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Hey there. I was just after some advice on the rules for Basilisks.
It has come to my attention that since the latest release of the Imperial Guard Codex Basilisks got kinda made worse. the old rules were:-
100 points, 120" range - S9 - AP3. With 25 points to make it indirect. So, i presume it could fire direct before. Now it's:-
125 points, 36"-240" - S9 - AP3. So given, the usefulness of the guns S & AP haven't changed, however the range seems to be kinda rubbish now unless playing on a board bigger than 6-4.
Also, there is no direct mention that the gun cannot fire directly, so i am assuming that it can.
Does anyone have any thoughts on this, or as to the effectiveness of Basilisks these days?
I am yet to try mine out, but the points seem better used buying more troops if i am only going to get to shoot it in the first/second turn.
Comments welcome.
Please try to make them constructive though!

Thanks.

i think with the new Dex that mortar teams are more viable. more shots, more templates and can hide behind cover. Also Griffons would be something i would look into. at 90pts each i like them a lot. I have a basilisk in my army but i think it provides too big and juicy a target.
I like building my army in such a way that my opponent cant easily single out important stuff. But thats just how i roll
ok so not totally what you were asking for, but defenatley mortars feel to me the better way to go.
John.

It can still fire directly if you want it to. I take my enclosed for 140pts to protect it more. The Bassie is a very versatile piece of artillery as it can both threaten MEQ's with it's ap3 template and also threaten vehicles with the str 9 ordinance. The FW enclosed varient also looks very cool on the battlefield.

Not at all mate, that is totally the kind response I was after!
Informative. Good opinion & more too it than "Your army sounds crap!" LOL!
I see what you mean about the 'big targets' thing. My main worry with Basilisks is a Drop Pod with a dreadnought in landing next to it. The dreadnought steps out, then either shoots the crap out of it, or just assaults it in the next go. Obviously i would shield the Basilisk with other Tanks, but either way. It just seems like points better spent on other things.
Thanks for your thoughts.
Will look into Griffons.
Cheers.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

DarthDiggler wrote:It can still fire directly if you want it to. I take my enclosed for 140pts to protect it more. The Bassie is a very versatile piece of artillery as it can both threaten MEQ's with it's ap3 template and also threaten vehicles with the str 9 ordinance. The FW enclosed varient also looks very cool on the battlefield.

Roger that dude. That enclosed one looks sweet! I'll mess about with it a bit & keep adding my thoughts on here.
Thanks for taking the time to comment.

I ran two in a couple of Apoc games (3k and 6k doubles) at battlefields this year.

They did goreat work against the double-orc team we fought in doubles' boyz squads, as well as immobilizing a trukk and killing off another, and did sterling work (soaking up fire from a pair of manticores for a long time, and sinking one of them and an entire squad of traitor guard, as well as immobilising a chimera and a hellhound in the space of 3 turns, before being flank marched to hell by squads with melta bombs. (note, one lived through that, and tank shocked, killing 3 guys, and routing all three squads) before being totaled by the shadowsword they came in range of.

Anywho, to cut out the awesomeness report, They can direct fire, and unless i'm much mistaken (didnt use it on an apoc table) they can direct fire with no minimum range. They break light armour, they can counter-battery any artillery in the game with a good chance, they never move and can abuse cover saves with camo netting (true of all the artillery, but still worth mentioning), and they are likely to make almost every important infantry in the game advance through cover instead of in the open where nothing else could do that.

TL;DR:

Use them. Use them now.

For tournament lists I wouldn't take them because of the higher points costs than the Griffon. You will have more points to play with if you take the Griffons and cover saves are a pain to deal with in the new rules.

I love to use them in Apocalypse games. I ues th Forgeworld platforms to make them even cheaper and bring a battery of 6. Almost anything dies under that withering hail of goodness.

So in a friendly game, I'd use them. In a competition game, I'd use something cheaper. That's my two cents.

They can direct fire, and unless i'm much mistaken (didnt use it on an apoc table) they can direct fire with no minimum range. They break light armour, they can counter-battery any artillery in the game with a good chance, they never move and can abuse cover saves with camo netting (true of all the artillery, but still worth mentioning), and they are likely to make almost every important infantry in the game advance through cover instead of in the open where nothing else could do that.

TL;DR:

Use them. Use them now.

Klueless wrote:An above comment did suggest that with the rules now stating 36" - 240" means that they do have a minimum range. If they do this sucks.

Direct firing always ignores minimum range restrictions. It's in the rulebook somewhere.

Ahhh sweet! If it's not too much trouble can you tell me a page number? I'll have a quick look myself too. Thanks a bundle dude!

Page 58 of the Big Rulebook (may be different for the small one)

Ordnance Barrage Weapons - 1st and 2nd Paragraph

"Differently from other unit types, vehicles carrying ordnance barrage weapons can choose to fire them either directly or as a barrage - declare before you fire.

If fired directly at a target, they are treated exactly like normal ordnance weapons (ignoring the minimum range in the weapon's profile)".

My computer just restarted so i looked through the rule book while it was re-booting. Found it dude. Top right hand corner. Thanks so much for bringing that to my attention. That is gonna solve a few problems & a few arguments.
Cheers.

