealed look a lot better than what was shown of Imperator during its pre-release. As a result, players are generally feeling optimistic.

Eumerin wrote:
The game could be troublesome like that, with you standing back and waiting for a claim to go through, while your current targets of opportunity all got picked up by someone else.


As for CK3 -

A lot of fans are a bit wary after the Imperator mess. But a lot of potential players also seem to think that the gameplay sections that have been revealed look a lot better than what was shown of Imperator during its pre-release. As a result, players are generally feeling optimistic.

Yeah, basically. Imperator threw a lot of red flags for me when I was watching the lead developer do a stream and answer questions. Johann got caught up in cheesing a weird settlement/migration exploit for German tribes (which was a very weird thing to show off, rather than game-as-intended in Rome or Carthage), and when asked what the point of the game was, he vaguely gestured and said something about painting the map. And that was it. He then went back to declaring unwinnable wars that he could just peace out of after stealing pops against AIs that couldn't find their way to his terra incognita territory and dealing with problematic areas that he as lead developer was aware of, but apparently wasn't making any move to fix.

The CK3 stuff I've seen so far has done a lot with intrigue, schemes, favors, alliances, wars, and all sorts of other ways of creating and achieving goals. It looks a lot better, and a lot more complete. Religion and culture seems to actually have game effects (for example), and fairly complex situations seem to arise naturally as the game goes on.

I don't expect it to be perfect, but it doesn't seem to be about just watching numbers tick to the next spending threshold.

The game will be available tomorow at 6pm CEST worldwide. No preloads.

Initial reviews are out, and look good. This includes reviews from reviewers who didn't like Imperator.

Yeah, I'm watching a livestream of it now- just a straight playthrough, no gimmicks or weirdness.

https://www.twitch.tv/quill18

Prior to actually starting the game, he went through a Q/A and walkthrough of the various screens and systems. I missed part of it, but the twitch VOD should be up for a good while.

The accessibility/readability of the game looks really good.
The perks system in particular seems to open up and support different playstyles

I'm just waiting for the patch notes.

 LunarSol wrote:
I'm just waiting for the patch notes.

Always a possible problem. Though the good reviews suggest that there aren't any game breaking bugs.

Eumerin wrote:

 LunarSol wrote:
I'm just waiting for the patch notes.

Always a possible problem. Though the good reviews suggest that there aren't any game breaking bugs.

I'm referring to how wildly entertaining the patch notes for CK2 were out of context.

Well maybe not any super game breaking bugs so far. But watching the Spiffing Brit exploit the game already was highly entertaining to watch.

I have tried to get into CK2 but found it daunting when I had other stuff to play. However everything I'm seeing from CK3 tells me I might just want to jump into it.

 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
Well maybe not any super game breaking bugs so far.

Haven't seen any real bugs on stream, but did see some notification weirdness on Quill's livestream, but not sure how much of that was user error (missing messages, as streaming is inherently distracting). One war resolution was weird, as he lost territory to his liege in a war that he wasn't involved in.


Anyway, currently downloading (though I had to restart both my system and my router, as the download speed was inexplicably in kilobytes). The download is only 1.8 GB, but unpacks to about 5, which is smaller than I expected.

Known issues (so far, short list):
https://www.crusaderkings.com/news/important-information?utm_source=stcom-owned&utm_medium=social-owned&utm_content=post&utm_campaign=crki3_ck_20200817_cawe_dd


Interesting mix of achievements
This is listed as Hard:
End of an Era- Play until 1453 (the game's end date).

This is very hard (and probably disturbing):


And of course, Ireland is Tutorial Island.... which is honestly kind of crap. Its a lot of popup windows going over game concepts, but aside from briefly explaining what some of the various UI elements do, it basically teaches you how to right click on characters, get married, start schemes and declare war. That's it.

Certain religions encourage relationships that would mesh well with that achievement, iirc.

Eumerin wrote:
Certain religions encourage relationships that would mesh well with that achievement, iirc.

Yeah, well. My tutorial game went off in a weird direction. My first character died to a poor treatment to illness, and his son took over. His wife was discovered having an affair... with her father. So she was imprisoned, and then banished (and now she's in Iceland, imprisoned again). Her kids are a treacherous villain and dishonorable villain (sadistic and callous respectively)

His second wife is amazing. Digilent, Temperate, Zealous, Conscientious Scribe, Quick (which is inheritable), Herbalist, Wise Woman and Scholar. She's given bonus stat points to my character and members of the council as she teaches people how to do their jobs better. Unfortunately, none of her 3 kids have inherited quick.

