Switch Theme:

Not Sure What’s Wrong with this Resin  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in us
Monstrously Massive Big Mutant





The Wastes of Krieg

So I got a Malcador Infernus from FW today and I went to wash the pieces off, but the larger pieces have a weird sheen on them that I’ve never had before. Is this just stubborn release agent or is something wrong with the resin?
[Thumb - 38208951-2AF2-4300-A636-4FE3AC596762.jpeg]
File 1

   
Made in gb
Furious Fire Dragon





Midlands, UK

They have been known to have occasional problems with badly mixed or not fully cured resin, from what I've read those models can come out a bit like your photo - i.e. with a sheen on them, or 'sticky', or seem to be 'weeping'. But I'll stress I've never encountered that myself so I'm going purely on what I've read online and I'm not sure if that's really what I'm seeing in your pic.

I assume that's with the piece dry after being washed, and not just still wet!

Hopefully somebody who's seen bad resin in person can chime in.

   
Made in us
Monstrously Massive Big Mutant





The Wastes of Krieg

Yes sir it is bone dry. I even left it soaking in soapy water overnight and it still refused to come off after scrubbing. At this point I’ve contacted FW and they can offer a suggestion or a replacement.
   
Made in au
Anti-Armour Swiss Guard






Newcastle, OZ

They have been known to use a mould release that sticks to resin better than babygak to a blanket.

You might need to give it a good scrub with a mild abrasive. Like the slightly "gritty" feeling toothpastes (which often have kaolin in them, it's a fine white clay also used in paper production - but it gets used in fine abrasive polishes, too.


I'm OVER 50 (and so far over everyone's BS, too).
Old enough to know better, young enough to not give a ****.

That is not dead which can eternal lie ...

... and yet, with strange aeons, even death may die.
 
   
Made in gb
Battleship Captain





Bristol (UK)

I heard this is improperly cured resin, it's excess resin component leeching out.

Although I'm no expert unfortunately.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/08/02 07:31:59


 
   
Made in au
Anti-Armour Swiss Guard






Newcastle, OZ

Quite often, though, an improper mix will still be "tacky" to the touch days, even weeks later (even after "baking" in a UV curing oven. ).

If it's that badly mixed that it's still sweating out liquid, then it shouldn't have set at ALL.

I'm OVER 50 (and so far over everyone's BS, too).
Old enough to know better, young enough to not give a ****.

That is not dead which can eternal lie ...

... and yet, with strange aeons, even death may die.
 
   
Made in us
Stealthy Grot Snipa





Atlanta, GA

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
Yes sir it is bone dry. I even left it soaking in soapy water overnight and it still refused to come off after scrubbing. At this point I’ve contacted FW and they can offer a suggestion or a replacement.


Try giving it another soak and scrub, but if it feels dry to the touch after that, do a coat of matte varnish before you prime it and you should be ok.
   
Made in us
Monstrously Massive Big Mutant





The Wastes of Krieg

They told me to do the following:

Clean the parts using hot water rather than warm water, using washing up liquid or a product called non-granulated swarfega, scrub the parts rinsing off the detergent in hot water and leave to air dry.
The parts do not need to be left to soak overnight or for long periods of time, a hot bath refers to the fact the water should not get cold and a 10-15 minute soak and scrub should suffice.
Using a preferred matt varnish (purity seal) spray a thin coat over the entire model (leaving to dry fully before base coating).
We recommend using a black or white surface primer from a spray can rather than an airbrush or hand-painted on the primer.
For best results using the same sealing spray between multiple thin layers of primer will help seal the miniature fully.
If the model still flakes or still will not hold any paint at all please get back in touch.
   
Made in hr
Dakka Veteran





Croatia

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
They told me to do the following:

Clean the parts using hot water rather than warm water, using washing up liquid or a product called non-granulated swarfega, scrub the parts rinsing off the detergent in hot water and leave to air dry.
The parts do not need to be left to soak overnight or for long periods of time, a hot bath refers to the fact the water should not get cold and a 10-15 minute soak and scrub should suffice.
Using a preferred matt varnish (purity seal) spray a thin coat over the entire model (leaving to dry fully before base coating).
We recommend using a black or white surface primer from a spray can rather than an airbrush or hand-painted on the primer.
For best results using the same sealing spray between multiple thin layers of primer will help seal the miniature fully.
If the model still flakes or still will not hold any paint at all please get back in touch.

