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The free PDF of the AT-43 Advanced rules is now available for download.

http://www.at-43.com/

It's 37 pages. The French version is 42 pages so I'm not sure what's missing (not positive but from a quick comparison I think it's just due to the language). The PDF only has the core rules but includes the table of contents of the full rulebook. So the full rules will be over 126 pages long.

I just gave the rules a quick once over and they look good. Overwatch, Baby, Overwatch!!!

Me too. I am very impressed. I can't wait to get a game going this weekend to try them out.

after reading over the rules in more detail, I'm really looking forward to playing AT-43.

One thing I always wanted for 40K was an Integrated turn, where players take turns moving and firing units, as opposed to the current you go and do everything, then it's my turn deal. AT-43 has that and it has so really cool game mechanics to back that up.

You have to pick the order your activating in, but you can speed Leadership Points to change the order your cards are reveled in, or Pass then take two turns in a row. However these Leadership points are also used to issue Orders like overwatch, winning the first turn role and more. If the basic game play is simple this overlaying "minigame" looks to be a winner. The Leadership points almost feel like Focus in Warmachine, but work in a very different way.

Very Cool.

Looks interesting, and seems to have all the concepts I'd like to see in a tactical skirmish game.

So does anyone know if they're still planning on doing unpainted miniatures for us die hards?

There is not to my knowledge any current plan to offer unpainted miniatures. However, as the miniature is factory painted with a baked on paint layer, there is no measureable thickness to the paint without getting out some rather advanced scientific tools. In other words, if you just spray on some primer, it is as if the prepainted aspect of the figure was never there.

There is, unfortunately, still the matter of the cost - you are indeed still paying a small fee for that pre-painted factor. Rackham AT-43 models in general cost approximately 1 additional US dollar on a per-model basis compared to the cost of plastic 40k models for Troops choices. This price comparison was calculated using the US pricing for AT-43, not the Rackham webstore Euro pricing. US pricing for AT-43 has been far cheaper than European pricing.

Nope, definitely no unpainted minis.

Sorry Ghaz, no unpainted for you.

Posted By Ghaz on 02/26/2007 12:02 PM
So does anyone know if they're still planning on doing unpainted miniatures for us die hards?

They were never planning to do unpainted.

I can't wait to read through the rules.

Last rumors that I heard stated that they were considering providing unpainted models, although I haven't really kept up on the AT-43 rumors. So has Rackham officially stated that there will not be unpainted models or is this a rumor as well?

It's sad really, as they are going to lose out on a great many of us that won't buy the pre-paints.

Looks like a decent game, but I wait to see how it plays. Confrontation looked nice too in theory....

According to Bey there will be no unpainted ones beside promos on Cons. You can´t get it more official.
The rules are excellent and much better than anything Rackham has ever created. And for a good system I am more than willing to pay a little extra, especially when it means complex does not mean complicated. I have enough of artifically complex/complicated systems that are not willing to do the necessary things to streamline the system.

The rules are excellent and much better than anything Rackham has ever created.

I could not agree more. These rules really show that Rackham is a mature company that learns from it's mistakes and has put together a truly solid game. I have been using these full rules since the French ones came out, with Black Templars standing in for the UNA troopers to test with.

Everything about this system, from keeping points values *off* of the cards, to the complex but not complicated rules that still allow for a great deal of choice, and the avoidance of many of the mistakes that have caused Confrontation to actually get worse as time goes on - it all goes to show Rackham is prepared to build it for the long haul.

I might play once the Karmans are released, but it is really sad that they won't release unpainted models for those of us who enjoy that aspect of the hobby.

Hmm, Why is prepainted (but with base coat thinkness paint) worse then unpainted? Everything I have seen seems to indicate that If you want to paint them it's as easy as if they where unpainted. You just prime and paint, or just paint over the base coat. It's like getting a Primed figure, in theory. I can understand if you have seen other company's prepainted figures that have a ton of paint glopped on, but Rackham has really pushed that there pre paints can be paint over quite well.

http://www.at-43.com/img/fig_ex_at43_001_c.jpg

He is probably (justifiably) dissapointed more with the extra cost that prepainted production adds. Even though it is not a lot it is still there.

As for the priming, I have redone half of my Therians. You literally just spray on new primer and get to work, there's nothing else to be done except checking carefully for any small mould lines.

Yep, why buy and pay for something already assembled and painted just to repaint it yourself? Also a lot harder to cut them back apart and repose them. It just takes what I consider a hobby and makes it into a toy game. It really makes me feel like one of those "click" games which I despise so much. I know they are greater quality, but it just makes me feel that way. I won't be getting the figs for those reasons.

