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Another person at my club just bought the Recruit Edition and finished assembling the minis.

So I'm gonna have a game with him later on after he practised wth one of the employees.

So I have to ask what is the proper Ork counterparts to the Necron Royal Warden and Space Marine Primaris Lieutenant?

Are Warbosses who's in charge for a typical bunch of Orky Squads in the way Royal Wardens and Primaris Lieutenants are?

Basically what unit would be included as an individual who's his own solo unit sorta functioning like Age of Sigmar's Heroes which (which Primaris Lieutenants and Royal Warden's sorta act like) if Orks were included in a Recruit Edition Set instead of Necrons to take the place of a Royal Warden to counterbattle the Primaris Lieutenant? So who would be the Orky special unit instead of the current Recruit Edition's included Royal Warden?

Currently, there isn't one.

Warboss is at the top, titles for lieutenants can vary. Nobz are, in general, a group of lieutenants, but they're currently just treated like sergeants or better units.

A Nob, Bigboss or others could fill the role, but the current ork codex doesn't really fill things out that well, so there just isn't an equivalent.

As said above the Orks doen't really have a direct equivalent to a Royal Warden or Primaris Lieutenant.

If you want to have an Ork HQ option that isn't a Warboss, you might want to look at a Big Mek or Weirdboy.

There used to be a more codified ranking system for Orks; Boy, Nob, Boss Nob, Bigboss, Warboss. The current nobz unit should all be boss nobz but that got switched around for some reason.
Also, every tribe was led by a bigboss who didn’t become a warboss until they met and beat another tribe. Orks being Orks that was both custom and biology; warbosses lead multiple tribes and the act of taking over another tribe was the level of combat stimulus required to bulk up to that level.
I have no idea why the bigboss rank was dropped between editions but then the same happened to all the factions. I assume someone thought it was “too complicated” or something.

Going back the original fluff, the ranking was Warboss, or warlord for an especially powerful boss, these guys ran tribes or warbands, a powerful warboss could lead groups of tribes but would most likely take the warlord title if he did.

Nobz were the nobles, there were four titles for Nobz, in descending order of seniority, clanboss, bigboss, drillboss and boss. They either lead boyz or were grouped into Nobz mobs.

Each warboss had his houshold Nobz in his retinue and a bigmob of boyz (twice the size of any others). Other households of boyz were lead by Nobz.

In second edition there was a lieutenant class of boss called a bigboss.

Nothing now to represent a 2nd in command.

Andykp wrote:
Going back the original fluff, the ranking was Warboss, or warlord for an especially powerful boss, these guys ran tribes or warbands, a powerful warboss could lead groups of tribes but would most likely take the warlord title if he did.

Nobz were the nobles, there were four titles for Nobz, in descending order of seniority, clanboss, bigboss, drillboss and boss. They either lead boyz or were grouped into Nobz mobs.

Each warboss had his houshold Nobz in his retinue and a bigmob of boyz (twice the size of any others). Other households of boyz were lead by Nobz.

In second edition there was a lieutenant class of boss called a bigboss.

Nothing now to represent a 2nd in command.

I thought a BigBoss was a closer equivalent to a SM Captain, and a Warboss more akin to Chapter Master. I don't remember the clanboss or other classes of Ork bosses at all! I must be getting old.

Aash wrote:

Andykp wrote:
Going back the original fluff, the ranking was Warboss, or warlord for an especially powerful boss, these guys ran tribes or warbands, a powerful warboss could lead groups of tribes but would most likely take the warlord title if he did.

Nobz were the nobles, there were four titles for Nobz, in descending order of seniority, clanboss, bigboss, drillboss and boss. They either lead boyz or were grouped into Nobz mobs.

Each warboss had his houshold Nobz in his retinue and a bigmob of boyz (twice the size of any others). Other households of boyz were lead by Nobz.

In second edition there was a lieutenant class of boss called a bigboss.

Nothing now to represent a 2nd in command.

I thought a BigBoss was a closer equivalent to a SM Captain, and a Warboss more akin to Chapter Master. I don't remember the clanboss or other classes of Ork bosses at all! I must be getting old.

I am going a long way back, but I still read these books often, they are my orky bibles.

From waargh the ORKS and ere we go.

Aash wrote:

Andykp wrote:
Going back the original fluff, the ranking was Warboss, or warlord for an especially powerful boss, these guys ran tribes or warbands, a powerful warboss could lead groups of tribes but would most likely take the warlord title if he did.

Nobz were the nobles, there were four titles for Nobz, in descending order of seniority, clanboss, bigboss, drillboss and boss. They either lead boyz or were grouped into Nobz mobs.

Each warboss had his houshold Nobz in his retinue and a bigmob of boyz (twice the size of any others). Other households of boyz were lead by Nobz.

In second edition there was a lieutenant class of boss called a bigboss.

Nothing now to represent a 2nd in command.

I thought a BigBoss was a closer equivalent to a SM Captain, and a Warboss more akin to Chapter Master. I don't remember the clanboss or other classes of Ork bosses at all! I must be getting old.

In 2nd ed, the Orks had Warboss, Big Boss, Freebooter Kaptin, Blood Axe Kommando Kaptin, Drill Boss, Nobz. Freebooter Kaptin, Kommando Kaptin, and Drill Boss were "Hero" level characters for Freebooters, Kommandoes, Stormboyz respectively.

To me the Lieutenants would be the Big Bosses (Freebooter Kaptin, Kommando Kaptin, and Drill Boss being specialist Lieutenants). Captains would be Warboss, and Chapter Masters are Warlords.

I don’t think it would kill 5em to bring back a big boss character to fill that 2nd in command/trusted advisor role Lts and royal warden fill. Could be a good excuse for some more interesting character sculpts too.

Orks don't have the complicated hierarchy and many specialist roles as Space Marines do. And it's okay.

bibotot wrote:
Orks don't have the complicated hierarchy and many specialist roles as Space Marines do. And it's okay.

They kind of do, the have ranks as described above. There is a definite hierarchy, easily as complicated as Captain, Lt, sgt. (Warlord, warboss, Nobz of various levels). As for specialists they have very similar to the marines, mek, painboy, no chaplain but do have a runtherd.

It'd actually be a warboss.

IIRC a warboss is just a kind of generic "leader" of a warband. Warbands themselves can range from a hundred odd orks to several thousand, but they're pretty "small" in the grand scheme of how orks actually deploy. They're basically lieutenants themselves.

Warlords are where orks get big, as they're the ones that the warbosses answer to (when one is present, otherwise you'll just have a few warbosses and their warbands all squabbling with eachother for control.

Nobz are kinda like sergeants themselves. Though the lines are muddy given a nob is usually promoted via killing his warboss and taking his place, much as a boy becomes a nob by killing his nob and taking his place.

I don't think Orks need a lieutenant when the command flow chart is:


Me wot does da krumpin' --> Everybody else.

 Olthannon wrote:
I don't think Orks need a lieutenant when the command flow chart is:


Me wot does da krumpin' --> Everybody else.

That’s an example of the way ORKS are portrayed now making them very one dimensional and dull in my opinion. Orks always had advisors and seconds to do the graft of leadership. They aren’t mindless thugs but they seem to have devolved into a meme of what they really are recently.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 morganfreeman wrote:
It'd actually be a warboss.

IIRC a warboss is just a kind of generic "leader" of a warband. Warbands themselves can range from a hundred odd orks to several thousand, but they're pretty "small" in the grand scheme of how orks actually deploy. They're basically lieutenants themselves.

Warlords are where orks get big, as they're the ones that the warbosses answer to (when one is present, otherwise you'll just have a few warbosses and their warbands all squabbling with eachother for control.

Nobz are kinda like sergeants themselves. Though the lines are muddy given a nob is usually promoted via killing his warboss and taking his place, much as a boy becomes a nob by killing his nob and taking his place.

Not really, a warboss is the top of his local food chain, they don’t sit around waiting for someone bigger to come and tell them what to do. In their area a warboss is the top dog, answers to no one. Another warboss or warlord coming in and wanting to take charge would have to prove himself.

Andykp wrote:

 Olthannon wrote:
I don't think Orks need a lieutenant when the command flow chart is:


Me wot does da krumpin' --> Everybody else.

That’s an example of the way ORKS are portrayed now making them very one dimensional and dull in my opinion. Orks always had advisors and seconds to do the graft of leadership. They aren’t mindless thugs but they seem to have devolved into a meme of what they really are recently.

They're still a little more complicated than that. Each Warboss will still have a group of nobs under them that will advise them or help them. Each Warboss will also have a Big Mek and, usually, a Weirdboy.

Of course this hierarchy is subject to infighting and isn't going to be particularly stable so it fits the meme, but it's not pure chaos.

And hey, you can always justify your Waaaagh being more organized because most of the orks have that "stormboy" gene that makes them a little more regimented than a typical ork. Or maybe all of the leaders of the waaaagh are former stormboys.

 Grey Templar wrote:

Andykp wrote:

 Olthannon wrote:
I don't think Orks need a lieutenant when the command flow chart is:


Me wot does da krumpin' --> Everybody else.

That’s an example of the way ORKS are portrayed now making them very one dimensional and dull in my opinion. Orks always had advisors and seconds to do the graft of leadership. They aren’t mindless thugs but they seem to have devolved into a meme of what they really are recently.

They're still a little more complicated than that. Each Warboss will still have a group of nobs under them that will advise them or help them. Each Warboss will also have a Big Mek and, usually, a Weirdboy.

Of course this hierarchy is subject to infighting and isn't going to be particularly stable so it fits the meme, but it's not pure chaos.

And hey, you can always justify your Waaaagh being more organized because most of the orks have that "stormboy" gene that makes them a little more regimented than a typical ork. Or maybe all of the leaders of the waaaagh are former stormboys.

I know it’s more complicated than that and you know it’s more complex than that, but sadly many don’t because they are written as simple mindless thugs. That’s great as how he imperium sees them but the reality should be different.

As others have said, in the fluff there's Bosses, Big Bosses, Kaptins, etc.

In terms of game design, I think the closest we have at the moment is maybe the Waaagh Banner Nob.