That all sounds like a lot of work for problems they caused...
If the problem is uncured resin like some of the other folks suggested then leaving it out in the sun for a while might help cure it.

   
Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut






 Power Elephant wrote:
DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
They told me to do the following:

Clean the parts using hot water rather than warm water, using washing up liquid or a product called non-granulated swarfega, scrub the parts rinsing off the detergent in hot water and leave to air dry.
The parts do not need to be left to soak overnight or for long periods of time, a hot bath refers to the fact the water should not get cold and a 10-15 minute soak and scrub should suffice.
Using a preferred matt varnish (purity seal) spray a thin coat over the entire model (leaving to dry fully before base coating).
We recommend using a black or white surface primer from a spray can rather than an airbrush or hand-painted on the primer.
For best results using the same sealing spray between multiple thin layers of primer will help seal the miniature fully.
If the model still flakes or still will not hold any paint at all please get back in touch.

That all sounds like a lot of work for problems they caused...
If the problem is uncured resin like some of the other folks suggested then leaving it out in the sun for a while might help cure it.


Ehm. no.

FW uses 2 part resin which is mixed in the ratio as per material spec and will harden from there in a chemical reaction between the two parts.
If the resin isn't properly cured, that means it wasn't properly mixed (wrong ratio or physical mixing) and you have an excess of part A or B making up the mass of some section.
There is no way to recover from this to the proper material consistency. If the area holds it's shape, it may be possible to get it to hold paint though.

While 3D resin printers use liquid resin, this is completely different material, with the hardening/combination of the molecule chains activated by exposure to UV light.
That doesn't apply to two-part resins for casting.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/08/03 12:15:10


   
Made in us
Stealthy Grot Snipa





Atlanta, GA

 Power Elephant wrote:
DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
They told me to do the following:

Clean the parts using hot water rather than warm water, using washing up liquid or a product called non-granulated swarfega, scrub the parts rinsing off the detergent in hot water and leave to air dry.
The parts do not need to be left to soak overnight or for long periods of time, a hot bath refers to the fact the water should not get cold and a 10-15 minute soak and scrub should suffice.
Using a preferred matt varnish (purity seal) spray a thin coat over the entire model (leaving to dry fully before base coating).
We recommend using a black or white surface primer from a spray can rather than an airbrush or hand-painted on the primer.
For best results using the same sealing spray between multiple thin layers of primer will help seal the miniature fully.
If the model still flakes or still will not hold any paint at all please get back in touch.

That all sounds like a lot of work for problems they caused...
If the problem is uncured resin like some of the other folks suggested then leaving it out in the sun for a while might help cure it.




It's not uncured resin. And "give it a hot soap scrub, then varnish and prime it" is not a whole lot of work.

   
Made in us
Monstrously Massive Big Mutant





The Wastes of Krieg

 Mr. Grey wrote:
 Power Elephant wrote:
DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
They told me to do the following:

Clean the parts using hot water rather than warm water, using washing up liquid or a product called non-granulated swarfega, scrub the parts rinsing off the detergent in hot water and leave to air dry.
The parts do not need to be left to soak overnight or for long periods of time, a hot bath refers to the fact the water should not get cold and a 10-15 minute soak and scrub should suffice.
Using a preferred matt varnish (purity seal) spray a thin coat over the entire model (leaving to dry fully before base coating).
We recommend using a black or white surface primer from a spray can rather than an airbrush or hand-painted on the primer.
For best results using the same sealing spray between multiple thin layers of primer will help seal the miniature fully.
If the model still flakes or still will not hold any paint at all please get back in touch.

That all sounds like a lot of work for problems they caused...
If the problem is uncured resin like some of the other folks suggested then leaving it out in the sun for a while might help cure it.




It's not uncured resin. And "give it a hot soap scrub, then varnish and prime it" is not a whole lot of work.



Considering I’ve never varnished and rarely primed, plus I don’t even know where to get Swarfega, it kind of is.
   
