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Read, boggle, come and discuss!

'Ard Boyz Scenarios

Once again 'Ard Boyz favors armies with strong troop choices, and with KP mattering significantly in all 3 scenarios, that could hold a lot of weight in terms of army selection.

The inclusion of 0-1 Leman Russ Squadron for DH/WH allies makes sisters pretty sick. Two Immolators and 3 Leman Russ Executioners (or variants, you get the idea) makes me really wish that I had a full Sisters army. That is an absolutely brutal combo, especially at high points levels when you can still pack 60+ Sisters and their melta/flamers. I would say that Sisters could sweep R1 with ease. GK should have some interesting options open up in the form of Leman Russ anti-tank, as well.

The game lasting a set 6 turns also creates more options for fast armies like Valk/detta IG and [Dark] Eldar. Knowing exactly which turn will end the game creates many more options for flying in for a final contestation of objectives.

I found it interesting that the first scenario has a 1 turn nightfight special rule included despite not being dawn of war.

I agree, and doing so really gives an early boost to close range armies. The "nice" thing about DoW for a shooty army is that the vast majority of your opponent's force has to hike at least 36" to get to your guys. T1 is more about maneuvering than it is fighting.

With Pitched Battle deployment, mech Rush armies like Rhino or Chim-heavy melta lists are already 24" in by the end of T1. That's far enough away for night fight to screw up most of your opponent's shooting, and close enough to be in melta range T2.

I like the scenarios a lot. I'm going to be playing a shooty army (Tau) but the scenarios look solid and I don't see a ridiculous KP advantage for anyone like last year (i'm looking at you IG). I'm gonna test a couple of them out next week.

They look solid to me.

G

5 KP for an HQ choice can be especially rough for some armies, especially those that can take Command Squads. 5 KP for an IC and another 5 KP for the Command Squad and possibly 1 KP for a Dedicated Transport. Ouch...

Not sure how I feel about a definitive turn length. Two missions main goals revolve around controlling objectives. However, placement of objective counters will be interesting as it can potentially change placement strategies.

Of course they look solid to you. WC members got to playtest them.

5 points for HQ also sucks for space wolves who have to take 4 HQs.

I found it very funny that they included a bit in all missions that Chaos Daemons use the rules for Daemonic Assault. Time for a new loophole then I guess...

12thRonin wrote:I found it very funny that they included a bit in all missions that Chaos Daemons use the rules for Daemonic Assault. Time for a new loophole then I guess...

I don't think blatantly ignoring codex rules qualifies as a loophole...

Though I still laughed out lout when I read that. Kudos to GW for that jab.

@Sarigar

It doesn't work that way for guard anymore. They aren't IC's so the squad itself is worth 5 KP's and that's it.

As for the definitive length it makes sense in this tournament. Do I want to see it become the norm again, no because I like the play to win in turn 5 mentality

They didn't ignore it last year Danny. The guy just didn't follow the rules and deployed illegally. But I laughed when I saw it too.

No one will be playing SW is my guess based on that second mission.

They didn't ignore it last year Danny. The guy just didn't follow the rules and deployed illegally. But I laughed when I saw it too.

Yeah I was referring to the player ignoring his codex rules, not GW

Hehe, my bad misread what you'd posted

How do space wolves take 4 HQs? Force org gives two....someone clue me in!

Also....Hulksmash, I love critiquing Tau lists, and if you want to talk about your list lemme know. After our business dealings, I'd like to actually meet you so we both need to get to 'Ard Boyz finals.

Space Wolves have to take 1 HQ choice per 750 points of army, inclusive. It's a modification to their FOC.

So in a 2500 point army list, SW's need 4(!) HQs.

Do spacewolves not have big, burly, nasty IC+retinue HQ options? As an Ork player, I would *KILL* to have 4 HQ options, even in the 'Ard Boyz scenarios.

They do, but those options are expensive and somewhat difficult to transport. You can totally trick out some Wolf Guard Battle Leaders and their retinues, but then you're paying 35-40 points for T4 MEQs. If you give them Termie armor then you're looking at 45-60 points depending on equipment.

Anyone planning on changing their army lists after seeing the scenarios? =p

Dashofpepper wrote:Anyone planning on changing their army lists after seeing the scenarios? =p

Maybe a little... just going to add three independent Buggies for last minute objective grabs or contests. Best 90 points spent EVAR!

Say... I noticed on Round 2 it's Dawn of War deployment, but they don't mention Turn 1 Night Fight (which is mentioned in the Dawn of War deployment text). So how will everyone play it? Night Fight on turn one or no?

Nope, my eldar list im taking got a lot better with these missions

The Green Git wrote:

Dashofpepper wrote:Anyone planning on changing their army lists after seeing the scenarios? =p

Maybe a little... just going to add three independent Buggies for last minute objective grabs or contests. Best 90 points spent EVAR!

Say... I noticed on Round 2 it's Dawn of War deployment, but they don't mention Turn 1 Night Fight (which is mentioned in the Dawn of War deployment text). So how will everyone play it? Night Fight on turn one or no?

Scenario 2 includes Dawn of War basic rules, which includes nightfight. The only reason its mentioned in scenario 1 is because its a special added rule.

I advocated for a roll for turn 7 in the playtests. Mech Eldar have a huge advantage if they go 2nd.

That's presuming that the mechanized eldar are left on the board at turn 6. =p In fact, that's presuming a lot of things. A lot of games aren't going to get through six turns. Ork, IG, horde tyranid....

