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1 Arch Heretic (HQ) @ 84 Pts
Power Weapon (x1); Bolt Pistol (x1)
Daemonic Speed; Daemonic Strength; #Furious Charge; Daemonic Aura

3 Obliterator Cult (Elites) @ 210 Pts

6 Blood Pact Death Squad (Elites) @ 107 Pts
Lasguns (x5); Plasma Gun (x1); Demolition Charge(x1); Frag Grenades;
#Infiltrate

6 Blood Pact Death Squad (Elites) @ 107 Pts
Lasguns (x5); Meltagun (x1); Demolition Charge(x1); Frag Grenades;
#Infiltrate

6 Chaos Space Marines (Troops) (cs) @ 109 Pts
Bolter (x4); Lascannon (x1); Plasma Gun (x1)

8 Chaos Space Marines (Troops) (cs) @ 132 Pts
Bolter (x6); Missile Launcher (x1); Plasma Gun (x1)

15 Mutants (Troops) @ 223 Pts
Leaping; CC Weapon; Flamer (x2); Frag Grenades
1 Mutant Boss
Power fist

14 Traitors (Troops) @ 150 Pts
Lasgun (x12); Heavy Bolter (x1); Plasma Gun (x1);
1 Agitator

6 Traitors (Troops) @ 53 Pts
Lasgun (x5); Sniper rifle (x1);

6 Traitors (Troops) @ 63 Pts
Lasgun (x5); Autocannon (x1);

10 Chaos Hounds (Fast Attack) @ 100 Pts

10 Chaos Hounds (Fast Attack) @ 100 Pts

6 Rough Riders (Fast Attack) @ 92 Pts
Laspistol and CCW (x4); Meltagun (x2); Melta Bombs

1 Chaos Defiler (Heavy Support) @ 190 Pts
Parasitic Possession [40]

1 Basilisk (Heavy Support) @ 125 Pts
Hull Heavy Bolter

1 Leman Russ Battle Tank (Heavy Support) @ 160 Pts
Hull Heavy Bolter; Track Guards; Extra Armour

Total Army Cost: 2005


This is my first list fot the Latd as I'm currently assembling and building the models.

Feel free to comment and critic.

Mat

I'd dink the melta guns on the Rough Riders. The bombs have a better range than the guns due to fleet. If you want them to have some kind of shooting, plasma is the way to go for pinging 'rines and skimmers. I'm also uncertain whether you wouldn't just be better off taking an "ordinary" 61 point unit with lances and a sergeant.

Well I have enough anti marine shooting in my list, and they're meant to tackle tanks.Against heavy skimmers or preds for example 2 meltaguns and meltabombs aren't too much i think.

6 rough riders are very vulenrable targets. It's going to be a finess unit.

Gah.... the horror... the horror.....  please tell me you're going for a theme..... and not going for effectiveness.... If you want effectiveness.... I'm going to try and salvage something.... it's not all bad.... just about 85%...  but if you're going for a theme.... best of luck to you. Lets go through this one at a time... and slowly...

1 Arch Heretic (HQ) @ 84 Pts

Power Weapon (x1); Bolt Pistol (x1)

Daemonic Speed; Daemonic Strength; #Furious Charge; Daemonic Aura

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Why even bother? It's 84 points for basically a veteran sergeant. Instead take yourself a bloodthirster and a chaos lord, or just a blood thirster, but a BT and a DP= big problems for your opponent

3 Obliterator Cult (Elites) @ 210 Pts

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I hate these guys, they're horrible.... if you want to take them and spend an hour assembling each one, just to have them killed, go ahead. These guys are one shot wonders, you deepstrike them in, they fire at a tank, kill it, and then get taken out themselves. If you ever want them to make their points back, drop them to only 2 men.