Made in gb
Moustache-twirling Princeps




United Kingdom

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
I don’t even know where to get Swarfega, it kind of is.
It's a brand name for cleaning products - you can get them on Amazon IIRC.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/08/03 13:51:14


 
   
Made in us
Monstrously Massive Big Mutant





The Wastes of Krieg

beast_gts wrote:
DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
I don’t even know where to get Swarfega, it kind of is.
It's a brand name for cleaning products - you can get them on Amazon IIRC.


When I bought the Infernus, I really wasn’t looking to having to buy more items to finish it then is absolutely needed. This is going way beyond what I should have to do to put together a model.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Moot point, I need to do it since cutting off the excess resin means it isn’t in original condition

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/08/03 15:13:29


 
   
Made in hr
Dakka Veteran





Croatia

When I bought the Infernus, I really wasn’t looking to having to buy more items to finish it then is absolutely needed. This is going way beyond what I should have to do to put together a model.

That was what I thought as well. The problem isn't just that the model isn't holding paint. The problem is that it's defective product. Who says you want to paint the model at all? A lot of people don't paint their models for a long time or even at all. You don't have an obligation to try and fix your model yourself before requesting a replacement. The product is defective and they should replace it, not ask you to buy and use other products to get it to a point it should have been at when you first opened it.


   
Made in us
Humorless Arbite





Maine

I've had to deal with that several times. At this point I consider it normal for FW vehicles. I have also had a kit that didn't cure for probably 2 years. Some parts were sticky and always had a film on them. I left it in a window for maybe a week, then added it to the pike of shame. Couple years later it seemed rather normal though was still a bit hydrophobic.

Voxed from Salamander 84-24020
 
   
Made in us
Monstrously Massive Big Mutant





The Wastes of Krieg

I’m just going to put it together. If it does eventually get painted, maybe it will turn out fine. Either way that’s years away at earliest.
   
Made in us
Elite Tyranid Warrior






I get this issue occasionally. First you should tell FW that the resin isn't properly cured and get a replacement then you should heat the part up at a low temperature in the oven for a few minutes. Keep heating it up until there's no more "steam", chemical smell, and the surface has completely hardened. Afterwards the resin will be hard and glossy, you can sand it with dry abrasive cleaner.

Do at your own risk though, I have no idea if the miasma this creates is safe but it will absolutely cure the resin.

   
Made in us
Monstrously Massive Big Mutant





The Wastes of Krieg

 Irkjoe wrote:
I get this issue occasionally. First you should tell FW that the resin isn't properly cured and get a replacement then you should heat the part up at a low temperature in the oven for a few minutes. Keep heating it up until there's no more "steam", chemical smell, and the surface has completely hardened. Afterwards the resin will be hard and glossy, you can sand it with dry abrasive cleaner.

Do at your own risk though, I have no idea if the miasma this creates is safe but it will absolutely cure the resin.



It would be funny (in my mind at least) if I burned down my house with a Malcador Infernus
   
Made in us
Imperial Guard Landspeeder Pilot




On moon miranda.

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
So I got a Malcador Infernus from FW today and I went to wash the pieces off, but the larger pieces have a weird sheen on them that I’ve never had before. Is this just stubborn release agent or is something wrong with the resin?
I've had this a couple times, not with any large kits, a couple Dread parts, but I just put a little extra effort into cleaning them and they've come out fine.

IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.

New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights!
The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.  
   
Made in us
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






Pleasant Valley, Iowa

I can't really tell from that picture if it's mold release or bubbling - so every single thing I am about to say is general advice:

Improperly mixed/cured 2-part resin ("weeping") isn't generally fixable and should be replaced, even if you can work around it - Forge World is notorious for sending out substandard product at boutique prices and we should not enable that behavior.

Scrubbing it in hot water with a toothbrush and some dish soap is not asking a lot, though - it's reasonable for resin models where potentially stubborn mold release could be the culprit. I have done this many times in the past and it's an expectation when working with resin.

Asking you to buy a product to clean it, prime it and see if it flakes off is a bridge too far.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/08/04 17:55:50


 lord_blackfang wrote:
Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.

 Flinty wrote:
The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
 
   
Made in us
Monstrously Massive Big Mutant





The Wastes of Krieg

 Ouze wrote:
I can't really tell from that picture if it's mold release or bubbling - so every single thing I am about to say is general advice:

Improperly mixed/cured 2-part resin ("weeping") isn't generally fixable and should be replaced, even if you can work around it - Forge World is notorious for sending out substandard product at boutique prices and we should not enable that behavior.

