Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

With the release of the new FW book's contents not having an entry for Shrikes, and them not being in Legends, it seems that Shrikes are officially dead.

When was the last time a unit was totally deleted with no way to re-use the models? It would have been the whole Mycetic Spore/Chapter House debacle, right?

 BaconCatBug wrote:
With the release of the new FW book's contents not having an entry for Shrikes, and them not being in Legends, it seems that Shrikes are officially dead.

When was the last time a unit was totally deleted with no way to re-use the models? It would have been the whole Mycetic Spore/Chapter House debacle, right?

Anything not on the books table of contents is supposed to be going to legends according to GW. So if you don't see it in the book, you'll have a terrible and almost immediately outdated legends entry soon enough

* If a unit exists but doesn’t have a datasheet in this book, don’t worry! It will be getting a Warhammer Legends datasheet so that you can continue to use it in your games.

That's from the article today. Where the table of contents is from.

There's a lot of stuff missing. The Legends bit for this stuff has not been posted.

These are the Winged Nid Warriors, yes?

Could also be a sign that Nids are the mystery Xenos Codex for January, and a full kit will be coming.

Only speculation like, but not exactly pie in the sky speculation.

Honestly I'm not surprised. FW is doing the same as GW and if it hasn't got a model it doesn't have rules.

It's a pain, but at the same time Shrieks have been one of those models stuck in limbo for a long while. I was surprised when they re-did the hive tyrant to have wings, but didn't re-do the warriors to include wings as well.

That said they are a model that might one day reappear in another form; perhaps a superior form of having their own model not a bolt-on set of wings for warriors.

Looks like Warboss on Bike is back on the menu though, which is nice!

 Overread wrote:
Honestly I'm not surprised. FW is doing the same as GW and if it hasn't got a model it doesn't have rules.

Just FYI, there are plenty of things in that contents list that lack a model, such as literally every Chaos tank on that list.

You have to convert every single one of them to make them more CSM-ey. Models that needed to be converted was enough to delete things in the previous iteration of NMNR, yet brand new entries that require just that (NDKGM) appear too. This is part of people's annoyance, it is applied so inconsistently across ranges.

Plague Hulk is gone, too. Guess he's finally a Soulgrinder or Defiler. But that's not too bad actually , would have saved me about 60 points in 8th and would have given me better rules

When was the last time a unit was totally deleted with no way to re-use the models? It would have been the whole Mycetic Spore/Chapter House debacle, right?

Has to be som eof the Dark Eldar characters I would think ... Vect for example (who actually had a model), or Keradruak ....


As others have said though, this isn't necessarily an indicator of having been completely squatted. I'm hoping they show up in the actual nid dex along with a model release. I've had a Tyranid army idea in mind for years and have held back based on not wanting to convert all the shrikes ...

 BaconCatBug wrote:
Looks like Warboss on Bike is back on the menu though, which is nice!

Aren't these completely superfluous with the existence of the Deffkilla Wartrike which is an ork boss model mounted on a suitably pimped out motrcycle.

As for the Shrikes I would not be surprised for them to pop up again in the new Tyranid codex with a new model perhapse with flying ripper swarms too.

 Grimtuff wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Honestly I'm not surprised. FW is doing the same as GW and if it hasn't got a model it doesn't have rules.

Just FYI, there are plenty of things in that contents list that lack a model, such as literally every Chaos tank on that list.

You have to convert every single one of them to make them more CSM-ey.

Well, that goes for 90% of GWs CSM range, too, if you don't play Black Legion

The Nid model line is well rounded but there's a glaring Shrike-shaped hole. We have flying rippers, flying gaunts, and flying MCs of several types.

With shrikes stuck in limbo we no longer have any mid-sized elite flyers/jump infantry besides Zoanthropes and...eh...Mucolid Spores, and these aren't exactly the kind of rapid attack units one would expect.

Sgt. Cortez wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:

 Overread wrote:
Honestly I'm not surprised. FW is doing the same as GW and if it hasn't got a model it doesn't have rules.

Just FYI, there are plenty of things in that contents list that lack a model, such as literally every Chaos tank on that list.

You have to convert every single one of them to make them more CSM-ey.

Well, that goes for 90% of GWs CSM range, too, if you don't play Black Legion

If I see another CSM Land Raider with Imperial Eagles on its tracks it'll be too soon...