You could always just proxy with IG and Necrons for the White Stars and Therians as a start!

Why unpainted? Because I'm drawn to the hobby aspect of these games. I like putting together my models and modifying them as I desired then painting them up. To me, prepainted = toys and nothing more.

Actually, if you have som proficiency it is quite easy to take the AT-Minis appart and change them. With the GW-sprues you often have several parts but they fit together only in one way, so in the end you end up in both systems with the same number of poses.

Ah, but you have parts from all kinds of kits with GW, and numerous options and poses to start with. Right now AT has a lot of walking holding your gun poses, which it looks like would be hard to change. Yes, I do have models in the house. Just not mine

With the actual minis you can already exchange heads and torsos.

Yep, but still not great. I think they are shooting themselves in the foot by not releasing both. But time will tell.

Posted By Caern on 02/26/2007 5:03 PM

The rules are excellent and much better than anything Rackham has ever created.

"...and the avoidance of many of the mistakes that have caused Confrontation to actually get worse as time goes on - it all goes to show Rackham is prepared to build it for the long haul."

I'm a newcomer to Rackham's game, so I will plead a certain amount of ignorance here, but, exactly how has Confrontation gotten *worse* over time?*

It was the release of Confrontation v3.0 that actually made we actually get into their games, and I'm glad I did.

Now, I'll agree that putting points values *on* the cards hurts, especially when trying to release later editions, but this could be addressed by releasing updated card packs for each race...

*If you're talking about the much maligned (and probably justifiably so) "3.5" rules, well, that's another issue...

 

Posted By Toreador on 02/27/2007 8:20 AM
Yep, but still not great. I think they are shooting themselves in the foot by not releasing both. But time will tell.

Well I could not disagree more. In the end you have an assembled model with a primer base coat. How is assembling one from scratch yeild a different result than one already assembled but easily taken apart and modified? Yes GW does supply alot of extra "bitz", but looks like Rackham is heading that way with the extra torsos, and heads already available.

But  you sound like you have already made up your mind about this game.

Yes, I have, like i said earlier.

I am not going to pay extra for pre-painted already assembled figs to only tear them back apart and repaint them. Seems counterintuitive to me. I like the confrontation figs, I like what I have seen so far of AT-43's rules. I don't like how they are doing the figs. I won't be buying any. Now if and when they start showing up cheaply on ebay, maybe I will.

Posted By Alpharius on 02/27/2007 8:31 AM

Posted By Caern on 02/26/2007 5:03 PM

The rules are excellent and much better than anything Rackham has ever created.

"...and the avoidance of many of the mistakes that have caused Confrontation to actually get worse as time goes on - it all goes to show Rackham is prepared to build it for the long haul."

I'm a newcomer to Rackham's game, so I will plead a certain amount of ignorance here, but, exactly how has Confrontation gotten *worse* over time?*

It was the release of Confrontation v3.0 that actually made we actually get into their games, and I'm glad I did.

Now, I'll agree that putting points values *on* the cards hurts, especially when trying to release later editions, but this could be addressed by releasing updated card packs for each race...

*If you're talking about the much maligned (and probably justifiably so) "3.5" rules, well, that's another issue...

 

I'm not going to get into that as there are 'I hate 3.5' ranks on a more or less weekly basis on the Confrontation forums and I really don't think by taking this existing thread off-topic in order to discuss the full depth of changes that have occured from 1 to 2 to 3 to 3.5 I could add anything worth talking about. Suffice to say, Confrontation is in a bad state, and even Rackham themselves know it. The forums have actually declined in activity since the end of 2005. I would know. Even though I'm quiet there *compared to before* I am still the third highest poster and the extreme majority of them were in regards to rules queries.

Now, back to the original topic, AT-43...

Posted By Toreador on 02/27/2007 9:37 AM
Yes, I have, like i said earlier.

I am not going to pay extra for pre-painted already assembled figs to only tear them back apart and repaint them. Seems counterintuitive to me. I like the confrontation figs, I like what I have seen so far of AT-43's rules. I don't like how they are doing the figs. I won't be buying any. Now if and when they start showing up cheaply on ebay, maybe I will.

Pay "extra"? I am confused, they are only available one way, how exactly would you pay extra?

If you go to the warstore you will quickly notice that the prices are pretty much inline with 40k as to the amount of mini's per dollar. Counterintuitive?

I understand you do not like the way they are doing the figs, you have told us... many times.

And will continue

Just think about how cheap the figs would be if they were not painted and assembled....

That is the premium I am paying for, to then assemble, prime and paint them again?