That's some super inbreeding for that achievement
In CK2, some religions (I think Zoroastrian and Messalian) allowed and encouraged "divine blood" marriages (i.e. marrying brothers and sisters). If that's the same in CK3, you'd have to play with one of these religions for at least three generations to have so few ancestors.

 Tiennos wrote:
That's some super inbreeding for that achievement
In CK2, some religions (I think Zoroastrian and Messalian) allowed and encouraged "divine blood" marriages (i.e. marrying brothers and sisters). If that's the same in CK3, you'd have to play with one of these religions for at least three generations to have so few ancestors.

I'm not sure its required, honestly. There seems to be quite a lot of incest going on at the moment. My cousins got involved as well- this dynasty is honestly pretty wild.

My daughter picked up an interest in dueling, to the point that one of my mayors came complaining she beat him up. To discourage her, I challenged her to a duel... and lost, and later she ended up killing one of the mayors, and is known a known murderer.
Her mother eventually got free of prison in Iceland, and ended up in Hungary as the knight of some noble or another (with a new husband and son), and wounded, despite being a known incestuous adulterer (as well as a gluttonous sadist), and is now a guest in the Danelaw, which encompasses England, Denmark and bits and pieces of other realms.

This game needs an 'adventurer mode.' Following the lives of various non-titled people would be fascinating.


And... King of Ireland now. Need to clean up a bit (no idea how the Kingdom of Alba gained Athlong in the center of Ireland), but it only took 25 years to gain the title.
Ooo. And it allows for switching the election laws to Tanistry (an Elective form that bounces around the dynasty (voters favor older members, distant from the current ruler, and can elect women)

Voss wrote:

 Tiennos wrote:
That's some super inbreeding for that achievement
In CK2, some religions (I think Zoroastrian and Messalian) allowed and encouraged "divine blood" marriages (i.e. marrying brothers and sisters). If that's the same in CK3, you'd have to play with one of these religions for at least three generations to have so few ancestors.

I'm not sure its required, honestly. There seems to be quite a lot of incest going on at the moment. My cousins got involved as well- this dynasty is honestly pretty wild.

To have the same two parents/grandparents/great-grandparents, cousins aren't enough. You have to have kids with your brother or sister. Of course, you can always try to seduce your siblings and have children out of wedlock, but it makes things a bit harder for the succession. Also, the kids won't be pretty!

I haven't messed with it very much, but it seems you can reform all religions now. Maybe you can create your own catholic heresy where you can marry your siblings. The pope will be thrilled!

 Tiennos wrote:

Voss wrote:

 Tiennos wrote:
That's some super inbreeding for that achievement
In CK2, some religions (I think Zoroastrian and Messalian) allowed and encouraged "divine blood" marriages (i.e. marrying brothers and sisters). If that's the same in CK3, you'd have to play with one of these religions for at least three generations to have so few ancestors.

I'm not sure its required, honestly. There seems to be quite a lot of incest going on at the moment. My cousins got involved as well- this dynasty is honestly pretty wild.

To have the same two parents/grandparents/great-grandparents, cousins aren't enough. You have to have kids with your brother or sister. Of course, you can always try to seduce your siblings and have children out of wedlock, but it makes things a bit harder for the succession. Also, the kids won't be pretty!

Oh, I'm aware. But the inclination to incest seems pretty high by default. And there is a perk in the intrigue/seduction tree which eliminates the penalties to attraction, even for incest. So it isn't as difficult as it could be. And if you can get the right inheritable traits in there, the kids will be perfectly pretty.

I haven't messed with it very much, but it seems you can reform all religions now. Maybe you can create your own catholic heresy where you can marry your siblings. The pope will be thrilled!

You definitely can. I haven't messed with religious reform yet, but there are a lot of toggles for what behaviors are accepted/shunned/criminal. Marrying close kin is in there.

Well, if you can then you'd better get some good genetic traits in there first. Again, I'm basing it on CK2 since I haven't played enough to get it in 3 yet, but the "inbred" trait was brutal (-5 to ALL stats and negatives to health and fertility). It was hard to keep a dynasty going once that was in the gene-pool...

I think the standard practice for zoroastrian rulers in that game was to marry your sister and have as many bastards as possible on the side, then legitimize the best ones and push them up the succession line. You knew from the start that the "official" kids would be hopeless

Was hoping for some help on this one. I ve become King of Scotland and I am married to the Queen of the Isles. She is from a different house. Because of that, it’s not letting me legitimise our bastard son and he’s the only one I’ve got left after the rest got killed. I really don’t want a nephew taking over. Is there any way around this?