If I see another CSM Land Raider with Imperial Eagles on its tracks it'll be too soon...

My group was just joking the other day that with all the new Loyalist vehicles, CSM are due for an update of their own, but will probably just end up with all the Land Raiders the loyalists aren't using.

epronovost wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
Looks like Warboss on Bike is back on the menu though, which is nice!

Aren't these completely superfluous with the existence of the Deffkilla Wartrike which is an ork boss model mounted on a suitably pimped out motrcycle.

As for the Shrikes I would not be surprised for them to pop up again in the new Tyranid codex with a new model perhapse with flying ripper swarms too.

Most Ork players have an Ork warboss on a bike laying around from previous editions, so gw taking its rules away would invalidate a pretty cool model in most people's collections. Also, rules wise a warboss on a bike has different rules than a wartrike, they buff different unit types. Finally, wartrike boss can't take a PK, or really any options whatsoever, whereas a warboss on a bike gets all the options a boss on foot usually gets.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
With the release of the new FW book's contents not having an entry for Shrikes, and them not being in Legends, it seems that Shrikes are officially dead.

When was the last time a unit was totally deleted with no way to re-use the models? It would have been the whole Mycetic Spore/Chapter House debacle, right?

So what is your source on shrikes not getting legend entry together with rest of entries that will get legends? Article makes no mention shrikes are excluded so obviously you have got some insight knowledge since we know fw units are getting legend datasheets

Hopefully it means an update to the warrior kit. It would only take an extra spru with wings to make them shrikes if they didn't want to do a whole new kit.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
With the release of the new FW book's contents not having an entry for Shrikes, and them not being in Legends, it seems that Shrikes are officially dead.

When was the last time a unit was totally deleted with no way to re-use the models? It would have been the whole Mycetic Spore/Chapter House debacle, right?

The whole Corsair book (loadouts that would be illegal using them as any existing units). The Taghmata not getting updated to 8e at all.

 AnomanderRake wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
With the release of the new FW book's contents not having an entry for Shrikes, and them not being in Legends, it seems that Shrikes are officially dead.

When was the last time a unit was totally deleted with no way to re-use the models? It would have been the whole Mycetic Spore/Chapter House debacle, right?

The whole Corsair book (loadouts that would be illegal using them as any existing units). The Taghmata not getting updated to 8e at all.

Sorry - who/what is the Taghmata?

 Dysartes wrote:

 AnomanderRake wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
With the release of the new FW book's contents not having an entry for Shrikes, and them not being in Legends, it seems that Shrikes are officially dead.

When was the last time a unit was totally deleted with no way to re-use the models? It would have been the whole Mycetic Spore/Chapter House debacle, right?

The whole Corsair book (loadouts that would be illegal using them as any existing units). The Taghmata not getting updated to 8e at all.

Sorry - who/what is the Taghmata?

A Chaos Aligned 30k Mechanicum army by the looks of it. https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Taghmata_Omnissiah https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000/Tactics/Mechanicum:_Taghmata_(30k)

Taghmata never had 40k rules though. Elysians range has been gone for years, and they had some pretty unique options. Corsairs never had many units, it was a mostly kit-bash army, which goes against current policies (Not in the box, not in the rules).

 Dysartes wrote:
Sorry - who/what is the Taghmata?

The Taghmata Omnissiah is/was the 'general' Mechanicum force, as opposed to the more specialised Legio Cybernetica (robots) or Ordo Reductor (siege / heavy assault)

 Grimtuff wrote:


If I see another CSM Land Raider with Imperial Eagles on its tracks it'll be too soon...

Question:
Should a CSM Land Raider not have Imperial Eagles on it's tracks?

The majority of CSM vehicles were produced by the Imperium before being captured or defecting, and are maintained by salvaging wrecked or captured vehicles manufactured by the Imperium, so it's logical that parts of the vehicle with the Aquila stamped into them would still have the symbol on them.

It's one thing to paint a big chaos star on the side of the tank or to weld spikes and trophy racks on, but it would take some serious dedication to the dark gods to go through your entire track belt [particularly when part of it is fully encased within the tank hull and inaccessible] to take out the links with the symbols of the Imperium and find replacement links from a wrecked tank for them. And when it's time to replace the entire track, would you sit around and wait to find two wrecked tanks to get the extra links from, or just take the full belt from a single wrecked tank, aquila-tracks and all, and get your tank operational again?

