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Azyr does list building just fine, so they Can do it, they just chose to not use their functioning version they already had and designed a new app from the ground up instead.

KillerAngel wrote:
Has anyone tried accessing the same app account from multiple devices simultaneously? I'm thinking of making a single account for the playgroup and having all codices we buy added to that one account so we can all reference them. Just want to make sure that's doable.

Also, despite all you doom and gloomers, this app has real potential. It's certainly not worth the $5/mo yet, but once they get their issues straightened and implement additional capabilities, I see it becoming worth it. If Crusade OoBs and content is added to the future List Builder, that would help immensely. Being able to split the cost across multiple people for a single account will also help. So I have hope for the future.

I agree. One day it might almost be worth as much as Battlescribe!

@KillerAngel Hope for the future is ALL you have. There is a saying. Hope in one hand, gak in the other. See which one fills up first.

It's GW we are talking about. They don't have the track record to deserve your hope.

I'm working in business of developing software. Not once in the last decade was I paid for the "potential" of my work.

Currently the app is not worth it's money, and I would be surprised if sharing an account wasn't violating the terms&conditions of the app - which will likely cause GW to close your account and your group losing access to all their digital content permantently.

Assuming they don't ban 1 user using it on multiple device himself....they can't really stop multiple　using same account　unless you flat out tell them yourself

are the Codex files available offline or do you need an internet connection each time you oben the app?

 kodos wrote:
are the Codex files available offline or do you need an internet connection each time you oben the app?

Was available offline once downloaded for me

An app should be able to tell which account was used to download it. A single mywarhammer account being used from vastly different devices with different accounts is not too difficult to identify. Preventing account sharing is not a unique problem and has been solved by others.

That said, one of the players posting about this on a public forum or on facebook might get GWs attention, as would a person with malicious intend (ex-partner, person booted from the group) outright telling them.

Ah, classic Dakka pessimism at it's finest. It's been a while so let me just bask it in real quick............. okay.

Breton wrote:

KillerAngel wrote:
this app has real potential.

Its not the potential people are dismissing, it's the implementation.

No, people are very definitely dismissing it's potential based purely on it's current implementation. Case in point:

Breton wrote:

GW wants to do it, they just don't want to put enough effort and work in to do it right.

Talk about a hyperbolic and groundless assumption.

AdmiralHalsey wrote:
I agree. One day it might almost be worth as much as Battlescribe!

I'm a huge supporter and user of Battlescribe. It leaves some to be desired. Great free resource, but I could see an official app surpassing it to where it might have monetary value to support it's use.

Jidmah wrote:I'm working in business of developing software. Not once in the last decade was I paid for the "potential" of my work.

I'm sorry to hear that, I get paid for my work potential all the time, but that's because I work hard to forge good client relationships with proven delivery. That is where GW has failed thus fair. Doesn't mean I'm not liking the (admittedly slow) steps on improvement. Part of strategic vision is seeing potential in things others don't, but the risk is you're wrong and look like a pile of gak. It's the internet, so I'm willing to take the risk Just not yet with my own money.

Jidmah wrote:Currently the app is not worth it's money, and I would be surprised if sharing an account wasn't violating the terms&conditions of the app - which will likely cause GW to close your account and your group losing access to all their digital content permantently.

I agree, it's not currently worth any money. Also I did read the T&C, and it does stipulate one user per account. Sure, it's a risk, thought I've never had an issue with it before. I very much doubt they care about 5 people accessing the same app account, what they care about is mass unauthorized distribution.

I also didn't miss the fact the no one answered my question, instead felt the need to jump all over anyone expressing any hint of optimism.

 Jidmah wrote:
An app should be able to tell which account was used to download it. A single mywarhammer account being used from vastly different devices with different accounts is not too difficult to identify. Preventing account sharing is not a unique problem and has been solved by others.

Different devices but it would be the same account. Again, I just don't see why it's worth it to them to care.

 Jidmah wrote:

That said, one of the players posting about this on a public forum or on facebook might get GWs attention, as would a person with malicious intend (ex-partner, person booted from the group) outright telling them.

Maybe I'll go post on the official Fbook page and ask them directly.

Lance845 wrote:@KillerAngel Hope for the future is ALL you have. There is a saying. Hope in one hand, gak in the other. See which one fills up first.

It's GW we are talking about. They don't have the track record to deserve your hope.

