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Is there any background out there, old or new, that explains how an extremely anti-Psyker chapter can deal with the fact that the Emperor was the galaxy's greatest Psyker?

Everything they do, including their Crusade which will last as long as they do as a Chapter, is for the Emperor... Yet the Emperor was the Ultimate Psyker!

Just curious...

Thanks!

1. The emperor is far from the greatest psychic in the galaxy
2. Their primarch, like all the primarchs, was also psychic
3. No-- it is shock! A hole in the fluff!

I find you guilty of the heresy of relativity.

OK...

If it is a whole in their background, it is a fairly major one.

And, who is/was the greatest Psyker in the galaxy?

And, I don't recall Dorn manifesting psychic abilities to any degree...

But, back to the original question with a twist, I suppose: How would you (meaning anyone) justify it, given their background?

Hello.
I think, that in this case, the Imperium is **rewed.
Doomed so to say.

They may not like friendly psykers for a security stand-point. Maybe they don't want their Chapter's secrets exposed. However, they can ally with pyskers from Grey Knights Space Marines. Maybe they trust Grey Knights more as opposed to others. Dunno. Just a guess, haven't really seen a concrete answer.

They may hate Psyker but they still use them...otherwise the fleets are fudgeed.....i Think what they hate are rogue untamed/weak unprotected psykers rather than those who can protect themselves/been trained to protect themselves/protected by being bound to the emperor.....

And I dispute the fact that the Emperor is not the most powerful psyker in the galaxy.....

I've always been curious how they handle potential "impurities" after facing chaos. Other chapters are able to rely on their Librarians for scans to prevent heresy.

Until the codex, I had thought they did keep Librarians, but they were aloof and typically secluded in their own section of the battle barges, but the fact that they don't have any at all could be worrisome...

Posted By Alpharius on 11/14/2005 10:05 PM
Is there any background out there, old or new, that explains how an extremely anti-Psyker chapter can deal with the fact that the Emperor was the galaxy's greatest Psyker?

Everything they do, including their Crusade which will last as long as they do as a Chapter, is for the Emperor... Yet the Emperor was the Ultimate Psyker!

Just curious...

Thanks!

I believe that the Black Templars dislike psykers to any degree, unless they are the Emperor who is obviously an exception to the rule

 

The Emperor, while unbelievably powerful, isn't the strongest psyker that ever was. Currently he is the 'Ultimate Psyker' but in ages past the Old ONes I'm willing to bet are able to blitz Mr. Bling Bling King easily.

I might be mistaken but I was under the impression that they couldn't ally with any psychics. I mean, yeah they have astropaths and things like that for communication and warp travel, but they don't use librarians, they don't ally with psychic Inquisitors...

Ahoj!
1 - cannot ally with models with Psychic Powers
2 - can ally with Psyker without Psychic Powers

The Emperor is the Great Grandad, practically God- everybody else is a witch ....

Borys

including the astropaths and navigators on their ships, the hypocrisy of the imperium continues!

Darkchild

You are all guilty of considering the heresy of relativity! To be a witch is a sin! Suffer not the witch to live! Astropaths are suffered to live. To even ask the question "was the Emperor, a psyker, a witch?" is to invite death. The sin of relativity, man!

It is proven that the Emperor is not a witch. Due to the weight of the Golden Throne, the Emperor does not float. As we all know, witches do float. End of story.

Now if they ever fit the GT with anti-grav lifts, then we'll have a problem.

Witches have diabolical powers they use to harm.
The Emperor and the saints have divine powers they use to help.

Pity the fool so lacking in clarity who cannot tell a demonic halo of flame from a divine halo of light!

Think of it this way, the people buring witches in the real world were good Christians. Christ had magical powers. But no one was ever bothered by this.

Or... conservatives don't like deficits, big government or open-ended nation building missions. George Bush has created huge deficits, expanded the government and is rebuilding iraq from top to bottom. Bush is a conservative. therefore it's OK.

Hmm, a story about a Black templar manifesting powers and trying to decide if they were divine or demonic and whether or no to tell anyone would be fun.

Kyoto you're talking about Daemonifuge, but replace the Sister with a Brother. Then when the Harlequin comes in to help the Space marine shoots him in the face. Then when he is challenged by the Inquisitor he kills the inquistior also... I mean like he picks him up by the head and smash him like a bug.

On a small tangent... I don't think the Emperor is the greatest psyker... I believe I read somewhere in the fluff that the Orks were by far the most powerful of all the psychic races. Fer emperors sake, they make their vehicles go faster because they believe painting it red makes it so. Same with their spacecraft, which are rickety and full of holes, yet are airtight because they believe it to be so.