 Totalwar1402 wrote:
Was hoping for some help on this one. I ve become King of Scotland and I am married to the Queen of the Isles. She is from a different house. Because of that, it’s not letting me legitimise our bastard son and he’s the only one I’ve got left after the rest got killed. I really don’t want a nephew taking over. Is there any way around this?

Chage inheritance laws maybee?

 Totalwar1402 wrote:
Was hoping for some help on this one. I ve become King of Scotland and I am married to the Queen of the Isles. She is from a different house. Because of that, it’s not letting me legitimise our bastard son and he’s the only one I’ve got left after the rest got killed. I really don’t want a nephew taking over. Is there any way around this?

You should have options to denounce and disinherit people of your dynasty if you are the current dynasty head. If you're not, then you'll probably have to do some murdering.

 Totalwar1402 wrote:
Was hoping for some help on this one. I ve become King of Scotland and I am married to the Queen of the Isles. She is from a different house. Because of that, it’s not letting me legitimise our bastard son and he’s the only one I’ve got left after the rest got killed. I really don’t want a nephew taking over. Is there any way around this?

I take it the kid happened before the marriage and you didn't acknowledge it at the time?

Because its her kid and she rules separately, the kid is in her court, that's probably why you can't legitimize it- there are limits to what you can do with other people's courtiers and vassals.

It might also be a religious doctrine- there is a section under marriage for 'Bastardry' which include None (all kids are legitimate), Legitimization or No Legitimization. That last option is pretty rare, however. None of the default religions in that area (at least at the 867 start, didn't check 1066) should have that doctrine. Heresies, maybe.


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Automatically Appended Next Post:

Finally got around to a mainland Europe Christian playthrough. It turned weird ( in a lot of ways).
Started as the Count of Lombardy, with the goal of becoming Duke. This turned out to be a little more difficult than I expected, but managed it. But along the way...

It turns out, pre-game my character was the lover of the wife of the Kingdom of Italy. This caused some friction (and brief imprisonment). The second daughter was probably mine, but never acknowledged. Her son became the King of Italy.

Along came a chance to seduce the first daugher, so... out of pure spite (because of the imprisonment), I did. Despite her being a nun and outside the line of inheritance. Four kids later (2 unacknowledged, though I've no idea why) and I've got a grand total of 7 'official' children, though 2 are bastards.
3 boys and 2 girls by my wife, 2 by my lover (the nun, who has at this point acquired 12 additional traits)- the latter kids were named after the king I cuckolded, because there was still some spite.

The sons all died in wars (particularly the war over Trent, which was my last piece for the Dukedom, and a huge pain- lots of mercs and allies made it messy)

A bit later (after the Holy Crusade against England (lots of Norse)), called by a paranoid, cynical, sadistic 'Godless Villain' of a pope (elected at the age of _18_), my character died.

My heir is the daughter of my firstborn son (who, I was glad died, because statwise he was awful), which he had married off to the mayor of Pisa. Two kids, officially 'lowborn.'
Because there are so many other daughters, they all become countesses. Pisa, Cremona, Pavia and Trent are each held by an aunt, and Como by a cousin (also a countess).
That sounds hellish, the only the bastards and the cousin really dislike me. The one that got married off to an Irish high chief is now back (he lost his throne, or rather his son did, who she also married), and she's a drunkard and 'best friend' to my new character. Also the spymaster, with an Intrigue of 22.

My new Duchess also gets Mantua by way of her mother, so that marriage paid off.

The duchess' sister is the Primary heir, and because she's married to a Baron, the title will fall out of my dynasty. So murder is on the menu. But the chance of killing her husband is too low, so I go after mine, thinking at 26, I can produce some proper heirs. Twins are born, and properly of my dynasty, so that isn't an issue, but I 'forget' to cancel the murder scheme.

Remarry matrilinearly to a Giant, Genius of a man.
There are currently 10 living members of the dynasty, all female, and 10 additional kids in different dynasties due to standard marriages.

Its going to get real confusing since the aunt's range from 29 to 10, the cousins generation from 13 to 1, and the children and nephews 7 to 0 years old. And since some are bastards or the children of bastards, intermarriage may be a way to bring them back into the dynasty.

Oh, yes. And the Kingdom of Italy no longer exists. Verona and Friuli were taken by East Francia, the rest by West Francia. Though Provence and Savoy are their own Dukedoms, and Lotharingia exists (along with some breakaway states in the north.
But the former King of Italy is now a Count, and has one of the last De Jure counties under the Dukedom of Lombardy.... but keep in my he's probably the son of the (probably) illegitimate daughter of my first character. So sort of a cousin?