I mean you're not wrong, but also not right. Just like the stock market, past performance doesn't guarentee future results. Doesn't mean we can't use past performance as an indicator however, but I haven't seen them try anything digital on this scale before. Maybe I'm wrong, I did take a long break between 5E and 8E, but here is why I have hope:
a) Digital content is essentially a solved problem, though implementation isn't easy and a companies' first foray into it will have teething issues. I have enough real world experience to see this firsthand on more than one occasion.
b) The hardest part of this app (in my mind) is what and how to effectively convey information to the user, and I don't think they went into it having solid plan. Things like searchable info is good feedback that I have no doubt they'll listen to, but clearly this is a "learn as we go" approach. So while I don't like all the pessimism, I grudgingly understand where it's coming from.
c) Things are improving, and the improvements look good. There are also enough good ideas out there on how to make it better, that all GW needs to do is listen to community feedback and craft something around what the community truly wants.
d) Because it's better than being pessimistic all the time?

Anyway, apologies for interrupting your clouds with a small ray of sunshine. Carry on.

Since when has GW ACTUALLY listened to community feedback? At best they misinterpret it and release something that changes the issue without actually addressing the underlying problems.

If someone sold me a bike that doesn't have wheels, but promised that if I pay a monthly abo now, in the future he will deliver the wheels I would not be a content person.

An army builder app without and army builder, which requires you to buy and carry all the rule books anyway, is to me a bike without wheels.

I do sports, your potential is less important then actual results. Your not going to have any scholarships or sponsorships for being promising, but never winning anything.

Lance845 wrote:Since when has GW ACTUALLY listened to community feedback? At best they misinterpret it and release something that changes the issue without actually addressing the underlying problems.

The real community or the Dakka community? To be fair, their balance fixes are hardly the best, but I consider this different. We're not balancing a set of multivariable equations, we're looking at technology features and functionality. Even GW can't screw this one up... or can they?

Karol wrote:If someone sold me a bike that doesn't have wheels, but promised that if I pay a monthly abo now, in the future he will deliver the wheels I would not be a content person.

An army builder app without and army builder, which requires you to buy and carry all the rule books anyway, is to me a bike without wheels.

Well it's a gak analogy, but to run with it (ha), no one is saying you should be happy with a bike frame and no wheels. What I'm saying, is that I'm liking how good the bike is looking, the suspension is rough but has promise with a few tweaks, and the seat is unreliable but can easily be fixed. Once the wheels show up, and assuming they aren't made of stone, could probably make a good bike worth paying for at that point.

Meanwhile, everyone else is pointing at a singlespeed beach cruiser (aka Battlescribe), and saying clearly GW's bike is rubbish because it ain't that. Sure, beach cruisers are fun and they work, but maybe GW is building something nicer?

Karol wrote:I do sports, your potential is less important then actual results. Your not going to have any scholarships or sponsorships for being promising, but never winning anything.

You're telling me no one ever got a scholarship based on their potential? Really? They don't care how good you are where your coming from, they care about how good you'll be when you get there. How many college studs go pro and fail, while underperformers that are diamonds in the rough become legends with good coaching?

KillerAngel wrote:

Lance845 wrote:Since when has GW ACTUALLY listened to community feedback? At best they misinterpret it and release something that changes the issue without actually addressing the underlying problems.

The real community or the Dakka community?

Either. It's only been the last couple years that there have even been avenues for the community to actually communicate with GW that wasn't ignored or met with being shut down via email. If GW was actually interested in hearing from the community their community articles would have a comments section. They would host their own forum. And they would put more then interns on their facebook page. In the meantime they made positive changes from 7th to 8th and then spent the rest of 8th tanking any good faith that bought by making the game more bloated and complicated then ever.

How exactly do you think they are listening to the community?

Karol wrote:If someone sold me a bike that doesn't have wheels, but promised that if I pay a monthly abo now, in the future he will deliver the wheels I would not be a content person.

An army builder app without and army builder, which requires you to buy and carry all the rule books anyway, is to me a bike without wheels.

Well it's a gak analogy, but to run with it (ha), no one is saying you should be happy with a bike frame and no wheels. What I'm saying, is that I'm liking how good the bike is looking, the suspension is rough but has promise with a few tweaks, and the seat is unreliable but can easily be fixed. Once the wheels show up, and assuming they aren't made of stone, could probably make a good bike worth paying for at that point.

Meanwhile, everyone else is pointing at a singlespeed beach cruiser (aka Battlescribe), and saying clearly GW's bike is rubbish because it ain't that. Sure, beach cruisers are fun and they work, but maybe GW is building something nicer?

Karol wrote:I do sports, your potential is less important then actual results. Your not going to have any scholarships or sponsorships for being promising, but never winning anything.

You're telling me no one ever got a scholarship based on their potential? Really? They don't care how good you are where your coming from, they care about how good you'll be when you get there. How many college studs go pro and fail, while underperformers that are diamonds in the rough become legends with good coaching?

Here is the thing. "Probably" making a bike worth paying for is worse then a bike that works now. For any fault anyone might have with battlescribe, it works. It could be improved yeah, and if GW ever releases anything thats a good idea they probably will, faster and better then GW does. As it stands GW has released nothing worth having while putting a price tag on it. This is perfectly in line with GWs past efforts.

