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Ok, scenario is this:  You're playing against a friend's Night Lords.  Inconceivably, he brings a lot of Rhinos.  His first turn he rolls forward with his squads still in the rhinos.  Your turn, you blow up a rhino.  Your friend takes the required tests, then disembarks his models into the wreck itself to gain a 3+ cover save (thanks to the Night Lord rules).  Is this legal?

P1:  "(Wrecks) count as difficult terrain for infantry movement."  pg68
P2:  "It provides a 4+Cover Save for models on top of it or looking around it." pg68
P3:  ""When the unit disembarks, each model must be deployed within 2" of one of the vehicle's access points, and within unit coherency." pg 62
P4:  When the vehicle is destroyed, "The passengers must make an immediate dissembarkation move."  pg68

C:  It is legal for models to disembark into wrecks as long as they are 2" from an access point and in unit coherency.

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Or am I just missing the fact that people have been doing this for a long time already?

I can't disprove it. And my Wraithguard were doing it up until I stopped playing 40k.

Ebon,

Thats right, it's all legal, think the night lords are cool? I have been doing that with fortuned striking scorpions for a season now, with rerolled 3+ saves (better than 2+) they almost always all survived even a catastrophic wreck, even better, rerolled cover saves after the beast goes up, now the entangled still hurts later, but yea, it's a great way to go!  (Once I even mandiblastered a unit to death that tried to assault the entangled squad, they were IG charging into the cover.  Have fun!

Ahoj!
Disembarking onto wrecks is illegal.
And why?
1 - the rules say how to Disembark from Vehicles;
2 - to Disembark from a Vehicle, there must be a Vehicle to Disembark from;
3 - if you are Disembarking from a Vehicle, there is no Wreck to Disembark upon.

Borys

Just so you know you can't take cover saves when your vehicle blows up. You take armour saves.

P3 is false. Or rather incomplete. In addition to the rule that says that you must be within 2" of an access point, there is a diagram that shows you where you must disembark. It gives an allowed arc that's outside the area taken up by the vehicles.

So no, it's not legal.

Posted By CaptAnderton on 03/28/2006 6:49 AM
Just so you know you can't take cover saves when your vehicle blows up. You take armour saves.

Got a page number for that? Because my rulebook says "saves may be taken as normal".

I know you "like to see your words in print", but take two seconds to crack the rulebook open before you comment on the rules. You're wrong more than you're right.

Well, I am a tad bit confused. Are you talking about regular disembarking or emergency disembarking?

Each situation, IMO, is a different story.

If you are forced to disembark from a vehicle due to getting it blown up then since you have to 'leave' the vehicle I would say you could not disembark back into the same 'wreck'. I mean why not just claim that they don't leave it in the first place?

If you are disembarking in the movement phase and happen to be parked next to a different wreck then you could disembark into that wreck as it is now difficult terrain.

Allowing disembarking into wrecks completely ruins the solid tactic of the blocked-door squad kill.

I.E. I surround your Rhino with genestealers and rend it to death, thereby killing all occupants because they cannot disembark due to the 1" restriction.

Not that that has anything to do with the argument at hand, but its a repercussion to keep it mind.

Actually that is a great example of why you can't disembark back into the wreck you are forced to diembark from.

Mauleed I believe that is for vehicles that are working and not destroyed. Unless you are blocked by enemy units I'd let you go in the wreck. The reason for this is because the vehicle is destroyed and is no longer a model.

Mauleed I believe that is for vehicles that are working and not destroyed. Unless you are blocked by enemy units I'd let you go in the wreck. The reason for this is because the vehicle is destroyed and is no longer a model.

Then how exactly are you disembarking from something that is not a model?

Either the vehicle is still a vehicle when you disembark from it (which means you can't place your models on top of it), or it's a wreck. I find no evidence that suggests a wreck has access points; which means your passengers aren't disembarking at all.

So you choose. But you can't have it both ways.

Agree with Ed and Yak. The diagram on page 62 seems to make clear that disembarking cannot be done onto the model you are disembarking from. This particular paradox "How can you disembark from a destroyed vehicle when a destroyed vehicle is now terrain and not a vehicle" has existed at least since 3rd ed came out, and possibly longer. The only logical solution is to play it as disembarking, since that's the word used on page 68 when talking about passengers bailing out. For disembarking we refer back to page 62 and the diagram will control.

On the side subject, Ed, would you say you have a legitimate argument for taking cover saves against the wounds your unit suffers bailing out of a vehicle? "Cover Saving Throws" on page 25 seems to be talking about being shot at.