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AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Jadenim wrote:
So the new boyz are super cool but painfully obviously repeated sculpts, as expected...

I'm sure a lot of people were expecting that, but I was really hoping for at least some interchangeability with arms / heads / weapons which would have helped hide the repeated bodies.

I was pretty surprised to see the display image models seem to match a single body to a single head to a single arm to a single weapon, I'll be curious to see the sprue, or if like other people suggested maybe it's a pushfit easy to build set.

See, I told you this is exactly what would happen.

From the pictures and videos it seems like every boy is four parts - a front/back side bit which includes the head and should pads and two arms with either slugga/choppa or shoota. None of the weapons appear on different torsos, so it's safe to assume that each weapon is meant to fit on only one pose. We might be lucky and some arms might fit with other torsos with just a little bit of green stuff, similar to the plague marine or blightlord sets.

It's also worth noting that all of them use chain-axe choppas, so this might be a special choppa similar to the astartes chainsword.

I'm also wondering what this boy is holding:


Is that a shotgun? A grenade launcher? It doesn't look like a shoota or the boomstikks on the wartrike/squigbuggy.

I mean the closest real world thing I can think of is a PIAT? Possibly a grenade launcher*, which would be an odd addition to the Ork range after all this time.

* Sorry, “Boom-stikk chukka”

 Jidmah wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Jadenim wrote:
So the new boyz are super cool but painfully obviously repeated sculpts, as expected...

I'm sure a lot of people were expecting that, but I was really hoping for at least some interchangeability with arms / heads / weapons which would have helped hide the repeated bodies.

I was pretty surprised to see the display image models seem to match a single body to a single head to a single arm to a single weapon, I'll be curious to see the sprue, or if like other people suggested maybe it's a pushfit easy to build set.

See, I told you this is exactly what would happen.

From the pictures and videos it seems like every boy is four parts - a front/back side bit which includes the head and should pads and two arms with either slugga/choppa or shoota. None of the weapons appear on different torsos, so it's safe to assume that each weapon is meant to fit on only one pose. We might be lucky and some arms might fit with other torsos with just a little bit of green stuff, similar to the plague marine or blightlord sets.

It's also worth noting that all of them use chain-axe choppas, so this might be a special choppa similar to the astartes chainsword.

I'm also wondering what this boy is holding:

Spoiler:

Is that a shotgun? A grenade launcher? It doesn't look like a shoota or the boomstikks on the wartrike/squigbuggy.

I think he's just holding a very large pipe and making "pew-pew" noises

 Jidmah wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Jadenim wrote:
So the new boyz are super cool but painfully obviously repeated sculpts, as expected...

I'm sure a lot of people were expecting that, but I was really hoping for at least some interchangeability with arms / heads / weapons which would have helped hide the repeated bodies.

I was pretty surprised to see the display image models seem to match a single body to a single head to a single arm to a single weapon, I'll be curious to see the sprue, or if like other people suggested maybe it's a pushfit easy to build set.

See, I told you this is exactly what would happen.

I never had a strong opinion what "would" happen, just thoughts on different options. I'm not exactly crying either way.

It's not like they're removing old boyz, so you're free to continue buying the crusty 18 year old models

From the pictures and videos it seems like every boy is four parts - a front/back side bit which includes the head and should pads and two arms with either slugga/choppa or shoota. None of the weapons appear on different torsos, so it's safe to assume that each weapon is meant to fit on only one pose.

That's why I think the people suggesting these are just easy to build kits are probably right.

Monopose is one thing, but not even having interchangeable heads is pretty extreme and only really makes sense if they're easy to build kits.

So hey, not all is lost, maybe we'll get a not-so-easy-to-build kit down the track.

At this point, I’m really hoping they are a separate sprue for the box set, or will at least come with an additional weapon sprue in the final independent release, because this will kill the look of Ork armies. I could get behind combined legs and torso bodies, but at least give the option to switch around the heads and arms to stop them looking identical.

The Necromunda kits are a great example of this; I can get a huge variety in my Escher gang even with only five basic bodies and it’s annoying that one part of GW seems to get this and others don’t.

Could be a net launcher?!? they hunt big game so why not.

 Jadenim wrote:
At this point, I’m really hoping they are a separate sprue for the box set, or will at least come with an additional weapon sprue in the final independent release, because this will kill the look of Ork armies. I could get behind combined legs and torso bodies, but at least give the option to switch around the heads and arms to stop them looking identical.

The Necromunda kits are a great example of this; I can get a huge variety in my Escher gang even with only five basic bodies and it’s annoying that one part of GW seems to get this and others don’t.

