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 vipoid wrote:

 Eldarsif wrote:

 vipoid wrote:

 Shakalooloo wrote:

Tyel wrote:
If Lelith remains a 90 point character then she's probably going to be "okay". We wait on stuff - but perhaps more so than she's ever been.
But in the Timmy-stakes as we review each faction's top dog, its a bit pathetic.

Hopefully, once the codex rolls around, Lord Vect will put everyone in their place with a new model.

Please no.

Dark Eldar haven't had a new unit in 12? 13? years now.

The last thing I want is for their entire release to be spent on a single special character who would inevitably be ridiculously overdone.

How about we focus on expanding the generic characters first and then consider supplementing them with special characters?

I honestly think Drukhari are in Fyreslayer territory when it comes to sales. So only one new HQ(or redo) is what I expect at this moment.

If they were going to give us a new HQ, they probably wouldn't have worded the detachment abilities to refer exclusively to the existing HQs.

Isn't Realspace Raiders calling out keywords there, rather than specific units?

I don't have the DE book, but doesn't Lelith have the Succubus keyword, for example, or Urien Rakarth the Haemonculi one?

Nothing stopping a new HQ being added that could have one of those keywords - though I'd rather see one or more new units, even as someone with no interest in playing DE.

 nordsturmking wrote:

Necronmaniac05 wrote:
Why have they changed the rules for obscuring on ruins? Seems like now Towering units like Knights ignore obscuring both ways so they cannot be obscured but you can't be obscured back either? Seems a little screwed up to me?

I don't understand why do you think it is screwed up?

Well, because now nothing can hide from a Towering unit like a Castellan unless you literally cannot see any part of it. Given most GW terrain kits have more holes in than a piece of swiss cheese and/or the units you might want to protect are too big to be completely hidden (silent king or Avatar for example) this means you'll practically never be able to hide. Meanwhile the Knight can stand virtually anywhere on the table and shoot almost anything it wants.

Necronmaniac05 wrote:

 nordsturmking wrote:

Necronmaniac05 wrote:
Why have they changed the rules for obscuring on ruins? Seems like now Towering units like Knights ignore obscuring both ways so they cannot be obscured but you can't be obscured back either? Seems a little screwed up to me?

I don't understand why do you think it is screwed up?

Well, because now nothing can hide from a Towering unit like a Castellan unless you literally cannot see any part of it. Given most GW terrain kits have more holes in than a piece of swiss cheese and/or the units you might want to protect are too big to be completely hidden (silent king or Avatar for example) this means you'll practically never be able to hide. Meanwhile the Knight can stand virtually anywhere on the table and shoot almost anything it wants.

hm ok but wasn't that also the case in 9th with the only difference that models with 18+ wounds could be shot at from hidden units?

Edit: Ah ok i see waht you mean. Now obscuring does not affect towering models. So we are back at what people in 8th did where they house ruled that the windows on runis 1 floor are considered to be closed.
I think it is only fair that knights can shoot at everything that can shoot at them.

 vipoid wrote:


If they were going to give us a new HQ, they probably wouldn't have worded the detachment abilities to refer exclusively to the existing HQs.

Of course new models would come with codex at which point detachments can be redone.

 Dysartes wrote:

I don't have the DE book, but doesn't Lelith have the Succubus keyword, for example, or Urien Rakarth the Haemonculi one?

Nothing stopping a new HQ being added that could have one of those keywords - though I'd rather see one or more new units, even as someone with no interest in playing DE.

That's true but outside of special characters (which bore me to death) it doesn't exactly leave much scope for expanding the HQ section.

You could perhaps split the Haemonculus into Lesser and Ancient flavours.

However, it would be a little strange if a Dracon was given the Archon keyword. It would be like a SM Lieutenant having the Chapter Master keyword.

Moreover, it means that anything not falling into those three categories (e.g. Mandrake, Scourge, Incubi HQs etc.) are off the table immediately.

Or they could bring back the lieutenant level DE HQs- Dracons are specifically lieutenants to Archons, Succubus were split into Archites and Drachites, and Haemonculous had Ancients as a senior level.

3 clampacks, plastic Tantalus with option for Vect on dais and foot as a lord of war, mandrakes in plastic would be a good start for a DE model wave.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Or they could bring back the lieutenant level DE HQs- Dracons are specifically lieutenants to Archons, Succubus were split into Archites and Drachites, and Haemonculous had Ancients as a senior level.

The problem is that those lesser HQs offer DE next to nothing at this point. They don't solve any of the faction's issues.

What's a Dracon? A cheap, weak Kabal HQ with less access to wargear.

Oh wait, I just described an Archon.


What's a Lesser Haemonculus? A cheap, weak Coven HQ with less access to wargear.

Oh wait, I just described a Haemonculus. No, I tell a lie, he currently pays through the nose for his complete lack of wargear and utility.

So I guess a Lesser Haemonculus would be exactly the same as the current Haemonculus but properly costed?