6 Blood Pact Death Squad (Elites) @ 107 Pts

Lasguns (x5); Plasma Gun (x1); Demolition Charge(x1); Frag Grenades;

#Infiltrate



6 Blood Pact Death Squad (Elites) @ 107 Pts

Lasguns (x5); Meltagun (x1); Demolition Charge(x1); Frag Grenades;

#Infiltrate

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You do realize that for 105 points you get 5 marines with a missile launcher? I'd take 5 marines over 6 of these guys any day of the week.... I'd drop them, as they're not even in the codex, andjust take regular traitors with lascannons

6 Chaos Space Marines (Troops) (cs) @ 109 Pts

Bolter (x4); Lascannon (x1); Plasma Gun (x1)

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I like everything here but the plasma gun.... It's a waste, anything that the you need the lascannon to kill, the plasma gun isn't going to help, and anything else, enough bolter fire will take care of it.... besides there is nothing like seeing a 25 point model kill itself.

8 Chaos Space Marines (Troops) (cs) @ 132 Pts

Bolter (x6); Missile Launcher (x1); Plasma Gun (x1)

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Same thing about the plasma gun and please drop the number of models to 5 or 6 immediatly..... It's a shame to hafta waste 6 or 7 bolter shots a turn when you hafta kill a tank.

15 Mutants (Troops) @ 223 Pts

Leaping; CC Weapon; Flamer (x2); Frag Grenades

1 Mutant Boss

Power fist

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BAD BAD BAD DOG! BAD! NO KIBBLES FOR YOU! If you want fast mutants, take chaos hounds..... they've even got a better strength and are much cheaper. Mutants should be 15-20 man foot pounders with a boss with a powerfist... flamers are even a waste on them, as you can expect these guys to be dead wether or not they're fleeting.... you take them so you don't hafta take 15 man traitor squads and every now and then they do something.

14 Traitors (Troops) @ 150 Pts

Lasgun (x12); Heavy Bolter (x1); Plasma Gun (x1);

1 Agitator
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BAD BAD BAD  the Agitator makes them what, LD 6, LD 7? You can expect this squad to run away every game, giving your enemy an easy 150 points..... the key to armies with low LD is target saturation.... a unit can only shoot one target a turn, and therefor can only make that one target run away.... why make it a big target when you can make it a little one? 2 squads of mutants for core, then little squads of traitors for anti-tank

6 Traitors (Troops) @ 53 Pts

Lasgun (x5); Sniper rifle (x1);



6 Traitors (Troops) @ 63 Pts

Lasgun (x5); Autocannon (x1);
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NO! LAscannons, not sniper rifles and autocannons.... you don't have enough anti tank as it is.


10 Chaos Hounds (Fast Attack) @ 100 Pts



10 Chaos Hounds (Fast Attack) @ 100 Pts

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Good choice, now ditch the rough riders and add another squad of these boys....

6 Rough Riders (Fast Attack) @ 92 Pts

Laspistol and CCW (x4); Meltagun (x2); Melta Bombs



1 Chaos Defiler (Heavy Support) @ 190 Pts

Parasitic Possession [40]

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Why? Take a basilisk instead....

1 Basilisk (Heavy Support) @ 125 Pts

Hull Heavy Bolter



1 Leman Russ Battle Tank (Heavy Support) @ 160 Pts

Hull Heavy Bolter; Track Guards; Extra Armour

 

Overall problems: Your list has expensive units that are supposed to engage the enemy quickly, Sacrificial units that are supposed to slow the enemy down, and then shooty units..... know the problem? Your expensive combat units will engage the enemy too quickly (if they engage at all), leaving your sacrificial units useless.... you can't throw a demo charge on a unit in combat, and your shooty units will have nothing to shoot at.... Having a slow horde and lots of shooty and sacrificial units work well, or having a small elite units that can survive in combat for several turns.... say bloodletters.... and hold up one side of the enemies army while your shooty destroys the other side works well... but right now, as it looks, your army will be stumbling all over itself, getting in its own way

Angron thanks for the comments even if you're a bit harsh with me !

First I am playing a themed army as you said but it is meant to be quite effective.

I do have a Khorne CSM army by the way with BT, DP, Letters and so on and didn't want to play with the same army plus some mutants and traitors.