Poor Cawdor...

 Jadenim wrote:
At this point, I’m really hoping they are a separate sprue for the box set, or will at least come with an additional weapon sprue in the final independent release, because this will kill the look of Ork armies. I could get behind combined legs and torso bodies, but at least give the option to switch around the heads and arms to stop them looking identical.

The Necromunda kits are a great example of this; I can get a huge variety in my Escher gang even with only five basic bodies and it’s annoying that one part of GW seems to get this and others don’t.

I don't own them, but was looking at the Goliath kit and from what I can see they're monopose but with heaps of options in terms of which chest plate, head and arms go on which of the bodies, but they wouldn't fall into the easy-to-build category.

So it's not like GW don't know how to do a monopose kit that also has lots of flexibility.

Hopefully these Orks are just for this initial boxed set and we get something more akin to the Goliath for the regular boxed set that come out later.

Imagine something like the Goliath sprue, but with 10 body and arm options instead of 5, I think you could put together a pretty unique horde of 50 to 100 Orks without too much in the way of repetition.

As an ork and guard player. I'm quite happy with this lot. I have no doubt in my mind that there will be more coming along for both factions in the very near future. Orks certainly soon, as they mentioned this first lot is only about half of what's coming. I really hope a new Boyz box is part of it as I've been holding off from buying another mob since that tease with the shoulder mounted weapons. The guard head sprue should have come years ago but hey.. I do hope though that they will start selling an entire sprue of re-breathers, ski masks, etc..
As others have mentioned over many threads. The upgrade sprue could be a way of filling in the unsupported regiments along with a long coat base box.

Vim

Not Online!!! wrote:
Could be a net launcher?!? they hunt big game so why not.

Net launcher or some variant of punt gun yea

 lord_blackfang wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:
Could be a net launcher?!? they hunt big game so why not.

Net launcher or some variant of punt gun yea

i mean there was talk of harpooning, so maybee it's the empty harpoon gun?

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
It's not like they're removing old boyz, so you're free to continue buying the crusty 18 year old models

Yeah right, this argument again. They undoubtedly will be shoved to the side with unfavorable rules just like most of the firstborn range to force you into buying the new hot stuff. Considering how boyz are already only marginally usable under specific circumstances, it's not even hard to do.

From the pictures and videos it seems like every boy is four parts - a front/back side bit which includes the head and should pads and two arms with either slugga/choppa or shoota. None of the weapons appear on different torsos, so it's safe to assume that each weapon is meant to fit on only one pose.

That's why I think the people suggesting these are just easy to build kits are probably right.

Monopose is one thing, but not even having interchangeable heads is pretty extreme and only really makes sense if they're easy to build kits.

So hey, not all is lost, maybe we'll get a not-so-easy-to-build kit down the track.

Grasping to straws to deny reality again, are we?

DG full kits only have one helmeted and one unhelmeted head per model, these heads rarely, if ever, fit other models.

Limited premium boxes also don't contain ETB sets. This is neither a starter box nor duel set.

GW also should have learned that no one will buy the full set for troops as long as a cheaper ETB variant is around.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Jadenim wrote:
At this point, I’m really hoping they are a separate sprue for the box set, or will at least come with an additional weapon sprue in the final independent release, because this will kill the look of Ork armies. I could get behind combined legs and torso bodies, but at least give the option to switch around the heads and arms to stop them looking identical.

The Necromunda kits are a great example of this; I can get a huge variety in my Escher gang even with only five basic bodies and it’s annoying that one part of GW seems to get this and others don’t.

I don't own them, but was looking at the Goliath kit and from what I can see they're monopose but with heaps of options in terms of which chest plate, head and arms go on which of the bodies, but they wouldn't fall into the easy-to-build category.

So it's not like GW don't know how to do a monopose kit that also has lots of flexibility.

Hopefully these Orks are just for this initial boxed set and we get something more akin to the Goliath for the regular boxed set that come out later.

I have all the base gang kits, Escher, Goliath and Orlocks are noticeably better than the others, pretty much any head/arm combo works. Although some Eschers are like Juves and have smaller arms and bodies. Cawdor and Van Saar are extremely limited by comparison. Delaque is still in the box so I can't comment.

 Jidmah wrote:
Grasping to straws to deny reality again, are we?

Dude, you are taking this discussion / argument approximately 50 million times more seriously than I am, give it a rest.

Until we see the final sprues we don't know what's going to happen. Maybe this is all we get, given it's a sub-branch of Orks rather than replacing the main Ork Boyz kit I don't necessarily expect them to put a huge amount of effort into doing both a starter easy-to-build kit and also a more flexible kit later. Maybe this is just a taster of a bigger Ork update to come.

