Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

    Hello all. I will be entering a local tourney at the end of the month with my Tau. I will be using the old lists, as the new book will barely be out at the time so will not be used. I have only played a few games in 4th ed, but have played since 2nd ed, so I am a little rusty with what works today. Here is my list I am thinkng about:

HQ: 400 points 17%
Shas'o MP, Plasma, Shield, HW MT, HW Bsun filter: 138
Shas'el MP, Plasma Shield, Bonded,   262
    Bodyguard, Plasma MP Multi Tracker 

Elites: 351 points 15%
Crisis suits: (3) MP plasma Multi Tracker leader HW TL  207
                   1 suit w flamer and missles w TL
Crisis suits: (2) Fustion Blast MP Multi tracker  144
                   Leader w FB MP multi tracker HW Target lock

Troops: 886 39%
Fire warriors (12) 120
Fire warriors (12) 120
Fire warriors (10) 100
Fire warriors  (12) Shas'ui  Bonded EMP and Photon     273
                        Devilfish w decoy launcher
Fire warriors  (12) Shas'ui  Bonded EMP and Photon     273
                        Devilfish w decoy launcher

Heavy Support: 608 27%
Broadsides (3)  Bonded Team leader with BS filter 288
Hammer Head Ion Cannon Decoy Targe lock Multitracker 160
                Smart Missles
Hammer Head Ion Cannon Decoy Targe lock Multitracker 160
                Smart Missles

Total 2245

So I was thinking about adding some kroot and dropping the second devilfish squad down to a normal warrior squad. Probably get in two kroot squads then.

Any thoughts or suggestions?
                  

sorry for the double post there, either my work network screwed up or the site was screwy for a minute...

Hey, i think we're attending the same tournament (Gamer's Haven in Idaho?) so I might have some conflicting interest in giving advice. I'm not an expert but here's a few changes I'd make.

-FYI: Composition is not being scored by percentage but by the number of force org slots taken and multiples of units. Keep that in mind if you are trying to earn comp points. I do think you'll have to take some hits inorder to make a competative army though.

-You are taking a large hit in comp by taking 3 heavies and multiple hammerheads. There is also going to be a notable amount of AR14 at the tournament, as well as atleast 1 nid army. So I'd try to swap the ion cannons for railguns if at all possible. You'll get more out those comp points you're losing out on. Points can be had from making the crisis suit changes below.

-Don't bond. It's a waste of points in general because it ususally saves units that are already non-scoring. This is especially true of FWs.

-I'd defintely get some kroot in there. For one, you don't have any other infiltrators and you'll want to push back other peoples infiltrators from your gunline. For another, they are simply great for the points, espeically in a more static list like yours. dropping the devil fish is certainly one way to go. Also note you take a hit in comp for having more then 4 troop choices.

-I'd go with trimmed down but more shooty setups for your crisis suits. It will depend on what you have on hand for bits though. You might even be able to fit in more suits if you have models available. Something like:

Shas'el: TL-Plasma, MP, HW tracker
Shas'el: TL-Plasma, MP, HW tracker

Crisis team 1: 3 Plasma, MP, tracker
Crisisteam 2: 3 Plasma, fusion, tracker

I removed the shields beacuse you should be relying on range and IC status to protect the shas'els. Things have gone bad if you need the shields. I also moved the bodygaurd so the IC can keep his IC status. However, if the missions end up being heavily objective based, you may want to keep the bodygaurd.

The weapon setup is just one way to go but I'm basing it on what armies appear to be showing up. Atleast 50% of the armies signed up are marines and equivilent and a number of armies have terminators (like mine). You'd ususally be better off going with 3 units of 2 crisis suits but you'll get a rather large penalty in comp if you do so (3 elites and triplicates is -4 points IIRC).

Hope that helps and maybe we'll meet each other across the table sometime.

Posted By winterman on 03/09/2006 12:49 PM
Hey, i think we're attending the same tournament (Gamer's Haven in Idaho?) so I might have some conflicting interest in giving advice. I'm not an expert but here's a few changes I'd make.

Lol, yep same tourney

-FYI: Composition is not being scored by percentage but by the number of force org slots taken and multiples of units. Keep that in mind if you are trying to earn comp points. I do think you'll have to take some hits inorder to make a competative army though.

Comp is something I am only a little worried about, as many people will be in the same boat. You can only do so much with 2250 in those comp rules. Good to look at a bit more though.

-You are taking a large hit in comp by taking 3 heavies and multiple hammerheads. There is also going to be a notable amount of AR14 at the tournament, as well as atleast 1 nid army. So I'd try to swap the ion cannons for railguns if at all possible. You'll get more out those comp points you're losing out on. Points can be had from making the crisis suit changes below.

I never take the rail guns on the hammerheads because my rolling sucks. I prefer to have the railguns twin linked with the broadsides. That and I really like the ion cannons for marine killing Will have to look at the comp for these, however, so this could be an area that changes.

-Don't bond. It's a waste of points in general because it ususally saves units that are already non-scoring. This is especially true of FWs.

Very good point here. Ill be dropping that.

