Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I have heard a lot of people say that old part cyborg Calgar can whip up on Logan of the Space Wolves............ I say no way according to looking at the wargear and weapon options....... They are looking at the surface of things and not the details.


Almost equal stat lines with the exception of Logan has one more attack, plus a bonus for two close combat weapons, given him a standard six attacks every turn of normal combat, plus a S5 option on those attacks at initiative or five S8 attacks at initiative 1. Logan always hits on 3 in close combat with woothtooth necklace plus has preferred enemy available, hence he is able to re-roll misses.

Marneus has one extra wound at 4, four S4 attacks or five S8 attacks at initiative 1. He will hit Logan on 4 in close combat, but be able to re-roll to wound rolls.

Both have 2+ and 4++ saves to deflect damage.

I have redone the math several times and Logan when he uses the frost blade options wins everytime because he gets two rounds of combat to finish off Marneus before he gets a second time to attack mostly according to averages.

Hence, Logan is still the bad boy who will continue to kick old cyborg Calgar butt.

HEAR HEAR!

Few questions:

1) Does Logan have Eternal Warrior? I believe he does, but I don't have the codex. If not, all it takes is one unsaved wound from Marneus to end the fight.

2) Marneus also gets a bonus attack for having two CCWs (the GauntletS of Ultramar, "a matched pair of power fists")

3) You should include shooting in your analysis, in which case Marneus' shooting attacks are AP2.

So, Logan is more likely to hit, but Marneus is pretty much guaranteed to wound.

Either way, interesting match-up. In a straight-up melee, Logan probably has the advantage, but then you're discounting a major part of Marneus' advantage - that sweet, sweet AP2 Storm Bolter.

Definately an interesting matchup. My back of the napkin math shows Logan doing 1.85 wounds per turn using the S8 and 1.77 with the Frost Blade. I show Calgar doing 1.22 wounds with PF and .75 with the PW. How many wounds does Logan have? 3 or 4? If 4, then yeah, he probably wins. If 3, I see both characters dying at I5 of the 3rd round of combat (as Calgar whips out his PW on that round). Basically whoever gets the charge wins.

BTW, this probably belongs in 40k General.

Ah, but Logan has counter attack, so even if marny charges they are on equal footing.

I forgot counter charge. Then yeah, Logan kills Calgar on Turn 2 regardless. Even with one round of SB shots and the charge, Papa Smurf only does 2.833 wounds before going down at I5.

MC will just dance around at 24" range and shoot Logan to death.

while I tend to agree that logan will probably kill calgar especially with prefered enemy I was wondering whether or not people took 4 things into consideration when doing the match up. I don't feel like doing the math

1) Orbital Bombardment (I know its silly but it still adds something)
2) Titanic Might
3) Logan has 3 wounds Calgar has 4
4) Calgar doesn't have to use the powerfists he still has as power sword. Therefore on turn 2 of combat they would kill each other since they would both strike at I 5.

I accounted for 2, 3, and 4. However, Counter attack breaks the tie in Logan's favor.

cool thanks for doing the math! I tend to forget that Calgar has a normal PW sometimes.

This is all a moot point, because you're all forgetting one serious factor!!!!




....THE GAMES WORKSHOP EFFECT.......


You see, Codex Space Wolves is the newest codex, so of course everything in it tops everything else out there!! This sells product, and keeps all the Wolf Cubs happy....just like Codex Space Marine kept all the Smurfs happy when it came out.....

You wild dogs are gonna be ok.....until WH40K 6th Edition, when they redo the Smurf Codex, and of course make M. Calgar the next God of War second to the Emperors own arm pit.....

Logan does not have a two CCW bonus attack since he only has a SB and his axe. Calgar only gets the bonus attack when using the PFs.

Delephont wrote:
....THE GAMES WORKSHOP EFFECT.......

Oh hush.

Calgar might be able to with the fists, but using the power weapon he'd lose for sure. It's not terribly likely that Logan and Calgar would ever run into each other without some squadmate support, but it's still interesting.

Logan eats Calgar for breakfast.

That said, Abby puts them both to shame.

...until he gets over enthusiastic and stabs himself in the eye while both Calgar and Grimnar point and laugh.

Depressingly true...

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/238097.page

...

Move this to 40k general... Or fluff section...


Rico...

It's even more fun after he may poke his eye that he still pwns the smurf and stray.

yeah, but logan wont kill calgar on the first turn, but if calgar whacks him in the face with the gauntlets of ultramar he'll die, seein as its instant death

He Who Stood wrote:yeah, but logan wont kill calgar on the first turn, but if calgar whacks him in the face with the gauntlets of ultramar he'll die, seein as its instant death

Logan has Eternal Warrior.

Moving thread to 40K Discussions.

I think that if we're going to math-hammer this it should be in Tactics.

That said, Calgar would make short work of poor Logan. The Space Wolf would go into the duel at least somewhat injured by those bolters and Calgar would have no trouble taking him on with those power fists.