Just look at the Goliath and pray you get something like that. Then look at the new Cadian upgrade sprue and pray you don't get something like that****



****I'm joking, something like the Cadian sprue for Orks would actually be nice, it just sucks for Cadians.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

IHateAoS wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Jadenim wrote:
At this point, I’m really hoping they are a separate sprue for the box set, or will at least come with an additional weapon sprue in the final independent release, because this will kill the look of Ork armies. I could get behind combined legs and torso bodies, but at least give the option to switch around the heads and arms to stop them looking identical.

The Necromunda kits are a great example of this; I can get a huge variety in my Escher gang even with only five basic bodies and it’s annoying that one part of GW seems to get this and others don’t.

I don't own them, but was looking at the Goliath kit and from what I can see they're monopose but with heaps of options in terms of which chest plate, head and arms go on which of the bodies, but they wouldn't fall into the easy-to-build category.

So it's not like GW don't know how to do a monopose kit that also has lots of flexibility.

Hopefully these Orks are just for this initial boxed set and we get something more akin to the Goliath for the regular boxed set that come out later.

I have all the base gang kits, Escher, Goliath and Orlocks are noticeably better than the others, pretty much any head/arm combo works. Although some Eschers are like Juves and have smaller arms and bodies. Cawdor and Van Saar are extremely limited by comparison. Delaque is still in the box so I can't comment.

I'm not familiar with the chronologyof Necro releases, but does that mean the kits are getting worse with time, or just random?

Yes. They are getting worse.

I don't own Palanites though. I assume Corpse Grinders are monopose as hell.

The infuriating thin is that when GW wants they can do "monopose" kits that are extremely varied like blightkings or the newer Rockgutt Troggoth box (That I tought had 0 options because literally ALL photos that GW used are of the exact same 3 models but it has a ton of variety) but then they sell you crap like the Slaangor box that is an insult compared with the trogg one.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
I'm not familiar with the chronologyof Necro releases, but does that mean the kits are getting worse with time, or just random?

Seems like a practical limitation. It's harder to do multiple poses on models with full body outfits like Delaques, compared to designs like Escher / Goliath where a lot have bare arms. Not impossible, but it’s definitely harder to make everything look natural.

The Rockgutt Troggoths are a standout kit for sure, the ultimate fusion of 90s modularity and modern detail. Putting the whole shoulder down to the spatula for each arm was genius and allows for varied poses while keeping the musculature fully detailed and realistic (contrast to the ball/socket joint of old Rat Ogres, for example).

I was also pretty impressed with how the arm poses of the first Goliath sprue made for very different figures. And yeah, wasn't really continued in later kits.

It’s not as if the existing Boyz kit is all that full of variety, as they share a common pose.

Specifically most left and right arms at roughly 45 degree angles. Majority of right hands are Sluggas, Choppas for Left (I think only one deviation per side).

So by the time you’ve finished assembling them. Even if you’ve taken care to ensure no two assembled models use exactly the same part? They look entirely much of a muchness, especially when deployed as larger Mobs?

To get more variety out of the Snaggas, from the ones we’ve seen it looks to be a relatively straight forward hand or weapon swap.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
It’s not as if the existing Boyz kit is all that full of variety, as they share a common pose.

Specifically most left and right arms at roughly 45 degree angles. Majority of right hands are Sluggas, Choppas for Left (I think only one deviation per side).

So by the time you’ve finished assembling them. Even if you’ve taken care to ensure no two assembled models use exactly the same part? They look entirely much of a muchness, especially when deployed as larger Mobs?

To get more variety out of the Snaggas, from the ones we’ve seen it looks to be a relatively straight forward hand or weapon swap.

Yea but all the boyz are compatible, you can put Storm Boy pistols and Loota heads on anyone if you want, while Snaggas can't even swap bits within the same kit, let alone any other kit.

 Galas wrote:
The infuriating thin is that when GW wants they can do "monopose" kits that are extremely varied like blightkings or the newer Rockgutt Troggoth box (That I tought had 0 options because literally ALL photos that GW used are of the exact same 3 models but it has a ton of variety) but then they sell you crap like the Slaangor box that is an insult compared with the trogg one.

Not all miniature designers are created equal.

A fair point, but you can do that with just a modicum of conversion effort?

It’s again mostly weapon or hand swaps

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
A fair point, but you can do that with just a modicum of conversion effort?

It’s again mostly weapon or hand swaps

Not everyone is good at sculping

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
A fair point, but you can do that with just a modicum of conversion effort?

