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Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





 ClockworkZion wrote:
I keep seeing "toxic positivity" being used to try and shut down basically any and all positive statements lately. It's getting a bit silly.



it's hilarious to hear someone claim dakkadakka has a problem with Toxic Positivity

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in gb
Mysterious Techpriest







You don't need to place models down to go through the motions of how a process works.
It's called 'dry rolling'

The reaction system is going to succeed or fail on it's implementation; players always try to break/exploit any mechanic - that's what they do.

Part of considering this system requires knowing how many reaction points are available to the players so the two obvious points of testing are minimal points or unlimited points.
If minimal points are available then it's a rather innocuous system which a lot of people will straight up forget about.

But my fears are two-fold.
First is GW's writing quality in general (how many decades have they chased 'balance' now?)
Second is GW's writing quality when they decide they want to sell a new thing (codex creep)

The likelihood of being able to spam those points from army setup alone is high and the likelihood of additional rules enhancing that further is even higher.

That will likely become the new 'meta' because can you imaging having a fast assault army and never getting into CC because of reactions?

I'm currently chuckling at people saying 'look out sir' is gone while the new rules say the player being shot at gets to choose who takes a wound.
So nothing has changed apart from you don't have to actually say 'look out sir' or roll a dice anymore - you just choose what shots go on whom.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut





 ClockworkZion wrote:
I see we're still saying that being told that "criticizing the game without playing it leads to shallow criticism based on how you think something works without seeing if your feelings lined up in with how it actually works" is the same as being told "criticism of 30k is off topic".

Good job.


You don´t need to play the game. Watching a couple of batreps on yt will suffice in order to know how the game works.
   
Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka





Ottawa Ontario Canada

chaos0xomega wrote:
Then don't play it, its not that complicated.



I have no plans to, but you'll continue to complicate it all the same.


chaos0xomega wrote:
If you want to be a petulant child turning your nose up at the plate of scrumptious ethnic cuisine on your plate, insisting you don't like it without ever having tasted it before, then by all means continue to stick to your chicken nuggies with a side of fries.


That would be the continuing to complicate it ya. This is projection. You clearly don't take issue with petulance, fren.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 ScarletRose wrote:
chaos0xomega wrote:
Then don't play it, its not that complicated. If you want to be a petulant child turning your nose up at the plate of scrumptious ethnic cuisine on your plate, insisting you don't like it without ever having tasted it before, then by all means continue to stick to your chicken nuggies with a side of fries.


But how will he keep up his clickbait youtube channel without fresh outrage?


The one with 700 subs over 7+ years that's not monetized and averages 4-6 videos a year and mostly titanicus videos for the last 2 years? The one that's last video was a month ago and got less than 100 views because it was AT related again? That youtube? Not exactly selling t-shirts

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmm9kHLYaZwH-2RbCsNJlUg

The video in the original post is 2 months old and the last time the channel posted a video related to 30k...




Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Lord Damocles wrote:
Attack bikes with more than one wound are chicken nuggies.

I'm ok with this.


Sign me up for sweet n sour sauce too


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Toofast wrote:
 ClockworkZion wrote:
I keep seeing "toxic positivity" being used to try and shut down basically any and all positive statements lately. It's getting a bit silly.


It's pretty easy to say you like something without calling everyone who doesn't like the same thing an idiot...



Impossible sir, how dare you


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 ClockworkZion wrote:
 Crablezworth wrote:
You don't need to play to know 1 wound attack bikes is dumb and bad and stormlord super heavy transports with less capacity than a rhino isn a "wait and see" kinda thing, that's just bull poop. "This iron is less hot, I swear" "This cow fecese tastes good, I swear" like dude the FREE rules are bad, why would I pay to play something that looks bad to me? Every cent I'd have to spend on bad rules is money I wouldn't be spending on nice new plastics models. All loss, no gain on my part. Saying I couldn't possibly assess the changes without playing is just not true, fren. Here I am almost done a plastic spartan having not played 2.0 or intending to making a list for 1.0, no one can stop me it seems

No one claimed that you need to check every single thing, but you've made claims about the reaction system but refuse to play and see how it works in practice.