I personally like oblits and they have been effective for me so far.

You may be right about the mutants they're really expensive for what they'll do, same for the traitors so I'll follow your advice.

But I'll keep multiple shot weapons on the traitors, as lascannons are more expensive on them than on marines.

I also plan to convert some rough riders so I really want to use them, plus they're cheap and will scare the enemy.

Regarding the Basie I only own one and I love the defiler model so i'll stick with it.

I'm gonna post a revised list for you to tear apart ;-)

1 Chaos Lord (HQ) @ 161 Pts
Mark of Khorne
Berserker Glaive(x1)
Daemonic Stature; Daemonic Resilience;#Furious Charge; Feel No Pain

3 Obliterator Cult (Elites) @ 210 Pts

6 Blood Pact Death Squad (Elites) @ 107 Pts
Lasguns (x5); Plasma Gun (x1); Demolition Charge(x1); Plates Armour; Frag Grenades;
#Infiltrate

6 Blood Pact Death Squad (Elites) @ 107 Pts
Lasguns (x5); Meltagun (x1); Demolition Charge(x1); Plates Armour; Frag Grenades;
#Infiltrate

8 Chaos Space Marines (Troops) (cs) @ 137 Pts
Bolter (x6); Lascannon (x1); Plasma Gun (x1)

15 Mutants (Troops) @ 172 Pts
Bloated; CC Weapon; Flamer (x1); Frag Grenades
1 Mutant Boss
Power fist

15 Mutants (Troops) @ 172 Pts
Bloated; CC Weapon; Flamer (x1); Frag Grenades
1 Mutant Boss
Power fist

5 Traitors (Troops) @ 50 Pts
Lasgun (x4); Heavy Bolter (x1);

5 Traitors (Troops) @ 60 Pts
Lasgun (x4); Lascannon (x1);

5 Traitors (Troops) @ 55 Pts
Lasgun (x4); Autocannon (x1);

10 Chaos Hounds (Fast Attack) @ 100 Pts

10 Chaos Hounds (Fast Attack) @ 100 Pts

6 Rough Riders (Fast Attack) @ 92 Pts
Laspistol and CCW (x4); Meltagun (x2); Melta Bombs

1 Chaos Defiler (Heavy Support) @ 190 Pts
Parasitic Possession ?]

1 Basilisk (Heavy Support) @ 125 Pts
Hull Heavy Bolter

1 Leman Russ Battle Tank (Heavy Support) @ 160 Pts
Hull Heavy Bolter; Track Guards; Extra Armour

Total Army Cost: 1998



How is it looking right now ?

I followed some of your advice but still have a "themed" army so everybody should be happy.

Now your list is illegal :-P. You don't have a compulsory HQ choice.... the chaos lord is an allied HQ choice.... you either have to take the champions, or the greater daemon, and then you can have the DP. Also, the berserker glaive has become useless..... sure, you getta rage ever turn, but you don't get the 12 inch charge range that daemonic speed gives you. And as far as the double your base attacks, and the 4+ invulnrable, you can take mutation and aura, and basically do the same thing. Find the lord I built on here.... it's 178 points as opposed to your 161 points, but mine is much more survivable.... and that's the key to the lord, keeping him alive long enough to get into combat.

As for everything else....

3 Obliterator Cult (Elites) @ 210 Pts

-------------------------------------------------------------------

I still hate these guys..... and I think you should run them in a pair instead of 3 if you must use them.... so that they won't be a huge hit when they die.... killing three that are only T(4) when it comes to insta kill.... is never hard.