I'm sure some ork somewhere is the most powerful psyker in the universe... he just doesn't know it... like the rest of the ork race.

Posted By KiMonarrez on 12/03/2005 8:43 PM
On a small tangent... I don't think the Emperor is the greatest psyker... I believe I read somewhere in the fluff that the Orks were by far the most powerful of all the psychic races. Fer emperors sake, they make their vehicles go faster because they believe painting it red makes it so. Same with their spacecraft, which are rickety and full of holes, yet are airtight because they believe it to be so.

I'm sure some ork somewhere is the most powerful psyker in the universe... he just doesn't know it... like the rest of the ork race.

Don't forget that ork Wyrdboyz and Warp'eadz are able to vomit out green psychic flames and manifest the foot of Gork stomping down on all those who oppose them.  It also seems to let their Rokz and Hulkz manage to appear in occupied space more often (would explain the " 'ere we go 'ere we go!" chant) as oppsoed to the more vast empty areas that are floating around out there.

However, to be fair, the spacecraft thing is also due to the orks' amazing aptitude with forcefields.  I think it was in WAAAGH: Da Orkz where it talks about Snakebite klanzmen using teleportation, tractor beams, and forcefields to rig up their rokz for WAA-Ork.  Surround the thing with a forcefield, teleport in some air, and then hitch a ride on a comit.

AK wrote:
On a small tangent... I don't think the Emperor is the greatest psyker... I believe I read somewhere in the fluff that the Orks were by far the most powerful of all the psychic races. Fer emperors sake, they make their vehicles go faster because they believe painting it red makes it so. Same with their spacecraft, which are rickety and full of holes, yet are airtight because they believe it to be so.

I'm sure some ork somewhere is the most powerful psyker in the universe... he just doesn't know it... like the rest of the ork race.

Nope. Go back to the old fluff (Waaagh Orks!) and you'll find that individual Orks only have tiny bit of psychic pressence in the warp. The thing is every singe ork has this small bit of this latent psychic power, and because of their tiny intellect it is a very "safe" from possession from Demons.

A Wierdboy is simply a conduit for collecting the psychic energy put out by every other Ork.


The Emperor, was (before his half-death) by far, the greatest psyker revealed in the 40K universe as of now.

Any psyker not ordained by the Emperor himself is deemed unworthy of existence. As they pose to great a threat. Astropaths are "soul-bound" to the Emperor, so they are ok. Navigators are more mutants than psykers I think. I know there is a "Navigator Gene", that makes them Navigators, so i doubt thats realy considered a psyker thing. Inquisitors are trained for years by the Inquisition, which was formed by the Emperor himself before the Heresy, so ergo the Emperor must bless the Inquisitors in its service.

I think we Templars are more superstisious(sp) than any other chapter. Their primarch was prety mutch not a psyker, I think, and Sigismund fought in the Siege of the Emperors Palace and saw first hand the corruption of the warp. And for 10,000 years they have upheld his ideals and beliefs. They dont hate the psykers of the Imperium, they just dont trust them. Why conjur up energy from the warp to kill an enemy when you can put a few bolts into them, or introduce them to your chainsword?

Sorry Yak, my pile of fluff only goes back so far... and it doesn't go back that far.

 

I stand corrected.

On whether or not The Emperor is the greatest psyker ever, I think we need to first ask is he still "alive" on The Golden Throne, or is that just an Imperial cover-up?

If you believe what the High Lords want you to believe, that he's still alive, then the fact that he's the psychic lens of a galaxy-spanning psychic beacon (The Astronomican) means he's pretty darn powerful. On top of that, he was nearly immortal by virtue of his psychic abilities. Sure Horus struck him down, but according to the old Realm of Chaos sourcebooks he had lived for millenia prior to the Imperium, born of the collective 'souls' of the ancient Terran shamans, siring numerous immortal psychic offspring (The Sensei), and renewing himself until the time came for him to rule Mankind. If this is true, then as an individual, he's probably one the greatest psykers since The Old Ones, rivaling any Slann or Farseer.   

If you believe what The Illuminati and a few Radical Inquisitors believe, then only a small fragment of his psychic being exists in The Golden Throne. If this fraction is able to focus The Astronomican, then The Emperor was even more powerful than we had thought. The rest of his awareness joined the mass of "postive" warp energy, and his considerable spirit gave birth to The Star Child (again, more info from Realm of Chaos), a supreme entity of purity - goodness, love, happiness, and hope. The Illuminati wait for the time that the Star Child will be reborn as a new Emperor. If this is true, then in his present state, he's essentially an elemental force of postive warp energy, easily surpasing any mortal psykers in power.