I assure you the powers of accurate observation aren't mine alone, but I do possess them. This is about as useful as being skeptical about water being wet. I've rarely impressed people with "how do we know all fire is hot?" philosophizing.

Here a better question, if this thread is devoid of anything useful because I haven't played 2.0 why slum it here with us know nothings?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Strg Alt wrote:
 ClockworkZion wrote:
I see we're still saying that being told that "criticizing the game without playing it leads to shallow criticism based on how you think something works without seeing if your feelings lined up in with how it actually works" is the same as being told "criticism of 30k is off topic".

Good job.


You don´t need to play the game. Watching a couple of batreps on yt will suffice in order to know how the game works.


You also only have to see a few posts of just all the stuff people purchased to know the secondary market is going to love the new plastics




Automatically Appended Next Post:
 SirDonlad wrote:


I'm currently chuckling at people saying 'look out sir' is gone while the new rules say the player being shot at gets to choose who takes a wound.
So nothing has changed apart from you don't have to actually say 'look out sir' or roll a dice anymore - you just choose what shots go on whom.


Yeah that's a good one


This message was edited 12 times. Last update was at 2022/07/03 12:38:11


Do you play 30k? It'd be a lot cooler if you did.  
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

You're rigjt, we do need a more open community discussion for people actually interested in the edition and not just posting memes.
   
Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut





@Crablezworth:

That´s funny as this is the exact same amount of HH 2.0 models which I also bought on release.
   
Made in gb
Mysterious Techpriest







This is a seriously frustrating edition.
I say that because i'm seeing the usual amount of GW but i can also get the feel they really tried to "freshen things up while not changing it too much" but that makes it all the more frustrating how it's looking overall.
i've had conversations about how the unit should be moved the rolled distance when failing a charge and the edition kind of includes that (moving half the total distance) and the reaction system sounds like it could give you that clutch moment spending the point and adding whatever inches it is to complete the charge; but the expansion of that system is going to be the death of that cool moment - partially because the points are given out all the time (with boosts etc) but mostly because the reaction system has been expanded out to a whole bunch of other potential moments including reactions by the unit being charged and the other units around them.
It becomes a literal exchange of dice before the metaphorical 'exchange of dice' in the combat phase (CC or shooting)

While i see they really tried to include some fairly niche units/models (my primus redoubt) i noted a bunch of text on including fortifications that seemed okay at first glance, the execution of those unit entries has been lamentable.
The primus redoubt is now listed as having two entrances despite the model having three for example.

The change in AP values in the new edition are contentious - i can see why they want to, but the insistence of using d6 solely for these things is the real issue and a whole bunch of units effectively got nerfed hard; and a bunch of them were already being nerfed by simplified profiles.

Examine the case of the Minotaur Artillery Battery.
Spoiler:

It started off with it's vraks profile as a AV14 super-heavy vehicle with a rule for moving and shooting.
This version could be taken by any force only as their lord of war but not the one you would choose given your other choices.
Then the Ordo Reductor had a special unit entry which reduced it's armour values but added a rear facing flare sheild to bring that side back up to AV 14 in effect, but the main feature of being a straight HS unit not super-heavy and still bringing a 7" TL S9 AP3 blast for 205 points.

Now it's profile doesn't have a flare shield, but the armour rating is still the lightweight (superlaggera!) version but it has 1 less HP, no 'blessed autosimulacra', the pintle weapon options are gone, it is now considered open-topped and costs 75 points more.
The minotaur really didn't need its weapons nerfed too. Now its primary (and only if no HK missile) weapon is now S9 AP4 5" blast with shred and pinning.

Taking Minotaurs as a heavy support choice was an Ordo Reductor only feature for what always was a super-heavy unit and i liked having my special things even if they were odd to use.
That particular unit entry seems like a double stiffing to me because not only is it a shadow of its former self - now anyone can have them in the same quantities as the only faction canonically still making them (the one which doesn't share its stuff and pisses off everyone else by claiming any which are found)

Then at the end of the fluff box; one last insult...
as well as
larger, more purpose-built
super-heavy artillery units.


They are actually trying to retcon the Minotaur Artillery Tank to have always been non-super-heavy.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in gb
Preparing the Invasion of Terra






It's based on the Malcador and the Malcador hasn't been a Superheavy for years now. The Minotaur is just catching up.
   