GW claimed they would have their bike ready by July 11. It's now October 10, 3 months later, and the bike still doesn't have wheels. It takes a special kind of "optimism" to look at that and say "well clearly this just means they're taking their time to build the best bike ever!" Especially when the bits delivered so far are of extremely varying quality and don't fit together.

 Lance845 wrote:
It's only been the last couple years that there have even been avenues for the community to actually communicate with GW that wasn't ignored or met with being shut down via email. If GW was actually interested in hearing from the community their community articles would have a comments section. They would host their own forum. And they would put more then interns on their facebook page. In the meantime they made positive changes from 7th to 8th and then spent the rest of 8th tanking any good faith that bought by making the game more bloated and complicated then ever.

Bold for emphasis, they are/have been better at listening, or so it would seem to me, a layman.
I disagree about implementing comment sections and a forum. It's hardly constructive, and usually more destructive. There is a difference between loud voices and community consensus, and I don't think forums have been good at community consensus for a long time now. Having a publicly visible repository of unconstructive criticism is probably bad for business, but that doesn't mean they don't care what we think. They have a big incentive to keep the community as a whole happy.
As for Facebook, I left that place a long while ago, for much the same reason.

 Lance845 wrote:
How exactly do you think they are listening to the community?

I'm entirely unqualified to answer that, only to say that I'm having more fun playing 40k now than I ever have. I'm not willing to get into the "does GW listen to the community" argument because it detracts from the point I was originally trying to make. If it makes you feel better, fine, GW sucks at listing to the community. You win.

Here is the thing. "Probably" making a bike worth paying for is worse then a bike that works now. For any fault anyone might have with battlescribe, it works. It could be improved yeah, and if GW ever releases anything thats a good idea they probably will, faster and better then GW does. As it stands GW has released nothing worth having while putting a price tag on it. This is perfectly in line with GWs past efforts.

I agree completely. It's not that I think the current app is good, it's that people are attacking the fact that I think it could be good. It has potential, I'm optimistic, and I'll defend that opinion. I would never say the existing app is worth $5/mo. I also don't agree Battlescribe will make anything close to the same quality as a potentially good GW app. That is not an attack on Battlescribe! I use it, and I love it.

yukishiro1 wrote:
GW claimed they would have their bike ready by July 11. It's now October 10, 3 months later, and the bike still doesn't have wheels. It takes a special kind of "optimism" to look at that and say "well clearly this just means they're taking their time to build the best bike ever!" Especially when the bits delivered so far are of extremely varying quality and don't fit together.

A very special type of Dakkanaut, I agree, but being disappointing at the pace of improvement and being optimistic about the future are not mutually exclusive. I too am disappointed that we don't have more yet, and I think anyone who has paid money to GW over the promise of a list builder should be reimbursed.

I came here to build a bridge. I mean... find out if I could access the app from multiple devices at the same time. Since no one seems to know, I'll report back once I get some of us together in the same place at the same time and find out for ourselves (assuming the app is working at that point ).

I guess if one person pays the sub for all of Dakka, the app might be proportionally worth the cost.

but here is why I have hope:
a) Digital content is essentially a solved problem, though implementation isn't easy and a companies' first foray into it will have teething issues. I have enough real world experience to see this firsthand on more than one occasion.

Digital content IS a solved problem, no 'essentially' about it.. And they _had_ not one, but two working solutions: bells and whistles Apple ibook version and stripped down 'not PDF' eReader version.
And now those are gone, and they have no solutions.

This is not a reason for hope.


The app provides nothing and solves nothing. Even if it had all its 'features,' it would still provide and solve nothing. They want a 'game as service' model because an upper manager heard those are easy money makers, but provide no reason to pay them money for nothing.

App is working for me now on Android

I had to log out and back in again though to access the necron codex as it was showing locked until then

The content needs to not be organized by publication (which it currently is).

It should be organized by edition/army/units-wargear-warlord traits-relics-stratagems with the parts of the army you don't have access to being greyed out/redacted because you don't have the relevant publication.

Clicking on/mousing over the greyed out/redacted content should both tell you the book you need and give you a link to purchase it.

So long as the app makes you dig through multiple books to get to your stuff it will be inferior to battlescribe. Which more or less means it will always be inferior to battlescribe. Because GW can't plan how to organize content for gak and you can be damn sure everyone is going to have multiple publications to dig through.

Battlescribe works because it's all laid out in the ways I need it for the task I need it for. The app doesn't give me easy access to anything.

Yeah that's why it's so hard to be optimistic. It's not like what they've got is well-executed and they're just missing a lot of stuff. What they've got is also mostly a disorganized mess, when the app is even working in the most basic of ways. Remember when it launched without an unsubscribe button? Lol...

t's like the app was made by people who have never played 40k and have no idea what is useful and what isn't. Which, come to think of it, is probably exactly what happened.