Scrubbing it in hot water with a toothbrush and some dish soap is not asking a lot, though - it's reasonable for resin models where potentially stubborn mold release could be the culprit. I have done this many times in the past and it's an expectation when working with resin.

Asking you to buy a product to clean it, prime it and see if it flakes off is a bridge too far.


I’m done trying to have a back and forth with them, I’m mad but I know taking it out on an employee doing their job isn’t going to do good for anyone. I’ll just put it together and use it. What I learned however is that I should leave all the extra resin and gates on the model until I’m done washing it. If this happens again and I can’t get it clean, they’ll have no reason not to accept it as an exchange or return.
   
Made in ca
Fresh-Faced New User




This is the reason recasters make so much money. Like come on I pay a huge premium for FW models and I still have a bunch of work too do,, BS. At the price of those models they should come cleaned and without flaws, and if their are any problems just have send the model back and send me a new one. FW is absolutely garbage. I should not have too reshape and clean the resin release agent from it,, total BS.
   
Made in us
Stealthy Grot Snipa





Atlanta, GA

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
 Mr. Grey wrote:
 Power Elephant wrote:
DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
They told me to do the following:

Clean the parts using hot water rather than warm water, using washing up liquid or a product called non-granulated swarfega, scrub the parts rinsing off the detergent in hot water and leave to air dry.
The parts do not need to be left to soak overnight or for long periods of time, a hot bath refers to the fact the water should not get cold and a 10-15 minute soak and scrub should suffice.
Using a preferred matt varnish (purity seal) spray a thin coat over the entire model (leaving to dry fully before base coating).
We recommend using a black or white surface primer from a spray can rather than an airbrush or hand-painted on the primer.
For best results using the same sealing spray between multiple thin layers of primer will help seal the miniature fully.
If the model still flakes or still will not hold any paint at all please get back in touch.

That all sounds like a lot of work for problems they caused...
If the problem is uncured resin like some of the other folks suggested then leaving it out in the sun for a while might help cure it.




It's not uncured resin. And "give it a hot soap scrub, then varnish and prime it" is not a whole lot of work.



Considering I’ve never varnished and rarely primed, plus I don’t even know where to get Swarfega, it kind of is.




Clean the parts using hot water rather than warm water, using washing up liquid


Do you have dish soap in your kitchen? Because that's exactly what they mean when they tell you "washing up liquid".

From your post it sounds like you ordered a resin kit from Forge World and were expecting it to go together like one of the latest plastic releases. Resin is a different material and can sometimes need a little more work. In this case, giving it another scrub and then trying a varnish+prime.

I'm specifically telling you that the process they advised will work, because I had a Sicaran that had some sections that had a similar sheen on them. Again, it's not uncured resin. A hot water scrub with dish soap, and then a light coat of varnish and then primer will fix the issue.

And if you rarely prime your models, now's a good time to start. That said, if you mostly play with unpainted minis, then you don't need to varnish and prime at all, you're fine to stop after the "give it a hot scrub" stage.
   
Made in us
Monstrously Massive Big Mutant





The Wastes of Krieg

 Mr. Grey wrote:
DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
 Mr. Grey wrote:
 Power Elephant wrote:
DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
They told me to do the following:

Clean the parts using hot water rather than warm water, using washing up liquid or a product called non-granulated swarfega, scrub the parts rinsing off the detergent in hot water and leave to air dry.
The parts do not need to be left to soak overnight or for long periods of time, a hot bath refers to the fact the water should not get cold and a 10-15 minute soak and scrub should suffice.
Using a preferred matt varnish (purity seal) spray a thin coat over the entire model (leaving to dry fully before base coating).
We recommend using a black or white surface primer from a spray can rather than an airbrush or hand-painted on the primer.
For best results using the same sealing spray between multiple thin layers of primer will help seal the miniature fully.
If the model still flakes or still will not hold any paint at all please get back in touch.

That all sounds like a lot of work for problems they caused...
If the problem is uncured resin like some of the other folks suggested then leaving it out in the sun for a while might help cure it.




It's not uncured resin. And "give it a hot soap scrub, then varnish and prime it" is not a whole lot of work.