Made in gb
Mysterious Techpriest







 Gert wrote:
It's based on the Malcador and the Malcador hasn't been a Superheavy for years now. The Minotaur is just catching up.


accept it because misery loves company?

No, ta.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in gb
Preparing the Invasion of Terra






I mean accept it because it shouldn't be one. I didn't like the changed to the Malcador and always though that it needed something to reinstate the "fire all the guns" deal it had as a SH. But the chassis is not SH status, it's barely longer than a Leman Russ.
   
Made in gb
Mysterious Techpriest







i want some of what you've been drinking.
The leman russ i have here is juuuust over 4.5 inches long
The pair of minotaurs i have here nearly 7 inches long not including the gun barrells

When did the malcador become non-super heavy?
I seem to remember it becoming one for the solar auxillia and that being a bit of a 'thing' when they came out

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/07/03 00:23:06


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in gb
Preparing the Invasion of Terra






Its been a long time now and I can't remember when exactly.
   
Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka





Ottawa Ontario Canada

 Strg Alt wrote:
@Crablezworth:

That´s funny as this is the exact same amount of HH 2.0 models which I also bought on release.


The rhino's are cool, not sold on the kratos but its dozer blade is cool af.

Do you play 30k? It'd be a lot cooler if you did.  
   
Made in gb
Purposeful Hammerhead Pilot





 Strg Alt wrote:
 ClockworkZion wrote:
I see we're still saying that being told that "criticizing the game without playing it leads to shallow criticism based on how you think something works without seeing if your feelings lined up in with how it actually works" is the same as being told "criticism of 30k is off topic".

Good job.


You don´t need to play the game. Watching a couple of batreps on yt will suffice in order to know how the game works.


To a degree. But I disagree in this case for heresy. The game is quite different to how it appears in battle reports sofar. Plus I've noticed most of the YouTubers are playing wrong or missing alot sofar.
   
Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka





Ottawa Ontario Canada

Bobug wrote:
 Strg Alt wrote:
 ClockworkZion wrote:
I see we're still saying that being told that "criticizing the game without playing it leads to shallow criticism based on how you think something works without seeing if your feelings lined up in with how it actually works" is the same as being told "criticism of 30k is off topic".

Good job.


You don´t need to play the game. Watching a couple of batreps on yt will suffice in order to know how the game works.


To a degree. But I disagree in this case for heresy. The game is quite different to how it appears in battle reports sofar. Plus I've noticed most of the YouTubers are playing wrong or missing alot sofar.



The core mechanics have seen few improvements, and objectively with the release of the pdf its fair to say changes to many units have been anything from contentious to baffling. One doesn't need to watch battle reports or play to assess the changes unit to unit and deem them worse or better. But I mean it's difficult to defend things that appear to be mistakes, attacks bikes with one wound and super heavy transports that carry less than rhinos, that doesn't seem in line with those units and their representation, an attack bike was always 2 wounds because it had 2 marines on board, a stormlord carried 40 dudes historically, and with reason it's massive and seemingly half of them just sit on top of it, I'm not sure how anyone would all of sudden "get" the change from 40 to 10 carrying capacity by playing a game.

I guess its one thing to be upset of stats got worse on a character one liked, but there are issues past "this should be WS5". What isn't sitting well with the people I've talked to in my area are the changes to blast/artillery and ap, people have a lot invested in their armies so not being able to effectively use loved units is taking its toll for some more than others, one buddy is finishing an auxillia list, so the pdf was like a gut punch. He hasn't "played" with them yet for obvious reasons, but its not exactly surprising that he and I share the same confusion and bafflement with a lot of the changes, especially considering that regardless of how we feel about them the points are totally messed up in terms of x got worse or better but somehow got cheaper or more expensive, it feels random.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2022/07/04 13:16:26


Do you play 30k? It'd be a lot cooler if you did.  
   
Made in gb
Preparing the Invasion of Terra






How do you know the core rules have seen few improvements if you haven't read the rulebook or played the game? We've already established that a lot of YT Batreps have been getting the rules wrong (as they so often do) and your only actual rules document is a PDF with issues.
   
Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka





Ottawa Ontario Canada

 Gert wrote:
How do you know the core rules have seen few improvements if you haven't read the rulebook or played the game?


How do you know toilet water isn't delicious? The 52 minute video in the original post has me and my buddy cleary discussing all of the issues with 2.0's leaked rules, none of which have changed or are different than what we discuss regardless of what youtube channel gets what right or wrong while doing a batrep.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Gert wrote:
a PDF with issues.


Many many issues.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2022/07/07 14:54:38


Do you play 30k? It'd be a lot cooler if you did.  
   
Made in gb
Mysterious Techpriest







I was looking through the info available and got this worrying feeling that Mechanicum lists just became 'Taghmata' lists with everything special that used to define the three branches shoved into the 'head-cannon' region.


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in gb
Preparing the Invasion of Terra






 Crablezworth wrote:
How do you know toilet water isn't delicious? The 52 minute video in the original post has me and my cleary discussing all of the issues with 2.0's leaked rules, none of which have changed or are different than what we discuss regardless of what youtube channel gets what right or wrong while doing a batrep.

So have you read the rulebook and played the game? Do you have any practical experience with this ruleset at all or have you entirely based your opinion on leaks and battle reports?
I mean you do you but let's not pretend you're some kind of expert on the new edition you haven't even played.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 SirDonlad wrote:
I was looking through the info available and got this worrying feeling that Mechanicum lists just became 'Taghmata' lists with everything special that used to define the three branches shoved into the 'head-cannon' region.


How are they shoved into "head-cannon"? Right now you have just the contents page of the book to work on and you're acting like its the end of the world, chill out.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/07/04 13:53:28


 
   
Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka





Ottawa Ontario Canada

 Gert wrote:
I mean you do you


k.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Gert wrote:
let's not pretend you're some kind of expert on the new edition you haven't even played.


I've played 1.0 for approximately 7 years, hosted multiple tournaments, the majority of the battle reports on the cover slaves youtube are 30k.Which is primarily why the video talks about what is different in the new edition from 1.0. I also don't claim encyclopedic knowledge of 1.0 or 2.0, but my friend and often opponent sorta does, he was the other half the video you keep pretending isn't dealing with the rules we got, it is. He's also played games of 2.0 and confirmed everything we've talked about in the video.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2022/07/04 14:02:20


Do you play 30k? It'd be a lot cooler if you did.  
   
Made in gb
Preparing the Invasion of Terra






 Crablezworth wrote:
I've played 1.0 for approximately 7 years, hosted multiple tournaments, the majority of the battle reports on the cover slaves youtube are 30k.

Wow you hosted tournaments? Who asked?
It doesn't matter what


Which is primarily why the video talks about what is different in the new edition from 1.0. I also don't claim encyclopedic knowledge of 1.0 or 2.0, but my friend and often opponent sorta does, he was the other half the video you keep pretending isn't dealing with the rules we got, it is. He's also played games of 2.0 and confirmed everything we've talked about in the video.

The video based on leaks? That video? The video where you jumped on anyone who said you might be wrong and mocked them?
Forgive me if I don't take you seriously.
I mean all you've done is post memes and videos from a guy who's entire channel is about clickbait nerd rage. You've been passing off your video as knowledge about the edition when it isn't even based on the actual rulebook.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/07/04 14:19:32


 
   
Made in gb
Mysterious Techpriest







 Gert wrote:

So have you read the rulebook and played the game? Do you have any practical experience with this ruleset at all or have you entirely based your opinion on leaks and battle reports?
I mean you do you but let's not pretend you're some kind of expert on the new edition you haven't even played.



We get it Gert.
You like it no matter the intellectual cost.
As a sum of your contributions i'd say we're all worse off for having entertained it.

Do you actually have anything to say about the system or are you just here to point out how much better you understand it than anyone else?

Nothing about the general AP changes?
Nothing about the scrubbing of unique special rules and profiles for units?
Nothing about the disconnect between the three books?

Even when presented with a post of nothing but valid critique all you could do was try to 'own' me about super-heavy status of models.

And we have to just 'take your word' for your claim you've played games and know better?
You didn't even spot the look out sir mechanic cheese despite your claims of extensive play-testing; why should i value your insight?