It’s again mostly weapon or hand swaps

A well designed kit lets you do a lot more than just weapon and hand swaps, it gives you variability that you're not going to get through conversion effort unless you have the ability to resculpt significant portions of muscles.

The challenge with exposed muscles is if you go the way of the current Boyz kit, the muscles look like crap. If you go to the extreme of sculpting the muscles correctly, it limits the poses.

The Goliath kit is monopose, which allows it to have decent musculature, but it also has the arms separate from the bodies and interchangeable with other bodies, so you can have a decent amount of variety that you aren't going to get with weapon swaps alone.

The Savage Orcs are designed so that the deltoids are part of the arm, but the socket isn't flat like the Boyz kit, it's sculpted like a deltoid should be, allowing different arms to go into the same socket. Monopose, but some level of variety. A downside to the Savage Orcs is the join lines are a bit too obvious, but I still rank them higher than the 40k Boyz kit.

Now, the new Snakebite Boyz, it seems like they've not given it any interchangeability at all. Sure, you can hack hands off and stick them on other bodies with a bit of conversion effort, but I'd say that's a minimum level of variety, surely not the desired level. Depending on how they go together maybe even the heads won't be terribly easy to swap without some greenstuffing around.

tneva82 wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
A fair point, but you can do that with just a modicum of conversion effort?

It’s again mostly weapon or hand swaps

Not everyone is good at sculping

Who said anything about sculpting?

Good, sharp scalpel, cut through. Two separate parts, no real requirement for any sculpting whatsoever.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
It’s not as if the existing Boyz kit is all that full of variety, as they share a common pose.

Specifically most left and right arms at roughly 45 degree angles. Majority of right hands are Sluggas, Choppas for Left (I think only one deviation per side).

So by the time you’ve finished assembling them. Even if you’ve taken care to ensure no two assembled models use exactly the same part? They look entirely much of a muchness, especially when deployed as larger Mobs?

To get more variety out of the Snaggas, from the ones we’ve seen it looks to be a relatively straight forward hand or weapon swap.

Yea but all the boyz are compatible, you can put Storm Boy pistols and Loota heads on anyone if you want, while Snaggas can't even swap bits within the same kit, let alone any other kit.

Not only that but we as humans are designed to find patterns with extreme ease.

So if you have 20 similar boyz but each one has distinct features like a different mix of heads and arms, even if they are repeated but mixed diferently or in diferent angles, it looks to our brains much different than having, for example, 15 unique poses and 5 exact clones.

Orkz, or older kit also come with tons of extra bit like pouch, clan icon, ammo belt, jaws, shoulder pad, sight etc... something modern day GW only do is there're leftover space on the sprue. Otherwise it's the smallest sprue possible, while still selling at same/higher price. Something like Flash gitz, or T'au fire warrior if they were made in the modern day wouldn't be on 3 sprues, because they have load of extra bits.

 Galas wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
It’s not as if the existing Boyz kit is all that full of variety, as they share a common pose.

Specifically most left and right arms at roughly 45 degree angles. Majority of right hands are Sluggas, Choppas for Left (I think only one deviation per side).

So by the time you’ve finished assembling them. Even if you’ve taken care to ensure no two assembled models use exactly the same part? They look entirely much of a muchness, especially when deployed as larger Mobs?

To get more variety out of the Snaggas, from the ones we’ve seen it looks to be a relatively straight forward hand or weapon swap.

Yea but all the boyz are compatible, you can put Storm Boy pistols and Loota heads on anyone if you want, while Snaggas can't even swap bits within the same kit, let alone any other kit.

Not only that but we as humans are designed to find patterns with extreme ease.

So if you have 20 similar boyz but each one has distinct features like a different mix of heads and arms, even if they are repeated but mixed diferently or in diferent angles, it looks to our brains much different than having, for example, 15 unique poses and 5 exact clones.

I find the current Boyz very repetitive due to lack of actual options for weapons, guns, heads. You just see the same features over and over, the same chain choppa, the same axe with the head held on with bolts, the same furry hat head, the same bullet earring head, the same torso with 3 spikes, etc etc.

Granted the new kit is horrid in that it's not just monopose, it seems like there's no interchangeability.

I think the ideal is a 10 man monopose sprue but with some level of interchangeability of arms and heads, at that point I think you could have enough variation that a clump of boyz wouldn't stand out as having repetitive features.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

I think he's just holding a very large pipe and making "pew-pew" noises

And because he is a wh40k ork then it could actually work

Could be an updated Kannon from Gorkamorka.