Considering I’ve never varnished and rarely primed, plus I don’t even know where to get Swarfega, it kind of is.




Clean the parts using hot water rather than warm water, using washing up liquid


Do you have dish soap in your kitchen? Because that's exactly what they mean when they tell you "washing up liquid".

From your post it sounds like you ordered a resin kit from Forge World and were expecting it to go together like one of the latest plastic releases. Resin is a different material and can sometimes need a little more work. In this case, giving it another scrub and then trying a varnish+prime.

I'm specifically telling you that the process they advised will work, because I had a Sicaran that had some sections that had a similar sheen on them. Again, it's not uncured resin. A hot water scrub with dish soap, and then a light coat of varnish and then primer will fix the issue.

And if you rarely prime your models, now's a good time to start. That said, if you mostly play with unpainted minis, then you don't need to varnish and prime at all, you're fine to stop after the "give it a hot scrub" stage.


I did use dish soap the first time like you’re supposed to with resin but it didn’t come off. Then I tried a pumice-infused soap comparable to Swarfega from my local hardware store and it still didn’t come off.
   
Made in us
Elite Tyranid Warrior






Is it just glossy resin or is it uncured? Is the surface tacky or has an almost rubbery texture? If it's just shiny then there's no issue, lightly scrub it with comet.
   
Made in us
Monstrously Massive Big Mutant





The Wastes of Krieg

Just smooth
   
Made in au
Grizzled Space Wolves Great Wolf





 Mr. Grey wrote:
DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
Yes sir it is bone dry. I even left it soaking in soapy water overnight and it still refused to come off after scrubbing. At this point I’ve contacted FW and they can offer a suggestion or a replacement.


Try giving it another soak and scrub, but if it feels dry to the touch after that, do a coat of matte varnish before you prime it and you should be ok.


They seem to think something is wrong, but are hoping the OP gives up and accepts it.

I'm not one of those people who thinks FW should deliver perfect, unwarped models that are easy to assemble, they state right there on their site their models are a pain to deal with. I've bought FW models that I've unwarped, cleaned with a toothbrush and dish soap, that's all fine.

BUT, it's a step too far when they say you have to clean it in hot water (not just warm!) using an abrasive soap (not just dish soap!) then spray alternating coats of varnish and primer (out of rattle cans instead of an airbrush!) because they clearly think there's a good chance the paint won't stick and then AFTER all that if your paint job still flakes away, THEN get back in touch with them?

That's overstepping the mark for me, they should just replace the damned thing, it's sad to see if FW are going down this path as they've always been very eager to replace faulty models in the past, and these days GW has such massive profits it's not like you're dealing with some boutique store that's struggling to pay their rent.

I think maybe GW / FW are pushing back because people would exploit their very generous replacement policies, but they need to be careful to not go too far the other way and make it a pain in the arse for customers with legitimate problems to get replacements.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/08/07 01:12:06


 
   
Made in gb
Crafty Bray Shaman




Anor Londo

Yeah, I can confirm that it is the FW mold release agent that is causing the problem.

In my experience it’s a common problem with FW (and only FW), where the mold release has hardened and become almost impossible to remove. Some time ago I advised somebody else on this very forum to use spray varnish over the affected areas as a workaround, but I can’t help but feel a little sad to hear that FW are actually giving out this advice to customers.

I mean, it’s a faulty product. Something is wrong with their casting process, evidently, because again, it doesn’t happen (in my experience at least) with resin products from any other company.

Why do they expect you to pay for a can of varnish to fix the problems with their mold release? Shouldn’t they advertise this in the description of their models, or would that be too embarrassing for them?

Why do they allow this kind of thing to continue? I usually try to be positive about GW/FW, but having encountered this problem multiple times before, over a period of many years, I feel that I’ve earned a bit of a rant

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/08/07 08:32:57


 
   
Made in us
Monstrously Massive Big Mutant





The Wastes of Krieg

I ended up putting the model together and screwing up several spots anyway. I plan on adding several of these to my army so if I ever do get the army painted, I’ll probably opt out of getting this one painted.

Now I know in the future, if I see this on a model to try and clean it off without removing the gates or extra resin. Should it not come clean, I’ll return in and they’ll have no reason to object to that.
   
 
Forum Index » Painting & Modeling
Go to: