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Evening all,

Having acquired a 1,000 point Eldar army recently, I have decided to take the next step up and get it to 1,500 points.

Some principles I've stuck by whilst doing this list:

- I have concentrated on the shooty aspect of the Eldar Amy. I've thrown in some units that can more than hold their own in close combat however. (the fact that my two main combat units, the Spears and the Harlequins, can Hit and Run, is a really nice, unique tough I feel)
- Huge amounts of medium strength, medium range weaponry (Scatter Lasers, Shruiken Cannons etc). With so many saves to take, some WILL be failed. Specialised troops will sort out the Anti-Tank. (Dragons, Vibro-Cannons)
- Relatively mobile, I have no intention of this being a gunline army.

HQ

Farseer - 143 points
Singing Spear, Runes of Warding, Spirit Stone, Guide, Fortune

Fortune for resilience, Guide to back up firepower. Spear because I had the points and it can provide a shock if it ever gets close enough to use the damn thing. Runes of Warding for Khaineforsaken Fzorgle Princes. Strictly a support unit, I don't expect it to take out an army singlehandedly.

ELITES

6 Fire Dragons - 96 points

Fire Dragons + Falcon + Enemy Tank = Dead Tank. Getting the Dragons out alive however, proves slightly more probelmatic. Hence, this is a cheap unit that will get it's points back then die gloriously. (I've also had some luck with using them to take out Terminators and Necrons as well, with backup firepower from the Falcon. They provide the guaranteed high-AP, high-Strength firepower this army lacks)

6 Harlequins w. Harlequin's Kisses - 162 points
Shadowseer

Meh! Usual Harlie build.

TROOPS

10 Guardians w. Scatter Laser - 95 points

10 Guardians w. Scatter Laser - 95 points

10 Guardians w. Scatter Laser - 95 points

I find I can't really justify the points for Dire Avengers. (especially since they usually have to pack a Wave Serpent as well) 3 units of Guardians provide a solid, mobile firebase that can also unleash fearsome firepower. (often, an opponent can disregard them until it's far too late)

5 Pathfinders - 120 points

Because Snipers with High-AP (potentially) just rock. Awesome models as well. Stick them in cover and watch them steadily bleed any foe.

FAST ATTACK

4 Shining Spears - 202 points
Exarch w. Star Lance, Withdraw, Skilled Riders

Fragile, but devastating if used effectively. An Exarch with a Star Lance can be an almighty shock from time to time. And the rest of the unit isn't any slouch either. Due to the speed of the units, the Spears and the Harlies can work as a sort of tag team from hell. Of course, Hit and Run just to irritate your opponent even more. Very Eldar.

HEAVY SUPPORT

2 Vibro-Cannons - 100 points

Anti-Vehcile and occasional Horde thinner. Stick behind the biggest piece of cover and let rip. Insanely useful in every game I've played. I never leave home without them.

Falcon - 195 points
2x Shruiken Cannons, Holo-Field, Spirit Stone, Vectored Engines

Falcon - 195 points
2x Shruiken Cannons, Holo-Field, Spirit Stone, Vectored Engines

Standard Falcons, one carries the Dragons, the other the Harlies

TOTAL: 1498 points (59 models)

Mobile firepower, and a tough (the Spears will be Fortuned whenever possible, and the Harlies have a Falcon), mobile close combat punch. (both my major combat unit, the Harlequins and the Spears, can also Hit and Run, which could be very handy indeed)

Sorry if I'm going on a bit, but I really do want to make this army count, without it degenerating into cookie-cutter-ness. All replies and advice are appreciated.

It looks to me like your trying to run a hybrid list. I can give you a few pointers, but Blackmoore is the real expert on them. (I prefer fully mechanized)

-Farseer: The reality is that if your running a Farseer, it should either be on a bike or else be Eldrad. A bikeseer is vastly more mobile, and likely to put powers where they matter. and Eldrad is just vastly more cost effective than the standard Farseer.

-Avatar: Something you don't have, but should consider. Depending on what level your playing at, making your guardians fearless may or may not be a necessity. (theres a big topic on this in the tactics section if you haven't already checked it out)

-Guardians: You should consider that this is one of the few places you can get access to Anti Tank weapons. But scatter lasers are playable. The real selling point of guardians is that they are extremely difficult to dislodge with an Avatar around, but its your call.

-Dire Avengers: In the type of list your playing, Avengers don't really need a Wave Serpent. They just advance with the guardians, and level the first assault squad that gets in range.

-Fire Dragons: I originally built my squads this way too. But I have come to agree with the people here that taking an Exarch with the flamer/fast shot greatly increases the squads threat envelope. Two flamer templates also means its a great way to vaporize a squad of orks.

-Pathfinders: The squad is fine, but its almost always better to take even numbered squads for scoring purposes.

Hybrid lists are in many ways the best of both worlds for Eldar. You get to run Eldrad/Avatar with Falcons and Cargo. The inherent problem with this is that it also results in a lack of cohesion between your units, and it takes a lot of practice for it to work well against seasoned gamers. If its your style, then run with it. The list can be a lot of fun to play.

If you're spending that much on a Farseer, it should indeed be Eldrad.

I see why you have scatter lasers on the Guardians, and suggest you keep them there.

The Spears really need an anvil unit to work well- otherwise they often get stuck on their own in the middle of lots of enemies and die. Unfortunately, Harlies don't make a great anvil either.

I suggest dropping the Spears in favor of either 2 units of jetbikes with cannons (one with Warlock with spear and Embolden) or an Avatar and more Guardians. Thus you either up your strengths (shooting) and make the enemy come to you (where the Avatar comes in handy); or you up your mobile firepower (jetbikes) and provide a good anvil for the Hariles when needed. Of the two options, I like the jetbikes better because mobility is so important. But YMMV.

The rest of your list looks good, and like it will be fun to play with and against.

IntoTheRain wrote:
-Fire Dragons: I originally built my squads this way too. But I have come to agree with the people here that taking an Exarch with the flamer/fast shot greatly increases the squads threat envelope. Two flamer templates also means its a great way to vaporize a squad of orks.

Fire Dragons don't get Fast Shot, they get Crack Shot and Tank Hunters. It's only the Dark Reaper that gets Fast Shot.

Aduro wrote:Fire Dragons don't get Fast Shot, they get Crack Shot and Tank Hunters. It's only the Dark Reaper that gets Fast Shot.

Oh god. Where did I get the idea that they could. I have used it in 2 games too. (thwacks self repeatedly)

Fuegan used to get fast shot, I believe.

Now he's sucky again.

If you plan to take a Farseer and Guardians, then take Eldrad, Avatar, and 2-3 Guardian Defender squads.
The Defenders can walk in the Avatar's fearless bubble and give shooty support.
The Falcons with FDs and Harlies give the army good mobility.
The rest is personal preference.

Thank you for the replies good people, I hope to answer some questions about my list.

Firstly, undoubtedly Eldrad would be a better choice over a normal Farseer. However, I refrained because, in 1,500 point list, after picking him and an Avatar (a fair wee chunk of my army at 1,500 points), the rest of my list basically picks itself:

I need some guys to take advantage of the Avatar's Fearless bubble, preferably ones that have good firepower (in go 2-3 Guardians, Wraithguard, the other unit I've heard goes well with an Avatar, really don't need the protection, they're already as hard as a coffin nail)

Then I need some mobility, because I'm damned if I'm playing Eldar as a gunline, in go 2 Falcons. Now I need some cargo, Fire Dragons and Harlequins are the only real choices, since they can still do serious damage in a 6 man format. (Banshees and Scorpions can be quite "touch and go" in small squads, I feel)

So, that's leaves me with 202 points left. Enough to fit in a unit of Spears to provide extra close combat punch, and hit units deep behind enemy lines that could threaten the Avatar/Eldrad (I'm thinking Devastators and their equivalents here, think Warhammer Fantasy-esque warmachine hunters). And bang, list picked. It feels a bit...thoughtless, to be honest. Please note, I'm not knocking Avatar + Eldrad, or anyone who takes them (most of whom are probably far better players than me anyway) but it's a combo you really HAVE to build the entire army around to make it truly effective, and I find that rather limiting.

And secondly, given that She Who Thirsts is currently dressing Eldrad in a pink dress and banging him until the Eye of Terror melts, it dosen't seem entirely...appropiate.

I may see if I can fit an Avatar into the list though, does anyone have any ideas what I should get rid of to make the points for him?

Again, thank you.

Well, how about this 'core':

Eldrad - 205
Avatar - 155
3x10 Guardians w/ scatterlasers - 285
6 Fire Dragons - 96
6 Harlies - 162
2 Falcons - 410

Total: 1313 pts.

Wuestenfux, I think you just proved my point. We both came up with practically the same "core". Although, I skimped on the Falcons equipment a bit to get the 202 points needed for a unit of Spears.

I'm fairly sure Eldrad is 210 points though.

You're right about Eldrad. By dropping some Falcon equipment, you could squeeze in 4 Shining Spears.

Okay, as a mental exercie, I shall write up the list I would use if I took Eldrad/Avatar, if I was that way inclined.

Eldrad - 210
Avatar - 155

6 Fire Dragons - 96
6 Harlies - 162

3x10 Guardians w/ scatterlasers - 285

4 Spears - 202

2 Falcons - 390

Total: 1500 pts on the dot.

For that, I'd have to drop a normal Farseer, my Pathfinders, and 2 Vibro-Cannons. Is it worth it?

I think it is worth it.
Eldrad more than compensates for the Farseer.
The Pathfinders may or may not have some game impact. Possibly they can pin an enemy unit for one or two rounds, but most enemy armies have large ld or are fearless.
I never used VCs and probably will never use them.

It should also be noted that this list is semi-competitive at best. The most competitive environment it'll be in is a FLGS tournie.

Just something to bear in mind...

More reason to leave Eldrad Avatar at home. The combo is strong but its also a rather defensive approach. Eldrad protects Avatar, Avatar protects Guardians, Guardians arent the most offensive punch too.

And who cares if 95pts of Guardians run sometimes. There will be others to step in.

Evening all again,

Thank you for the review. It's made me reconsider the army a bit.

Judging from your review, things that need to be improved:

- More support for the main assault units is required.
- More adaptability to missions/scenarios/objective grabbing.
- Lack of Avatar hurts Guardians survivability. I don't want to pay for the Avatar, so another method is required.

Enter the new list:

1,500 point Eldar Army List

HQ (143) (9.6%)
Farseer - 143 points
Singing Spear, Runes of Warding, Spirit Stone, Guide, Fortune
ELITES (270) (18%)
6 Fire Dragons - 108 points
Exarch w. Dragon's Breath Flamer
6 Harlequins w. Harlequin's Kisses - 162 points
Shadowseer
TROOPS (472) (31.5%)
10 Guardians w. Scatter Laser - 138 points
Warlock - Singing Spear, Conceal
10 Guardians w. Scatter Laser - 138 points
Warlock - Singing Spear, Conceal
3 Guardian Jetbikes - 76 points
Shruiken Cannon
5 Pathfinders - 120 points
FAST ATTACK (202) (13.5%)
4 Shining Spears - 202 points
Exarch w. Star Lance, Withdraw, Skilled Riders
HEAVY SUPPORT (410) (27.4%)
Falcon - 205 points
Scatter Laser, Shruiken Cannon, Holo-Field, Spirit Stone, Vectored Engines
Falcon - 205 points
Scatter Laser, Shruiken Cannon, Holo-Field, Spirit Stone, Vectored Engines

TOTAL: 1,497 points (47 models)

Changes:

- Warlocks help keep the Guardians alive, and also makes the Farseer's Fortune far more useful. They also provide a bit of support at close range and in assault. (BIG PLUS)
- Guardian Jetbike squad for annoyance, shoot-and-hide supporting fire, and objective grabbing. Can also block assaults and generally make a nuisance of themselves.
- Up-gunned Falcon and Exarch w. Flamer because I had the points, and it also makes the Dragons more versatile. (especially with Ork Hordes incoming)
- Ironically, a better comp score. (more points in Troops + no maxed out Heavy Support)

So, is this list any better, anything else that can worked on?

Cheers

As having the warlocks with the guardians goes, conceal is a great bet but the singing spears are not important. If you are concerned about them running then go with embolden as an additional power. Pathfinders arent my forte but whatever floats your boat. Having a mounted warlock with a spear and whatever power you choose makes the group of jetbikes amazing antitank killers. In every game I've played 3x Guardian Jetbikes w/ A jetbike Warlock with spear and embolden or whatever has always made up its points. At times it is even worth taking destructor.