Point being, there are HQs you could add that don't fit into the Archon, Succubus, Haemonculus paradigm that could offer something to the faction. However, lesser HQs will not offer anything until GW actually fixes the main HQs. And they have demonstrated time after time that they have no interest in doing anything but stamping on them further.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Hellebore wrote:
Other than that, a psychic blast is mechanically just a gun, so treating it as one is not an issue for me.

Changing them to weird guns isn't what bothers me, and I certainly don't care whether there's a psychic phase or not. It's that there's no choice and powers are set per model type.

So basically we're back 3rd edition. Early 3rd edition, 1999-2000. Time to break out my skinny black jeans and Phantom Menace T-Shirt.

I see you missed the JNCO jeans and wallet chain craze

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:


Holy @#$% HBMC changed avatars?! This is like a once in a decade thing!

I decided to bring Commissar Calgar back, and thought the Chibi Commissar face was perfect.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I decided to bring Commissar Calgar back, and thought the Chibi Commissar face was perfect.

I think I remember spinning Commissar the most. Unless I'm confusing you with someone else with my old brain.

 The Red Hobbit wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Hellebore wrote:
Other than that, a psychic blast is mechanically just a gun, so treating it as one is not an issue for me.

Changing them to weird guns isn't what bothers me, and I certainly don't care whether there's a psychic phase or not. It's that there's no choice and powers are set per model type.

So basically we're back 3rd edition. Early 3rd edition, 1999-2000. Time to break out my skinny black jeans and Phantom Menace T-Shirt.

I see you missed the JNCO jeans and wallet chain craze

Just broke out my Class of 1990 t-shirt so Kyoto Secunda would have something 'vintage' to wear for her school's Time Travel Tuesday.

Which would be equivalent of my dad lending me something from 1957...

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
So basically we're back 3rd edition. Early 3rd edition, 1999-2000. Time to break out my skinny black jeans and Phantom Menace T-Shirt.

Well the fleshy Emperor picture that people were talking about is from the 3rd edition book, so basically confirmed 10th = 3rd.

 vipoid wrote:

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Or they could bring back the lieutenant level DE HQs- Dracons are specifically lieutenants to Archons, Succubus were split into Archites and Drachites, and Haemonculous had Ancients as a senior level.

The problem is that those lesser HQs offer DE next to nothing at this point. They don't solve any of the faction's issues.

What's a Dracon? A cheap, weak Kabal HQ with less access to wargear.

Oh wait, I just described an Archon.


What's a Lesser Haemonculus? A cheap, weak Coven HQ with less access to wargear.

Oh wait, I just described a Haemonculus. No, I tell a lie, he currently pays through the nose for his complete lack of wargear and utility.

So I guess a Lesser Haemonculus would be exactly the same as the current Haemonculus but properly costed?


Point being, there are HQs you could add that don't fit into the Archon, Succubus, Haemonculus paradigm that could offer something to the faction. However, lesser HQs will not offer anything until GW actually fixes the main HQs. And they have demonstrated time after time that they have no interest in doing anything but stamping on them further.

What is a Space Marine Lt but just a weaker Captain?

 AduroT wrote:

 vipoid wrote:

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Or they could bring back the lieutenant level DE HQs- Dracons are specifically lieutenants to Archons, Succubus were split into Archites and Drachites, and Haemonculous had Ancients as a senior level.

The problem is that those lesser HQs offer DE next to nothing at this point. They don't solve any of the faction's issues.

What's a Dracon? A cheap, weak Kabal HQ with less access to wargear.

Oh wait, I just described an Archon.


What's a Lesser Haemonculus? A cheap, weak Coven HQ with less access to wargear.

Oh wait, I just described a Haemonculus. No, I tell a lie, he currently pays through the nose for his complete lack of wargear and utility.

So I guess a Lesser Haemonculus would be exactly the same as the current Haemonculus but properly costed?


Point being, there are HQs you could add that don't fit into the Archon, Succubus, Haemonculus paradigm that could offer something to the faction. However, lesser HQs will not offer anything until GW actually fixes the main HQs. And they have demonstrated time after time that they have no interest in doing anything but stamping on them further.

What is a Space Marine Lt but just a weaker Captain?

Which still uses the marine profile and weapons making it quite good.

 AduroT wrote:

 vipoid wrote:

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Or they could bring back the lieutenant level DE HQs- Dracons are specifically lieutenants to Archons, Succubus were split into Archites and Drachites, and Haemonculous had Ancients as a senior level.

The problem is that those lesser HQs offer DE next to nothing at this point. They don't solve any of the faction's issues.

What's a Dracon? A cheap, weak Kabal HQ with less access to wargear.

Oh wait, I just described an Archon.


What's a Lesser Haemonculus? A cheap, weak Coven HQ with less access to wargear.

Oh wait, I just described a Haemonculus. No, I tell a lie, he currently pays through the nose for his complete lack of wargear and utility.

So I guess a Lesser Haemonculus would be exactly the same as the current Haemonculus but properly costed?


Point being, there are HQs you could add that don't fit into the Archon, Succubus, Haemonculus paradigm that could offer something to the faction. However, lesser HQs will not offer anything until GW actually fixes the main HQs. And they have demonstrated time after time that they have no interest in doing anything but stamping on them further.

What is a Space Marine Lt but just a weaker Captain?

There are about 30 "different" Captains and Lts to represent the wargaear choices other factions no longer have access to

 vipoid wrote:

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Or they could bring back the lieutenant level DE HQs- Dracons are specifically lieutenants to Archons, Succubus were split into Archites and Drachites, and Haemonculous had Ancients as a senior level.

The problem is that those lesser HQs offer DE next to nothing at this point. They don't solve any of the faction's issues.

At this point I don't think GW really cares about that. It's more about releasing a cool HQ.

Blades of Khorne has 17 hero units and a lot of overlapping between them. I am lucky if I use around 20% of them.

GSC https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/05/30/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-genestealer-cults-2/

Battleline units add 3 to the roll and you need a 4+ for cult Ambush? So... Battleline just automatically suceed... couldn't they have just said that instead?

 Shadow Walker wrote:
GSC https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/05/30/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-genestealer-cults-2/

Necrons eat your mechanical hearts out.

GSCs are the real masters of revival.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Battleline units add 3 to the roll and you need a 4+ for cult Ambush? So... Battleline just automatically suceed... couldn't they have just said that instead?

Technically 1s indicate always a failure.

 Eldarsif wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Battleline units add 3 to the roll and you need a 4+ for cult Ambush? So... Battleline just automatically suceed... couldn't they have just said that instead?

Technically 1s indicate always a failure.

But then why add +3 at all? You could achieve the same thing with +2.

 Eldarsif wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Battleline units add 3 to the roll and you need a 4+ for cult Ambush? So... Battleline just automatically suceed... couldn't they have just said that instead?

Technically 1s indicate always a failure.

Then they should just give Battleline units a +2 instead, for consistency and to avoid arguments

Anyway, the enemy still needs to come close to an ambush token to trigger it, so it can be avoided and needs some skill to use, but on the other hand can also be used tactically for area denial etc.; overall good and flavourful.

Shame that they cannot bring Aircraft from IG. Maybe there is a new GSC flying machine hidden somewhere?

 vipoid wrote:
But then why add +3 at all? You could achieve the same thing with +2.

There could be other modifiers.

 vipoid wrote:

 Eldarsif wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Battleline units add 3 to the roll and you need a 4+ for cult Ambush? So... Battleline just automatically suceed... couldn't they have just said that instead?

Technically 1s indicate always a failure.

But then why add +3 at all? You could achieve the same thing with +2.

As I do not have the entire GSC rules at my disposal I cannot answer.

However, I assume it is because some things can lower or raise the target number meaning that the extra +1 matters.

Again, I do not have the entire rules for GSC so these are only my personal assumptions. Could even be that 1 does not indicate a failure in this test even if it means so for other tests.

 Eldarsif wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Battleline units add 3 to the roll and you need a 4+ for cult Ambush? So... Battleline just automatically suceed... couldn't they have just said that instead?

Technically 1s indicate always a failure.

Not true. The rule book defines when a 1 fails.

 Eldarsif wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Battleline units add 3 to the roll and you need a 4+ for cult Ambush? So... Battleline just automatically suceed... couldn't they have just said that instead?

Technically 1s indicate always a failure.

Only if the roll itself explicitly says so like with Hitting, Wounding and Saving. Cult Ambush doesn't say anything like that though.

 Shadow Walker wrote:
Shame that they cannot bring Aircraft from IG. Maybe there is a new GSC flying machine hidden somewhere?

Yeah would have have been lore friendly to be able to get anything but named characters.....and there is already a pts limit.

Some weird things in there.

First- the cultists. Hybrid firearm covers everything from shotguns to lasguns. Autopistols exist, but because the leader had the option to take autopistol or bolt pistol, 'leader pistols' now exist.

Webbers are 'what the hell?' weapons.
Icons fight with cult ambush in a weird way.


Second, Cult Ambush. This is horrifyingly dependent on what you're facing. Against a static gunline, its pretty amazing. Against a fast zippy army (or teleporting grey knights), its really terrible.

Of course, against anyone, you don't actually want to use the 9" limit, because the enemy inching forward even a bit kills your reinforcements.

Interesting that your guys come on during your opponent's reinforcement step.

This feels potentially interesting, but pretty wild in variation of how it can play out on tables.

Sad the Patriarch loses access to offensive psychic powers (other than making nearby enemies soil their underwear, possibly). But if he leads a unit of Purestrains, that is a lot of devastating wounds going on.

Doesn't seem to be anything in his rules like fanatical devotion, i.e. cultists taking a bullet for him, beyond what every other character gets in the game. He remains fairly squishy for "the" HQ character. Still, I liked the Purestrain profile from the Tyranid reveal, so pretty happy overall.

I will have fun making ambush markers...