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:


If I see another CSM Land Raider with Imperial Eagles on its tracks it'll be too soon...

Question:
Should a CSM Land Raider not have Imperial Eagles on it's tracks?

The majority of CSM vehicles were produced by the Imperium before being captured or defecting, and are maintained by salvaging wrecked or captured vehicles manufactured by the Imperium, so it's logical that parts of the vehicle with the Aquila stamped into them would still have the symbol on them.

It's one thing to paint a big chaos star on the side of the tank or to weld spikes and trophy racks on, but it would take some serious dedication to the dark gods to go through your entire track belt [particularly when part of it is fully encased within the tank hull and inaccessible] to take out the links with the symbols of the Imperium and find replacement links from a wrecked tank for them. And when it's time to replace the entire track, would you sit around and wait to find two wrecked tanks to get the extra links from, or just take the full belt from a single wrecked tank, aquila-tracks and all, and get your tank operational again?

In that specific case it is meant to be a purely post-heresy thing. They told you as much when the model came out; the Eagle is on every 13th link, representing The Emperor, the other twelve are for the High Lords. The latter of which did not exist until after Emps was interred on the Golden Throne.

 jaredb wrote:
Taghmata never had 40k rules though. Elysians range has been gone for years, and they had some pretty unique options. Corsairs never had many units, it was a mostly kit-bash army, which goes against current policies (Not in the box, not in the rules).

Doesn't change the fact that I had a Corsair army that got Squatted and a Mechanicum army I can't use unless I can persuade people to play Oldhammer.

 Grimtuff wrote:

 Inquisitor Lord Katherine wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:


If I see another CSM Land Raider with Imperial Eagles on its tracks it'll be too soon...

Question:
Should a CSM Land Raider not have Imperial Eagles on it's tracks?

The majority of CSM vehicles were produced by the Imperium before being captured or defecting, and are maintained by salvaging wrecked or captured vehicles manufactured by the Imperium, so it's logical that parts of the vehicle with the Aquila stamped into them would still have the symbol on them.

It's one thing to paint a big chaos star on the side of the tank or to weld spikes and trophy racks on, but it would take some serious dedication to the dark gods to go through your entire track belt [particularly when part of it is fully encased within the tank hull and inaccessible] to take out the links with the symbols of the Imperium and find replacement links from a wrecked tank for them. And when it's time to replace the entire track, would you sit around and wait to find two wrecked tanks to get the extra links from, or just take the full belt from a single wrecked tank, aquila-tracks and all, and get your tank operational again?

In that specific case it is meant to be a purely post-heresy thing. They told you as much when the model came out; the Eagle is on every 13th link, representing The Emperor, the other twelve are for the High Lords. The latter of which did not exist until after Emps was interred on the Golden Throne.

Even land raiders from the heresy era almost certainly don't have the tracks they left the factory with. Tank tracks on a modern tank require replacement even couple of thousand kilometers, and even with advanced Imperial metallurgy the wear over 10000 years is going to require replacement at some point. Unless the chaos warband in question directly controls factories tooled to produce Imperial tanks [which is very rare], I think it's entirely likely and reasonable that the tracks would continue to have eagles stamped on some links.

I agree about the corsairs, but the mechanicum stuff has always been just 30k, just like solar auxilia can't be used in 40k.

They are fantastic models though, and it would be cool to bring over more of that line to 40k. I have a large sisters of silence collection, and I'd love to use their transport in 40k.

Unless the chaos warband in question directly controls factories tooled to produce Imperial tanks [which is very rare], I think it's entirely likely and reasonable that the tracks would continue to have eagles stamped on some links

It's rare for a "warband" to have tanks of any kind really. Outside of maybe a few scattered Rhinos. Legions on the other hand, are a different story entirely. Iron Warriors, Word Bearers, Black Legion, Red Corsairs (I realize the last two aren't "Legions" in the traditional sense but you get my meaning), etc, all have such facilities in relative abundance, and the ones who don't can trade with the ones who do. The idea that the Imperium has unlimited resources in this area where CSM have almost nothing is one of the great fallacies of modern 40k.

As far as I'm aware, Shrikes have never been in any of the FW books.

I guess you can still use their Index rules, although good luck finding that Index.

Removing datasheets from other factions, adding them to Astartes...