Doohicky wrote:
App is working for me now on Android

I had to log out and back in again though to access the necron codex as it was showing locked until then

mine is still not loading. I've shut and restarted the app but no joy, and restarted the phone itself.

I assume it'll drop in eventually.

The app transfers money from people to GW successfully, so as far as GW is concerned it's working fine.

beast_gts wrote:

Aash wrote:
Does the app update the rules with the latest FAQs and errata in the text of the rules or do you have to look up the faq itself?

In the text from what I can see - Retributor Squad has updated weapon profiles on their page for example.

Did they update the weapon profiles for any fw units? Since we never got an errata for fw I'm assuming the answer is "No", but I figure it doesn't hurt to ask.

So I redeemed my code for my Space Marine codex and was trying to use the app, but it's straight missing information that 100% should be there. Example would be the Agressor's Flamestorm Gauntlets and Auto Boltstorm Gauntlets. Neither one appears on the datasheet for them or in the weapon index.

 Mulletdude wrote:
So I redeemed my code for my Space Marine codex and was trying to use the app, but it's straight missing information that 100% should be there. Example would be the Agressor's Flamestorm Gauntlets and Auto Boltstorm Gauntlets. Neither one appears on the datasheet for them or in the weapon index.

You expected something else?

Well it's a gak analogy, but to run with it (ha), no one is saying you should be happy with a bike frame and no wheels. What I'm saying, is that I'm liking how good the bike is looking, the suspension is rough but has promise with a few tweaks, and the seat is unreliable but can easily be fixed. Once the wheels show up, and assuming they aren't made of stone, could probably make a good bike worth paying for at that point.

A bike without wheels, when you need to ride it does not look good. The thing does not have an army builder, but that is not all. It doesn't have all the rules you need to play, so even if you get a code from somewhere, you still need all the other books.

The just you wait thing doesn't work on me as an argument. I waited all 8th ed for GW to fix my army codex, and they did at the very end of it, then corona hit and now they are doing changes in 9th that make the army less fun to play again. Wait and see how good it will be, is not a policy I can support as far as GW goes.

You're telling me no one ever got a scholarship based on their potential? Really? They don't care how good you are where your coming from, they care about how good you'll be when you get there. How many college studs go pro and fail, while underperformers that are diamonds in the rough become legends with good coaching?

Well US is different, because you have that whole racial thing we do not have. But still it doesn't matter. Potential is not something the sponsors care about, unless you also have results. Yeah a regional winner will get a scholarship, a euro champ winner can get, well maybe not when the state runs out of money, an even better one and sponsors. Check how many sponsorship deals you get when you place as 6th or 7th for 3 years in younglins division or better yet what happens to your potential, if you break a leg or an arm.

KillerAngel wrote:

Breton wrote:

KillerAngel wrote:
this app has real potential.

Its not the potential people are dismissing, it's the implementation.

No, people are very definitely dismissing it's potential based purely on it's current implementation. Case in point:

Breton wrote:

GW wants to do it, they just don't want to put enough effort and work in to do it right.

Talk about a hyperbolic and groundless assumption.

I too like to snip a partial quote to "prove" my point. That must be how you get those customer relationships you bragged about. Absolutely "hyperbolic" to provide examples from GW's history of trying and failing with half-finished multiple attempts at this same thing.

 Mulletdude wrote:
So I redeemed my code for my Space Marine codex and was trying to use the app, but it's straight missing information that 100% should be there. Example would be the Agressor's Flamestorm Gauntlets and Auto Boltstorm Gauntlets. Neither one appears on the datasheet for them or in the weapon index.

Yeah, it doesn’t openly display the weapon profiles for any weapons that don’t cost points. You can do a search for the weapon by name and it’ll come up though. I Assume that’ll get changed since it’s apparently only the Marine Dex that does that, I’m told the Necron one displays all the weapons free or otherwise.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh, it also doesn’t list points costs for the Chapter Master ect upgrades. I was hoping it would have those since the paper book has two different costs for them in two different spots.

Breton wrote:

I too like to snip a partial quote to "prove" my point. That must be how you get those customer relationships you bragged about. Absolutely "hyperbolic" to provide examples from GW's history of trying and failing with half-finished multiple attempts at this same thing.

That's fair, I must have skimmed your part about GW doing this before, and I've never heard of them trying to do so. So apologies.

I would still argue that it doesn't prove their intent to "not put in the work." From my perspective, they're clearly trying to put in the work (where, to your point, maybe they hadn't in the past) and are having teething issues.

People are talking about "cycles" here.

This is the real gw cycle.

GW's policies and prices drive people away from buying their stuff.

GW makes even worse policies and raises prices.

Repeat.