I have yet to use my Basilisk mostly cuz I was really impressed with the Medusa and Collossus but I have a feeling I will be trying it soon. It's nice maybe one indirect shot a game but its ok. If you don't plan to use for in direct use a Medusa does it's job better. And a collosus is awsome. though it has that min 24'' you use it to counter fire your opponents heavy weapons team to great effect. Lootas, dev teams, Havocs, Rangers anything of the sort become paste.

The basilisk is easily one of my fave tanks. I used one when I played Iron Warriors some time ago. That thing was just a killing machine! In fact after a few games people started targeting it big time. Which of course meant I ended up using it as a trap of sorts. Great piece of artillery for sure

Eh, the Bassie is an APOC monster. Great on large tables with multiple targets. However, there are too many better toys in the IG dex. Take a look at the manticore.

Though a decent tank hunter its skills can be left to the Medusa which is better at it. The Manticore's high AP makes me just look at it and shrug not negating those Regular Marine Armor saves? O I kill 1....gak.

Bloody hell. Some seriously varied opinions on Basilisks. I think I'll give mine a go & add some comments after.
Thanks for all your comments guys.

It's very powerful, but also very vulnerable to enemy fire. On the plus side, it has probably gotten a bit better with 5th ed. vehicle cover rules.

It's also useful in objective missions since usually the enemy will have to leave a squad on their home objective - which is more than 36" away and hence a good target for shelling.

It's a lot better than Manticores for killing MEQs because the Manticore is only AP4, so marines will just laugh at you.

The Basilisk is my favourite artillery thanks to the direct fire capabilities and marine-crushing power.

Asmodai wrote:It's very powerful, but also very vulnerable to enemy fire. On the plus side, it has probably gotten a bit better with 5th ed. vehicle cover rules.

It's also useful in objective missions since usually the enemy will have to leave a squad on their home objective - which is more than 36" away and hence a good target for shelling.

That is an EXCELLENT point my Canadian friend. I will definitely be trying that tactic.
My brother lives in Vancouver..... Canada ROCKS!

If you're wanting to hammer that 'stay-at-home-on-the-objective' unit, then the Colossus is your friend. A bit more expensive than the Bassie and only ST 6 BUT, it ignores cover as well as being AP3. Griffons are fun based sheerly off their low cost and the number you can field. I used to use them over Bassies way back in 2nd and 3rd (codex before the old codex).
Another thing to bear in mind when using Barrage against vehicles. You roll to penetrate against the side armor (pg 60, last line of The centre of the blast marker paragraph))

With most games being played on a 6 x 2 board the Basilisk really doesn't get much of a chance to shine in my opinion. The chassis is fairly weak and tends to be a fire magnet, so unless its in cover it is sure to be one of the first tanks to go down. Even then, if you do manage to hide it then you have a 36' minimum range. Against any army marching up the field this means that at most you will have 2 turns of shooting before they get within your no-fire zone.

For only 25 more points you can purchase a LRBT. With the LRBT you get vastly superior armor, a secondary weapon, a Battle Cannon with only 1 less strength, and no minimum range. In a standard game the only time you would ever need the ungodly range of the Basilisk would be if you were literally shooting from one table corner to the other.

The only time I would suggest running this old war horse would be in an Apoc game. In large scale games with vastly larger boards the Basilisk is a solid investment. Other than that, stick to the good ol' Leman Russ IMHO.

While a Leman russ is a lot more resilient, and it's true that the maximum range of the basilisk is unnecesary, most enemy armies will have ranged units sitting toward the back of their deployment zone. Basilisks can shoot over intervening units and terrain without granting a cover save - seems like a steal for me.

Manstein wrote:With most games being played on a 6 x 2 board the Basilisk really doesn't get much of a chance to shine in my opinion. The chassis is fairly weak and tends to be a fire magnet, so unless its in cover it is sure to be one of the first tanks to go down. Even then, if you do manage to hide it then you have a 36' minimum range. Against any army marching up the field this means that at most you will have 2 turns of shooting before they get within your no-fire zone.

For only 25 more points you can purchase a LRBT. With the LRBT you get vastly superior armor, a secondary weapon, a Battle Cannon with only 1 less strength, and no minimum range. In a standard game the only time you would ever need the ungodly range of the Basilisk would be if you were literally shooting from one table corner to the other.

The only time I would suggest running this old war horse would be in an Apoc game. In large scale games with vastly larger boards the Basilisk is a solid investment. Other than that, stick to the good ol' Leman Russ IMHO.

I totally agree

Plenty of comments coming in still on this subject.....
You & Mark on Sunday dude. He's bringing some Terrain too. Think he might be running Orks.

Uhm, the basilisk in direct fire mode doesnt have a minimum distance. I think with cover rules and TLOS in 5th, IMO the basilisk is even better and more durable then previous versions. Cmon almost every bit of cover is a 4+ save. Thats a 50% chance to ignore hits from anything. I think the basilisk is just a killer.
And like I stated before, you can tell, by who your playing against, if the basilisk becomes a primary target.(IE space marines) So be smart and set a friggin trap for those guys. You KNOW a SM player will drop a squad of termies there to blow up that tank. SO make sure youve got the tank covered and be ready to smash the hell out of a 400-500 pt squad. Sure youll probably lose the basilisk, but thats nothing compaired to the loss of a terminator squad lol.

Thanks for your tactical opinion dude. Got a game later today. I will put your plans on to the table top.