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6 Blood Pact Death Squad (Elites) @ 107 Pts
Lasguns (x5); Plasma Gun (x1); Demolition Charge(x1); Plates Armour; Frag Grenades;
#Infiltrate

6 Blood Pact Death Squad (Elites) @ 107 Pts
Lasguns (x5); Meltagun (x1); Demolition Charge(x1); Plates Armour; Frag Grenades;
#Infiltrate
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Again I think these guys are too expensive... but then again, I don't know what the blood pact do, so have fun

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8 Chaos Space Marines (Troops) (cs) @ 137 Pts
Bolter (x6); Lascannon (x1); Plasma Gun (x1)

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Horray for everything but the plasma gun and the fact that there are still too many guys in this unit, but enjoy I suppose... you'll kill yourself with the plasma, and then 6 guys won't do anything the rest of the game while you use these guys for anti-tank, that's 90 points of nothingness for the entire game 

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15 Mutants (Troops) @ 172 Pts
Bloated; CC Weapon; Flamer (x1); Frag Grenades
1 Mutant Boss
Power fist

15 Mutants (Troops) @ 172 Pts
Bloated; CC Weapon; Flamer (x1); Frag Grenades
1 Mutant Boss
Power fist
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Eh, I still think giving mutants any upgrades whatsoever is over pricing them.... normal mutant work fine for what they do, which is die so that the opponent feels good about themselves before you destroy him

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5 Traitors (Troops) @ 50 Pts
Lasgun (x4); Heavy Bolter (x1);

5 Traitors (Troops) @ 60 Pts
Lasgun (x4); Lascannon (x1);

5 Traitors (Troops) @ 55 Pts
Lasgun (x4); Autocannon (x1);
---------------------------------------------------------------------

Yay for everything except the multi shot weapons.... you got a lot of infantry to kill infantry, you got a DP to kill infantry, you got tanks to kill infantry, you need something to kill tanks.... besides 1 marine lascannon, and 3 obliterators that can only shoot at one thing each round.

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10 Chaos Hounds (Fast Attack) @ 100 Pts

10 Chaos Hounds (Fast Attack) @ 100 Pts
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I like these guys, run them behind your mutants so the enemy loses sight of them, and then spring them out and use their fleet and 12 inch charge range to assault and tie up the enemies shooting while the mutants close in

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6 Rough Riders (Fast Attack) @ 92 Pts
Laspistol and CCW (x4); Meltagun (x2); Melta Bombs
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I've never been affraid to rough riders... they die to lasguns..... but if you're going to use them, the way you kitted them out is the way to go

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1 Chaos Defiler (Heavy Support) @ 190 Pts
Parasitic Possession ?]
---------------------------------------------------------------------

Just give the thing indirect fire and don't worry about the possession

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1 Basilisk (Heavy Support) @ 125 Pts
Hull Heavy Bolter
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yay

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1 Leman Russ Battle Tank (Heavy Support) @ 160 Pts
Hull Heavy Bolter; Track Guards; Extra Armour
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Expect this to die rather quickly.... as it's only of the only targets for your opponents anti-tank after you give the defiler indirect.... then again... I guess that's a good thing, because if they're shooting this, they're not shooting your daemon prince or obliterators.... which are far more important

And all great masters are harsh..... you didn't see the karate kid whine about Mr. Miagi......

someone who uses death brigades! sweet!

hmm no plates is what make blood pact worth it in my opinion.

Thanks again for the comments but I had alreday made a few tweaks to the list before.

Honestly I don't think that you have a better chance of surviving railguns or vindicators with a 5+ invulnerable than with a 4+.

And I prefer my opponent to shoot at my dp rather than at my vehicles.

I dropped the marine squad to 6 men, giving Mutated Hull to the Defiler, this way my opponent should waste several turns trying to kill it.

Regarding my anti-tank, you forgot the rough riders, whose only purpose is destroying highly armored tanks.

The Pie-plates are also satistically more effective than lascannons at killing tanks.

Moreover, autocannons are more effective than lascannons at killing skimmers and light tanks ( devilfish, rhino, falcon, speeders...).

Also i think that the longer my opponents spends turns shooting at my mutants, the better, hence the 4+ save.

Thanks again for the comments but I think that I'll stick with this list and see how it fares once I am done with assembling and painting the models.

You're still going to hafta make a few more tweaks because your army is illegal, the DP is an allied HQ choice, and you need a compulsory HQ choice from the LATD list

You're right, I guess i'll just take a cheap champion to go with one of the mutant squads.