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka





Ottawa Ontario Canada

 Gert wrote:

Wow you hosted tournaments? Who asked?
It doesn't matter what


You mentioned my lack of competence and expertise, so you in fact asked, you just don't care. It's almost like this is about you, you've said very little about 2.0 or offered any real counter point, you've just come at me, badly.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Gert wrote:

The video based on leaks? That video?


The one that proved to be accurate and unchanged from rules released for 2.0, that accurately described the changes and problems with said changes from 1.0 to 2.0, yes that one





 Gert wrote:

The video where you jumped on anyone who said you might be wrong and mocked them?
Forgive me if I don't take you seriously.
I mean all you've done is post memes and videos from a guy who's entire channel is about clickbait nerd rage. You've been passing off your video as knowledge about the edition when it isn't even based on the actual rulebook.


And yet you're still here, fren. Weird.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2022/07/04 14:39:29


Do you play 30k? It'd be a lot cooler if you did.  
   
Made in gb
Purposeful Hammerhead Pilot





 Crablezworth wrote:
Bobug wrote:
 Strg Alt wrote:
 ClockworkZion wrote:
I see we're still saying that being told that "criticizing the game without playing it leads to shallow criticism based on how you think something works without seeing if your feelings lined up in with how it actually works" is the same as being told "criticism of 30k is off topic".

Good job.


You don´t need to play the game. Watching a couple of batreps on yt will suffice in order to know how the game works.


To a degree. But I disagree in this case for heresy. The game is quite different to how it appears in battle reports sofar. Plus I've noticed most of the YouTubers are playing wrong or missing alot sofar.



The core mechanics have seen few improvements, and objectively with the release of the pdf its fair to say changes to many units have been anything from contentious to baffling. One doesn't need to watch battle reports or play to assess the changes unit to unit and deem them worse or better. But I mean it's difficult to defend things that appear to be mistakes, attacks bikes with one wound and super heavy transports that carry less than rhinos, that doesn't seem in line with those units and their representation, an attack bike was always 2 wounds because it had 2 marines on board, a stormlord carried 40 dudes historically, and with reason it's massive and seemingly half of them just sit on top of it, I'm not sure how anyone would all of sudden "get" the change from 40 to 10 carrying capacity by playing a game.

I guess its one thing to be upset of stats got worse on a character one liked, but there are issues past "this should be WS5". What isn't sitting well with the people I've talked to in my area are the changes to blast/artillery and ap, people have a lot invested in their armies so not being able to effectively use loved units is taking its toll for some more than others, one buddy is finishing an auxillia list, so the pdf was like a gut punch. He hasn't "played" with them yet for obvious reasons, but its not exactly surprising that he and I share the same confusion and bafflement with a lot of the changes, especially considering that regardless of how we feel about them the points are totally messed up in terms of x got worse or better but somehow got cheaper or more expensive, it feels random.


I've not got much sympathy for people moaning about artillery getting more balanced. The fact a basilisk or medusa doesn't make it's points back+some in a single shot won't really be missed. Imo it was a negative play experience for the player getting shelled. Artillery is better at pinning now though which is nice. It just won't delete an entire marine squad with no problems anymore

Get you on the pdf. Some of it is really well done. Some is obviously just phoned in or wasnt proof read. 1w attack bikes and capacity 10 storm lords are obvious mistakes. As is 1attack dark sons of death
   
Made in gb
Preparing the Invasion of Terra






 SirDonlad wrote:

Nothing about the general AP changes?
Nothing about the scrubbing of unique special rules and profiles for units?
Nothing about the disconnect between the three books?

There was too much AP2 spam in HH 1. Medusas especially where just stupidly good and Plasma was just a default choice for special weapons.
The cutting of a bunch of units isn't a problem for me as much as I thought it would be, mostly because almost everything got added back in anyway. Havocs going from (again) insanely good to just good is fine IMO. I like the Iron Warriors rules and Hammer of Olympia is actually something I'm using now.
I haven't noticed a huge disconnect. Out group seems to be doing just fine with our Legions.

Even when presented with a post of nothing but valid critique all you could do was try to 'own' me about super-heavy status of models.