-I'd defintely get some kroot in there. For one, you don't have any other infiltrators and you'll want to push back other peoples infiltrators from your gunline. For another, they are simply great for the points, espeically in a more static list like yours. dropping the devil fish is certainly one way to go. Also note you take a hit in comp for having more then 4 troop choices.

Well crap, how are we supposed to get 2250 then... Yeah I had only glanced at the comp rules, and based this off of previous lists and available models. I might be able to set up a mobile pathfinders squad instead of the warriors.

-I'd go with trimmed down but more shooty setups for your crisis suits. It will depend on what you have on hand for bits though. You might even be able to fit in more suits if you have models available. Something like:

Shas'el: TL-Plasma, MP, HW tracker
Shas'el: TL-Plasma, MP, HW tracker

Crisis team 1: 3 Plasma, MP, tracker
Crisisteam 2: 3 Plasma, fusion, tracker

I removed the shields beacuse you should be relying on range and IC status to protect the shas'els. Things have gone bad if you need the shields. I also moved the bodygaurd so the IC can keep his IC status. However, if the missions end up being heavily objective based, you may want to keep the bodygaurd.

I have found the shields to be very helpful as plans always go to hell and my comander usually ends up in CC. I actually had my commander stick around with Bob's Khorne champ for a few rounds because of that, I think it was 3 or 4 rounds.

I do like the smaller Crisis units, but the comp is a big deal there. By keeping two units in the elites and one with the commander, this allows me to get around that a bit.

The weapon setup is just one way to go but I'm basing it on what armies appear to be showing up. Atleast 50% of the armies signed up are marines and equivilent and a number of armies have terminators (like mine). You'd ususally be better off going with 3 units of 2 crisis suits but you'll get a rather large penalty in comp if you do so (3 elites and triplicates is -4 points IIRC).

Hope that helps and maybe we'll meet each other across the table sometime.

Thanks for the advice. I typically expect to face a ton of marine armies, so I set up my armies to take them on, ie the ion cannons. Ill take this into account when I review my list. Of course I will also take into account your also being in the tourney...

Well, you have 2250 to play with, so if you NEED a shield, take it, but its not my first choice. I would drop a unit of crisis suits for Stealths (no repetition) and get Pathfinders in there. In a list this large I would take Firewarriors all over the place and not care about Comp. 4 FW units and a Kroot unit (or two) plus some Pathfinders will make things really nice for you. Railguns on Hammerheads are dual purpose: anti Armor and anti horde. Until the new codex comes out, a railgun sub round dropped on a markerlit unit still negates cover saves. use it while you got it. Good bye Orks and Guard. Marines will still continue to be your nemesis, but stay far back with everything, even suits, and make your opponant come to you. If there is going to be alot of AV14, then go ahead and take the fusion Blasters, though my first response is to not take them at all. In my opinion, a 6" gun on a trooper that sucks in HtH is worthless. If I had guard, I would CHARGE a crisis suit if it dropped so close. That and sacrificial units is against the Tau way of War. If Marines is what youre concerned about, take one Rail head and one Ion head, then Plasma. Or you could even put plasma on all of your broadsides. Let those berserkers close, theyre getting 6 TL Armor penetrating wound on 2's shots at 24". With careful deployment you should be able to overcome anything. Except of course droppodding fear causing marine armies.

    Yeah I have been looking at the stealth suits as well as the path finders. I think that I will drop the normal tau in devilfish and take the pathfinders. I am also thinking about dropping the second hammerhead, mostly for comp reasons. Good point on the fusion blaster. I will have to set up a list for the weekend and see how it all works out.

If there is going to be alot of AV14, then go ahead and take the fusion Blasters, though my first response is to not take them at all. In my opinion, a 6" gun on a trooper that sucks in HtH is worthless.

While it is true that the fusion blaster is only effective against tanks at 6", it is pretty good at 12" against 3+ and 2+ saves. Especially teamed up with plasma. Personally I'd pick MPs over fusion, if only because of the extra range. However it looked like you had some FBs already in use and pairing them with plasma is the best way to go.

I have found the shields to be very helpful as plans always go to hell and my comander usually ends up in CC. I actually had my commander stick around with Bob's Khorne champ for a few rounds because of that, I think it was 3 or 4 rounds.

Hehe, yeah his assault elements can get into your lines faster then you think.

I'm usually a big fan of invunerables on characters but tau don't really fit the normal mode. I guess the cost versus usefulness turns me off to shield generators. If the shas could score or kick butt in close combat, then maybe, but it seems like more points sunk into non-scoring models and you lose out on better shooting to boot (no twin linked weaponry or the upcoming target locks). Not a big deal though at 2250.

Also, you might want to magnetize (or sticky tac) your crisis suit gear though, especially with the new dex coming out.

Yeah I have been looking at the stealth suits as well as the path finders. I think that I will drop the normal tau in devilfish and take the pathfinders. I am also thinking about dropping the second hammerhead, mostly for comp reasons.

I'd be leary of going without 3 heavies at the tournament (as well as only 3 TL railguns), comp or not. I'm guessing people are pulling out the toys they don't field in the typical 1850 games, like land raiders, terminators and monsterous creatures. Tweaking your other choices might be a better bet.

Good point on the heavies. I will probably leave them in. On the same note, I will probably change over one of the hammerheads to a rail gun. Might as well throw caution to the wind...