2.5 hours isn't going to get through six turns. =p And there's no guarantee that mechanized eldar are *going* to get to go second.

Basically any fast skimmer army, really. Space Marines and IG both have units to take advantage of a T6/2 Objective rush.

Danny Internets wrote:

12thRonin wrote:I found it very funny that they included a bit in all missions that Chaos Daemons use the rules for Daemonic Assault. Time for a new loophole then I guess...

I don't think blatantly ignoring codex rules qualifies as a loophole...

Though I still laughed out lout when I read that. Kudos to GW for that jab.

I was trying for diplomacy there. You know how touchy some people are about such things.

Dashofpepper wrote:That's presuming that the mechanized eldar are left on the board at turn 6. =p In fact, that's presuming a lot of things. A lot of games aren't going to get through six turns. Ork, IG, horde tyranid....

2.5 hours isn't going to get through six turns. =p And there's no guarantee that mechanized eldar are *going* to get to go second.

You may not have played against many mech Eldar armies. Last turn objective grabbing can be difficult to deal with. With an Autarch (which most mech Eldar lists will include), it makes it much easier to keep at distance from most other armies. They aren't an uber army, but Eldar generally don't win by tabling their opponent. Luckily, this year's missions don't necessarily require tabling to garner max points.

2.5 hours is more than enough time for 2500 points. After playing my Orks for awhile, it's a rare day to not finish a tourney game. With Eldar, it would only be faster.

To be fair, the bummer part is the Ard Boyz draws folks who will try to play a horde army and not really know how to play it, thus not finishing games. Some will think their IG gunline/Tyranid Horde/Ork Horde will crush all, when all it really does is take forever to finish a turn. Frustrating, but that's what happens in free tourneys.

I might cut a Rhino and squad and make a big terminator squad (with an HQ tucked in safely in reserve til near the end) just to even things out on my end.

Sarigar wrote:

To be fair, the bummer part is the Ard Boyz draws folks who will try to play a horde army and not really know how to play it, thus not finishing games. Some will think their IG gunline/Tyranid Horde/Ork Horde will crush all, when all it really does is take forever to finish a turn. Frustrating, but that's what happens in free tourneys.

That was me last year when I first started. I was Tau, and moving between tables (packing up, moving, unpacking, deploying) took 30 minutes with my gunline. I've learned much since then, and two tournaments ago I was struck with the brilliant idea of using a cookie sheet, and this year I'll have two of them so I can fit everything and move them. Only problem is going to be space to put the cookie sheets in the store.

Then again, in my area plus its suburbs, accounting for some 2 million people or so, there are only 24 people who are going to get to play in 'Ard Boyz between all the stores. =p Bad scheduling on GWs part. :(

Sarigar wrote:2.5 hours is more than enough time for 2500 points. After playing my Orks for awhile, it's a rare day to not finish a tourney game. With Eldar, it would only be faster.

To be fair, the bummer part is the Ard Boyz draws folks who will try to play a horde army and not really know how to play it, thus not finishing games. Some will think their IG gunline/Tyranid Horde/Ork Horde will crush all, when all it really does is take forever to finish a turn. Frustrating, but that's what happens in free tourneys.

Have any advice on how to play faster?

Our gaming group doesn't understand it...we've been playing with a 2.5 hour clock and trying to play fast, but we have yet to get beyond turn 4(and we've had to go beyond the time limit to complete turn 4, which we won't be able to do in the tournament).

Seriously, any advice from anybody would be appreciated. It also seems like most of the ard boyz battle reports I've read from last year, they rarely got past turn 4 and sometimes didn't even get beyond turn 3.

skipdog172 wrote:

Sarigar wrote:2.5 hours is more than enough time for 2500 points. After playing my Orks for awhile, it's a rare day to not finish a tourney game. With Eldar, it would only be faster.

To be fair, the bummer part is the Ard Boyz draws folks who will try to play a horde army and not really know how to play it, thus not finishing games. Some will think their IG gunline/Tyranid Horde/Ork Horde will crush all, when all it really does is take forever to finish a turn. Frustrating, but that's what happens in free tourneys.

Have any advice on how to play faster?

Our gaming group doesn't understand it...we've been playing with a 2.5 hour clock and trying to play fast, but we have yet to get beyond turn 4(and we've had to go beyond the time limit to complete turn 4, which we won't be able to do in the tournament).

Seriously, any advice from anybody would be appreciated. It also seems like most of the ard boyz battle reports I've read from last year, they rarely got past turn 4 and sometimes didn't even get beyond turn 3.

1) Gale Force nine makes a very handy tool for anyone with infantry (or who wants to spread out to the limits of coherency). If you can't get one in time, get a 12" ruler and cut it in half. Seriously - a 6" stick speeds gameplay in non-trivial ways.

2) Have dice in premeasured quantities, and multiple colors. For example, I've got a block of 36, made up of 3 different colors (in twelves). Make sure you have enough dice for every action you'll be taking.

3) Know the wound allocation rules for complex units. Know which of your units are complex. Know how many types of model there are in each complex unit (my unit of 8 bloodcrushers is complex, and has 4 different wound "buckets" to allocate to).

4) I find having a dice tray helps, in that it keeps dice from scattering all over. The downside is that dice near the "lip" are hard for your opponent to read. Make sure, if you use one, to keep it centered, and always remove "fail" results.