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As I mentioned near the end of the 'gender disparity' thread, I know someone who likes to play games but she's turned off of Hordes because she has problems learning the Fury mechanic.

So bascically I want to pick a Warmachine faction that will appeal to her. What I'm asking is, if I pick up Cryx or Menoth say is she going to have a hard time getting the rules down. I'm not saying she has a hard time with tactics, she just doesn't want to listen to me lecture her on game mechanics.

So which is the "people who suck at math and need things explained to them ten times and can get a little pissy about it" faction for Warmachine?



Besides I wouldn't mind painting up a box set and a squad of infantry or two.

Cryx is appealing to me some of their stuff is wiiicked looking.

Stuff like these guys.

http://www.privateerpress.com/WARMACHINE/gallery/default.php?level=picture&id=27
http://www.privateerpress.com/WARMACHINE/gallery/default.php?level=picture&id=336

The battlebox set for Khador is about as basic a tactic as you can get. Freeze and destroy. Adding widowmakers and/or Man O Wars isn't too tactically taxing either.

Start with stuff from the Prime: Remix book and build from there. There's a lot of strong stuff in that book, and they're mostly straightforward (my lovely Cryx notwithstanding, 'natch.).

Everything seems to have tricky rules these days.

The problem with Cryx is that you have all these cheap
infantry models to paint (same with Protectorate). The
problem with learning Protectorate is the learning curve
of figuring out how to best benefit from your own soldiers'
deaths.

I'm thinking Khador.

Also, no matter what you do, I think you should try with
models from Prime and then build from there. So instead
of Bane Knight spam army of death, you build something
that uses McThralls and such.

Weird gay wavelength there, tpc.

Khador it is, then. Everblight vs Khador is probably about basic as you get, fast and hard hitting vs slow and high armour.

Besides I get to use my boris and natacha voices.

I also have something like five shades of red I was going to use for a blood angels army I never got around to.

Also, you can get her to play with her two juggz by
fielding Vlad with two juggernauts.

malfred wrote:Also, you can get her to play with her two juggz by
fielding Vlad with two juggernauts.

Sounds classier than the Butcher and his pair of Kodiaks.

Somehow .

as far as I know, Khador is pretty much the meanest thing out there.....so she'll win a lot without much thinking which is a good thing I presume. but just for starters you should paint a second WM box for yourself so she get's hold of the focus system faster when you use it too.

she already gets the focus system as of one five minute conversation. After understanding the focus system she was starting to get the fury mechanic finally but her eyes started glazing over when I mentioned animi. "They're wizards, and they have so much mana points every turn, focus as it is called, and they can use it to do this, this and this." And then the next turn starts again. I think her problem with the Fury mechanic was the concept of fury "staying" on the warbeasts between turns. Well besides the fact that she forced to listen to me lecture her on it.

We seem to be excited about this, she's looking forward to her first minis.

I would say Cygnar. Khador sounds straightforward, and it moves straightforward, but it is filled with plenty of superb specialist elite units. Widowmakers and Destroyers for range, Iron Fags, Man O War and Juggernauts for assault. Now as the Khador army is undermanned comparerd to most, you must get the most out of each specialist unit.

A bit like Eldar.

I.e. not a beginners army.

Cygnar are more rounded, and has more no brainer units (in terms of how to use them together). Stabrt with a basic gunline of Long Gunners or Trenchers, some Lancers for arc nodes, and then assorted jacks to hold the line steady.
Haley and/or Stryker to round off.

A good simple gameplay there, which can be slowly built on as confidence grows with more exotic units.

Orlanth wrote:A bit like Eldar.

I.e. not a beginners army.

hrm I'll think about it. You might be right concerning the trenchers.

I don't see how Long Gunners differ from Khador, if we're talking about elite specialized units.

Long Gunners are more standart Infantrie, which can be upgraded in size and with UAs. Widow Makers are elite snipers with better stats.

Widowmakers can advance deploy and can deal auto
damage whereas the LGs have to combine shooting to
guarantee hits and damage. On their own, however, they're
really not that great.

Widowmakers will tear up a unit of LGs if the Cygnar
commander messes up (leaves them out of formation for
double tap or CRAs)

The difference is that Long Gunners are bulk infantry. Widowmakers are just about all the long ranged firepower you will get (apart from the Destroyer) and they are horribly weak up close.

The Khador army is slow and has no arc nodes, so you must plan ahead. Its units are only good at their specified role, there are few generalists - only the mediocre Winterguard. While brutal the Khadior army is not unsubtle. The core of a Cygnar army is far more cohesive and fights by itself. Yopu can line them up and expect them to work without having to wory about timing everything just right.

This is not to say Cygnar is boring. After all they have exotic units too but unlike Khador they are supplementary to the line troops

I think what I'll do is stay with Khador for the simpler rules (having to plan ahead with Long Gunner formations is just the sort of thing she would want to avoid) and just give her a points handicap. And I can always give her an arc node on the Juggernaut.

No arc node. That would just be confusing later on.

Or is that to convince her to play with two juggz? YOu
sneaky man-thing you!

Tacobake wrote:I think what I'll do is stay with Khador for the simpler rules (having to plan ahead with Long Gunner formations is just the sort of thing she would want to avoid) and just give her a points handicap. And I can always give her an arc node on the Juggernaut.

You are misreading this, its the Khador player than needs to plan ahead more, not the Cygnar player. The only 'complexity' to a core Cygnar army is Stryker, he is tricky to use properly, Sorsha and the Butcher are much simpler, but their armies need very careful handling.

Orlanth wrote:

Tacobake wrote:I think what I'll do is stay with Khador for the simpler rules (having to plan ahead with Long Gunner formations is just the sort of thing she would want to avoid) and just give her a points handicap. And I can always give her an arc node on the Juggernaut.

You are misreading this, its the Khador player than needs to plan ahead more, not the Cygnar player. The only 'complexity' to a core Cygnar army is Stryker, he is tricky to use properly, Sorsha and the Butcher are much simpler, but their armies need very careful handling.

hrm, I appreciate the input ... I think I'll just talk to her about it and show her the minis and tell her to just get whatever she wants. Well, except Menoth.

I can make flash cards or something for power attacks etc.

I think I'll give her Alten Ashley as a handicap. Anti-Hordes and all that. It would be more of an advantage in 350 and a bit less at 500 when she or whoever else I was introducing gets the hang of things.

You also get Sorscha in the basic box who is female and still one of the most brutal casters/feats in the game. Cryx and protectorate are very finesse/synergistic. Khador and Cygnar are the easiest start up armies for new beginners IMO.

As much as I like Cygnar, I'm with the "give her Khador" crowd. If she's "math deficient", do you really want to saddle her with figuring out say a 12" range weapon, and if I put Snipe on it, how much focus for how much range, and oh, I know, Siege with adding an AoE to the first shot from what model...

You get the idea.

Khador all the way for your girl.

Good luck, and have fun, first of all...

fortunately what she was, was personality deficient, so it is no longer an issue .

Since "everybody and their mom," seems to be playing Khador these days, I was actually going to do a Trolls/ Minions hybrid. Either that or get into mercs just for the heck of it.

But thanks to all who offered advice.

Personally, I use Cygnar with certain, select Mercs to fill in any niches I may be lacking in... Eiryss and GMCA in a flanking maneuver rock by taking a side each, and hunting solos or casters. Reinholdt is always good for a reload on Caine or Haley, not to mention the free measurement and/or the extra die here and there...