On the other hand, there's a good chance that The Emperor's dead as a doornail and that the Astronomican works only because all those sacrificed psykers make a hole lot of psychic racket. In which case, he was a powerful psyker, and an all around badass, but now he's a corpse in an elaborate coffin.

The Grey Knights are allowed to join the Templars because there is no chance of them being taken over by Chaos because they have seen every evil there is and are not afraid of it. The Templars would believe that a Librarian is weak and could fall to the side of Chaos and use his powers against them.

Librarians are militant rebels. Just ask the FBI.

what i want to know is what happens when they get a novice who manifest psykic powers?? do they put a bolt round through the unfortunates head???

@Elusive: positive Warp energy? burn heretic! all the warp touches is foul and corrupted. and I find it hard to believe that a Farsser is as powerful as a Slann.

and Orks ARE the most powerful psykers. KiMonarrez gave enough evidence. besides...I like to annoy Eldar Players with such statements

Interestingly, I think we may actually have some ability to gauge the Emperor's power, if in a fairly general way. We know that he went out on the Great Crusade, and Horus Rising tells us that demonic attacks were very rare. The strength of a psychic presence is presumably what attracts demons to a ship in Warp-space. At the same time, the Eldar used the Webway, only using more traditional Warp drives rarely due to the increased risk. It's repeatedly implied that normal Warp travel is just too dangerous for a group of beings as psychically powerful as the Eldar. Furthermore, we can safely assume that the Eldar have better Gellar field technology than does the Imperium. It follows that the Emperor is less powerful than a ship full of Eldar.

On firmer ground, we can also look to what we know of his creation. He is the amalgamation of a bunch of human shamans. We know that humans have only recently evolved into a psychic race, and that the incidence and strength of psychic power among them has been steadily increasing. Furthermore, an ancient shaman was incapable of individually fending off the predations of Chaos, something that modern human psykers don't have nearly as much of a problem with - even though the Chaos Gods are far more powerful now. Thus, the Emperor is only a combination of a relatively small number of fairly weak psykers. While having a 'bigger', 'stronger' soul than everyone else probably keeps him better protected, I'd be surprised if his powers were very far beyond those of various other psykers in 40k.

It?s well known that the Black Templars are still following the original purpose of the legions. That is to go out and conquer the galaxy for humanity. During the Grand Crusade all legions (except the 1000sons) where instructed not to maintain any psychic warriors. Sometime after the heresy librarians were allowed, however as the Templars were still bad *donkey*legionnaires still following original orders they will not allow any to pollute their ranks. Off course necessity for comms and travel dictated they needed to tolerate a certain amount of serfs and navigators into their fleets, but I bet those are very closely watched by the Templars. The emperor is acknowledge as the father of humanity and his power and purpose for humanity cannot be questioned. The Grey Knights are the ultimate weapon against chaos the imperium can use, hence must be respected by the Templars as such, as their hatred for psykers come from their true hatred of chaos.<?

I believe the emperor was the greatest psyker ever. In the short story about the final battle with Horus he was effectively fighting the combined power of the 4 chaos gods alone. And he was only holding back until the end when he unleashed his true power and the chaos gods had to withdrawal from Horus to avoid being destroyed. Except maybe for some of the original old ones no one can match him in the psyker field.

 

ok once again what happens when they have novices that display psycik talent?? do they get a bolter round to the head as they have no need for librarians.

beef: They may test for psychic ability before they start any training. The candidate would, at that point, just be a normal kid - they'd either execute him on the spot or hold him until a Black Ship came by.

As I understand it, the Emperor wasn't fighting against the combined power of the four Chaos Gods any more than a modern Space Marine can fight against the power of Khorne by facing down a Daemon Prince. First, the Chaos Gods have very limited access to the physical universe - really fighting against the Chaos Gods would involve entering the Warp to destroy and scatter them, and that's something the Emperor never dared to do (once more, the very creation of the Emperor was a way of avoiding exactly such a conflict). Second, the Chaos Gods are always doing things all over the universe - that they were all lending power to Horus means just that; they were also lending power to other Chaos Primarchs, to their minions, to the demons that were busy storming Terra, and to countless other small tasks. He was essentially Abaddon as a Primarch, a Daemon Prince of Chaos Ascendant - blessed by all the Chaos Gods and with some nifty weaponry. Just as Abaddon can trash a Chapter Master, Horus could trash Sanguinius. The Emperor was strong, sure, but god-like is stretching it. While he may well be the strongest psyker that's ever existed, he's not that far ahead of other incredibly powerful psykers out there.