Wut? I said that it was good that the Malcador chassis vehicles have all been brought to the same level. Its not my fault you didn't know the chassis hasn't been used as Superheavy for ages.

And we have to just 'take your word' for your claim you've played games and know better?
You didn't even spot the look out sir mechanic cheese despite your claims of extensive play-testing; why should i value your insight?

What mechanic is this? Sorry if I missed it but our group isn't actively looking for ways to break the system.
   
Made in gb
Mysterious Techpriest







 Gert wrote:
 SirDonlad wrote:

Nothing about the general AP changes?
Nothing about the scrubbing of unique special rules and profiles for units?
Nothing about the disconnect between the three books?

There was too much AP2 spam in HH 1. Medusas especially where just stupidly good and Plasma was just a default choice for special weapons.
The cutting of a bunch of units isn't a problem for me as much as I thought it would be, mostly because almost everything got added back in anyway. Havocs going from (again) insanely good to just good is fine IMO. I like the Iron Warriors rules and Hammer of Olympia is actually something I'm using now.
I haven't noticed a huge disconnect. Out group seems to be doing just fine with our Legions.


I never heard anyone complain about the amount of AP2 that was available; it was the strength 10 and therefore 'instant death' nature of the medusa and it's free phosphex sheels, that did, but never the fact units had AP2.
Same with the quad-mortar - nobody complained about the AP3 but they did complain about the four small blasts per model in the unit along with phosphex crawling death rule.

I guess you didn't bother to kitbash units which didn't have an official model.

 Gert wrote:

Wut? I said that it was good that the Malcador chassis vehicles have all been brought to the same level. Its not my fault you didn't know the chassis hasn't been used as Superheavy for ages.


Just stop.
You admitted yourself that you don't actually know when earlier in the thread.
i went and checked out my books and found that the malcador is actually STILL super-heavy for the solar auxillia; they just get to take them as ordinary units without using up their lord of war slot.
In fact do you not remember when super-heavies were expanded and FW literally said that the reason their profiles were better in 30k was because they knew how to maintain them properly back then?
The malcador become a 'fast' super-heavy; remember that?

 Gert wrote:
What mechanic is this? Sorry if I missed it but our group isn't actively looking for ways to break the system.


The claim is that 'look out sir' was removed because of how ridiculous it was to have marines jumping out of cover to take a bullet for their sarge like they're defending a hoop in the last seconds - but in 2.0 the player who owns the unit being shot chooses which model takes which wound without saying anything or even rolling a dice to see if successful or not.

It's literally what you do every combat and your group didn't see that coming?!?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/07/04 14:55:48


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in gb
Purposeful Hammerhead Pilot





The malcador hasn't been superheavy for a few years. It got changed in the FAQ
   
Made in gb
Mysterious Techpriest







What? The one in 2019?

edit: >checks update folder<

Yeah, you're right it was in the 2019 errata.

I'm blanking the lockdown years from my memory apparently.


edit 2: Wait a sec...

That means the superleggera Ordo Reductor variant actually started the scale demotion because later rules writers didn't 'get' that my guys were making a special version of their own.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/07/04 22:27:09


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..  
   
Made in si
Foxy Wildborne







 SirDonlad wrote:
I'm blanking the lockdown years from my memory apparently.


Yea we all seem to do that. You straight up have to add +2 years to however long ago you feel something was

Posters on ignore list: 36

40k Potica Edition - 40k patch with reactions, suppression and all that good stuff. Feedback thread here.

Gangs of Nu Ork - Necromunda / Gorkamorka expansion supporting all faction. Feedback thread here
   
Made in us
Storm Trooper with Maglight



Cadia

 SirDonlad wrote:
Examine the case of the Minotaur Artillery Battery.


Or look at what they did to the poor Macharius. It used to be a proper heavy tank, not quite as well armed as a Baneblade but carrying a legitimate big gun and protected by AV 14. Now it's nerfed to AV 13, the former 7" blast battle cannon is now a twin-linked AP4 small blast with 24" range. For 600 ***ING POINTS. WTF is this trash and why does GW think it's acceptable to publish such stupid rules?

THE PLANET BROKE BEFORE THE GUARD! 
   
 
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