Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hey guys, I'm going to be picking up Betrayal at Calth box. I love the look of the models and the options they have, especially the Cataphractii Terminators. It has been the final push I needed to expand into another army. I've been meaning to make a Blood Ravens army for a while, and part of me loves the idea of the Blood Ravens acquiring unusual wargear like this, so I am likely going to brand their shoulder pads with the bloody magpies. How heretical is this idea?

It got me wondering what rules I should use for the army. Should I be using the 30k rules for these units or should I be translating them into 40k? (Maybe both?) I believe other players are more comfortable with 40k; however it doesn't have as many, or the appropriate options as in 30k. 30k Terminators have access to Cataphractii Armour and combi weapons wheras 40k terminators don't. The HQ and tacticals have different options too.

There is also the problem of which chapter to pick, whichever route is chosen.

What do you guys think?

I think they'll be confused for the Thousand Sons' Raven Occult, is what I think.

HH armies are designed to fight other HH armies. If you plan on using this army in regular 40k, I'd use C:SM. Everything in BaC can be used for 40k (providing everything is wysiwyg)

Well, Blood Ravens is just a vanilla SM chapter.
I'd go for a different chapter in terms of 30k.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
I think they'll be confused for the Thousand Sons' Raven Occult, is what I think.

What are those guys and how do I find out more about them? =O

nudibranch wrote:
HH armies are designed to fight other HH armies. If you plan on using this army in regular 40k, I'd use C:SM. Everything in BaC can be used for 40k (providing everything is wysiwyg)

I see. I was under the impression that they'd fit in well enough with 40k.

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, Blood Ravens is just a vanilla SM chapter.
I'd go for a different chapter in terms of 30k.

The purpose was for appropriating the 30k specific rules and options, as they seemed more appropriate for the models and their equipment. Sadly I don't know much about 30k, or what this Raven Occult mentioned earlier is.

The Raven Occult is a portion of the Thousand Sons Legion that Magnus sent away prior to the Burning of Prospero. They are believed to be the precursors to the Blood Ravens Chapter. The evidence points very strongly to that fact.

Well, technically the Blood Ravens don't exist in 30k since 30k is about the original 18 Legiones Astartes, well before the Codex Astartes broke the remaining Loyalist Legions up into the smaller Chapters that exist now in the 41st Millennium. The Blood Ravens are a Chapter of unknown origin and founding, which would have come well after the events of the 31st Millennium and the Horus Heresy.

However, there's plenty of evidence to point towards the Blood Ravens being descendants of the Thousands Sons legion (well a presumably Loyalist remnant of it anyway). The Thousand Sons were unusual in their high amounts of psychically gifted marines, just like the Blood Ravens, and their Pre-Heresy colour scheme was also predominantly Red. Given that the Thousand Sons eventually turn Traitor and that the origins of the Blood Ravens trace back to a 'dark secret from the Horus Heresy' it fits pretty well.

Forgeworld haven't got around to providing Legion rules for The Thousand Sons yet, and probably won't until book 7 I think (they're up to book 5 atm). A Blood Ravens force using Thousand Sons rules, whatever they may end up being, would be pretty cool I think. As for now, your best bet is probably to just use the BaC models in a normal Codex: Space Marines army (probably use Ultramarine or Imperial Fist tactics as they are the most 'generic'). Cataprachtii Terminators and Contemptor Dreadnaughts are still Terminators and Dreadnaughts, so just use the normal rules for those units.