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Hello

Just wondering, is there anything in the pipeline for Grey Knights, perhaps some plastics Terminators or Space Marines in power armour. The selection is a bit limited right now, obviously to keep squads relatively small, but even though variety is the spice of life.....so they say?!?

Not that anyone has heard.

Not that I've heard. It doesn't seem likely. GK are pretty complete as is - they're meant to be combined with IG and SM allies for variety.

Also they don't sell enough be re-done in plastics.

You should also remember that they are metal for a reason.

They follow the GW points cost = money cost arguement (that in my mind is completely flawed as it discriminates against collectors who buy models just to convert and paint. And also enforces GW's vision of the game onto gamers unfairly).

They made them all metal to stop kids running out and buying whole armies of Grey Knight Terminators. GW argue that it would create unbalanced and uber powerful armies.

This is flawed because the only people who would buy stupid armies are most likely kids and new gamers. They will not be allowed to do this if they go to GW hobby games at stores as the staff will limit what they can use. So it doesn't matter if they have 30 GK termies or 200 grey knights in power armour because the game club will only let them use 5 marines at beginner level anyway.

Also likewise in vet gaming clubs if you build an army to the rules (which is why we supposedly have over priced codexes?) then theres no problem how many models you have as you can only ever use the force organisation chart.

If your at home having a game with your friends then it also doesn't matter because you can do what ever you want! Its your game and your models, the key element is fun. If you deivse a narrative as part of a mini campaign or a one off mission that needs loads of GK terminators to close a portal into the warp etc then so be it, after all isn't this why GW developed the demon rule that lets you keep respawning them anyway?

The idea, I think, is more to keep armies similar in pricing rather than to prevent people from taking 200 GK Termies - the Codex already does that.

Most armies cost about $250-350 for a 1500 point force and around $300-400 for a 2000 point army. GW doesn't want to break from that hugely and create an army that's only $150 for a 1500 point force.

Spot on Asmodai!

I wonder if this plays out in all of their forces?

That is, is there a force that you can field for $150 at 1500 points?

Well, you can do it in Fantasy with Chosen Chaos Warriors. The trouble is that those armies tend to flop on the table and aren't particular interesting.

You can't quite do it with Necrons in 40K - but you can come close with a pair of Battleforces and a Lord.

I'll bet you could do it with Thousand Sons Chosen.

i use SM plastics combined with GS and grey knight arms to make all my GK PAs.

GundamMecha - I think it's actually that they were made in metal as a proof of concept for the later plastic SM termies. If people hadn't liked them, they hadn't lost that much money making them (since the set-up cost for metal models is way, way lower than the same cost for plastics)

Now that they are popular, they might re-do them as plastics, but I wouldn't reckon on it happening before the codex gets re-done

You can easily do an IG army of 1,600+ points for less than $150. It might not be effective, though. I imagine most armies can be built cheaply, it's just people don't prefer to.

Hi Spikey David, thats an interesting take on it, and I can see where your coming from. I just know that when i worked for GW in one of their stores this was the rationale I was given by my manager and the company as to why they were cast in metal. It was always obvious to staff when they were released that they would indeed be popular, i don't think the company had any reason to doubt their saleability.

Undoubtably there are some kits thats are artifically over priced to represent their performance and effectiveness in the game. The Wraithlord and Dreadnought are examples of this. Cost wise theres no reason why GW couldn't sell wraithlords for 15 pounds instead of 25. When you look at a wraithlord you realise that there isn't really that much plastic in it at all (or a dreadnought for that matter either).  

while the rules limit stupidly over the top armies, I think GW definately have the tactic of points cost relating to model cost in mind. 

Thanks for all the input guys, theres some really interesting and eye opening stuff here.

The main reason fo rme asking the question, away from the rules of how a GK force "should" be used, is simply the current limitations in what you can model for GK. I'd like to see some more charcter models, some Grand Master models, even a Chaplain....all these things have been mentioned in the fluff, yet all they give you is five Termies and a five (?) power armoured figures....its lame..... now the reason for plastics here is obvious, you can play with poses, and they are 100% easier to modify to create custom characters etc......

Quite frankly I'd be much happier if they fixed the rules and left the minis as is. Right now, GK suck so badly that there isn't a point in buying and using them, even if they did get new models And as far as metals go, the GK stuff is pretty good too.

Actually if you go light on the fluff and very heavy on troops and storm troopers there not bad at all. Bug armies dont stand a chance really.

The rules are fine. Grey Knights were never meant to be a stand alone army. GW warned about this years ago.

I have won many tournaments with mine so I wouldn't go so far as saying they suck. Competance usually equals success. They are a great army IMO with the exception of no anti-armor so you compensate your build knowing this.

Stormtroopers with melta guns(mounted of course) and dreadnoughts with twin las canon missile launcher, and land raiders. Not a terrible line up for anti vehicle.You are right they are light in that area. I also run my inquisitor with multi meltas,plasma canons and whatever else i can beat on armor with. Your Knights have to be a dual roll unit thats very important. Must shoot as much as possible and well we know how they do in HtoH. Like i said i have yet to meet a bug army i didnt like to play against with them....lol

For variety, couldn't you just use the existing SM and BT plastics?

Posted By jmurph on 02/16/2007 2:13 PM
For variety, couldn't you just use the existing SM and BT plastics?

 

That's what I did. Although it's labor and skill intensive, and it isn't any less expensive. 

For those who are curious you can see them here:

z11.invisionfree.com/Work_In_Progress/index.php

I loved my GKs ive used them ever since the new minis came out. They are great fun to play with.

Here are some pics

www.pbase.com/frazervisser