uthorities say that a man is dead after being shot by police Wednesday evening after being pulled over in a traffic stop.

The incident took place in Falcon Heights, Minnesota, near Minneapolis.
The victim's name is Philando Castile, his mother Valerie told CNN affiliate WCCO.

No one besides Castile was injured in the shooting -- which comes amid a national debate in the U.S. on when officers can use lethal force -- Sgt. Jon Mangseth, the interim chief of the St. Anthony Police Department, told reporters.
In the car with him were a young girl and an adult woman, who live-streamed the immediate aftermath of the shooting on Facebook.

A busted tail light'
"Stay with me," are the first words heard in her video. "We got pulled over for a busted tail light in the back."
The camera shows the woman speaking, then turns to a man in a white shirt, covered in blood. Out the window appears to be a police officer with his gun drawn.
The footage was streamed on a Facebook account under the name Lavish Reynolds. WCCO spoke to Castile's family who identified the woman as Diamond Reynolds.
In the video's first minute, Reynolds says that Castile is licensed to carry a firearm. She claims that before the shooting, her boyfriend was trying to get his ID from his wallet in his back pocket.
The video appears to be shot with the phone's front-facing camera, so the perspective is flipped, as letters would be in a mirror. Because of this, the steering wheel appears to be on the wrong side of the car.

'Devastated'
Clarence Castile, Philando Castile's uncle, told CNN that the family is devastated.
"We all know my nephew was a good kid and we want justice as well as relief," he said.
The images of his nephew dying were the "most horrific thing I've ever seen in my life," Castile said Thursday morning on CNN's "New Day."
He and Valerie Castile, Philando's mother, stressed on "New Day" that Philando was law-abiding and a good person, and they expressed bitterness over the actions of the police.
"He's not an officer," Clarence Castille said. "He's just a man. An officer is supposed to protect and serve. That was a man who did that. That man is a destroyer and he came into our lives and done something and took something from us."

Castile said that Philando worked as a kitchen supervisor for the St. Paul School District. The last time the two of them spoke was in May. They talked about setting up a nest egg for Philando's eventual retirement.
"My nephew has a (concealed carry) permit, and still got killed for carrying a gun ... this needs to stop. This happens so often."
Valerie Castile said "they took a very good person" and wondered whether he was simply "black in the wrong place."
"Everybody that knows my son knows that he is a laid back, quiet individual that works hard every day, pays taxes and comes home and plays video games. That's it," she said. "He's not a gang banger. He's not a thug. He's very respectable. And I know he didn't antagonize that officer in any way to make him feel like his life was threatened."
She said she stressed to her son that if he ever had an encounter with police, he should "comply, comply, comply."
She said that when he got to a hospital to see her son, he was already dead and "they didn't let me see my son's body."
The mother said she hears people saying that police no longer racially profile people. She disagrees.
"We're ... hunted every day. It's a sign of war against African-American people as a whole," she said.

An ongoing investigation
Mangseth said there were two officers present when the incident occurred -- a primary officer responded, who he believes has more than five years of experience, and there was also a backup officer. Having both is standard procedure.
The St. Anthony's Police Department doesn't have body cameras, according to the department's office manager, Kim Brazil.
One officer has been placed on standard paid administrative leave, Mangseth said at a short news conference early Thursday morning.
No police were injured.
Mangseth said he hasn't seen the video, but he knows about it and that it was live-streamed on Facebook.
The nearly 10-minute video garnered more than 1 million views before it was pulled from Facebook.
It was then re-released on the social media platform with a graphic warning.
The Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension Assistance, a state-wide criminal investigative agency, was called and is investigating the incident, Mangseth said.
"We will release the information as we learn it, and we will address concerns as we are faced with them," he said.
Poll: 1 in 5 African-Americans report 'unfair' dealings with police in last month
Mangseth told reporters that it's the first officer-involved shooting in the area in more than 30 years.
"It's shocking," he said. "It's not something that occurs in this area often."
The shooting comes just a day after an officer-involved shooting was filmed by bystanders in Baton Rouge, Louisiana.
37-year-old Alton Sterling died, sparking mourning and outrage across the country.
By early Thursday, protesters had begun to gather outside Minnesota Governor's Residence.

'I'm right here'
Reynolds narrates the incident throughout much of the video -- alerting her followers and the viewing public to what was happening.
She's calm and composed at first; a striking juxtaposition to the officers yelling expletives outside the vehicle.
"Please don't tell me this lord, please, Jesus don't tell me that he's gone," Reynolds pleads with police in a hauntingly calm voice.
"Please don't tell me that he's gone. Please officer don't tell me that you just did this to him."
She's then asked to step outside with her hands up. While being ordered to walk backwards toward police, she points the camera at them.
The phone is then thrown on the ground nearby. The camera faces up, and it keeps recording.
Reynolds begins to cry and lose her composure. She's heard wailing and pleading with officers. Police can also be heard in the background.
And camera keeps pointing up at the sky, before it goes black while the voices continue.
Reynolds eventually gets a hold of the phone again, and says she begins filming from the back seat of a police car with the little girl.
She seems calm again, alerting viewers to her location and asking someone to come pick her up.
"I can't believe they just did this," she says.
Then she screams.
"It's OK," the little girl says. "I'm right here with you."

CNN's Dave Alsup and Joe Sterling contributed to this report

 jreilly89 wrote:
Yeah, unfortunately I think he should be charged with manslaughter. This definitely wasn't a case of self defense.

 Frazzled wrote:
The difficulty is its their word against hers, absent other evidence.

 redleger wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:
Yeah, unfortunately I think he should be charged with manslaughter. This definitely wasn't a case of self defense.

I haven't seen details released on just exactly how the traffic stop happened, but I myself have a huge distrust of LEOs in general. If this LEO does not get prosecuted, based on the facts as they have been reported, then I might hop on the bandwagon. So far most of the shootings being reported can be justified in accordance with procedure. When you do not comply with police, you automatically bring suspicion upon yourself, and a less disciplined weapon holder can over react.

As of right now, this LEO should be calling to whatever higher power he has, because he just committed a murder.

Prestor Jon wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
The difficulty is its their word against hers, absent other evidence.

Yeah, unfortunately I can see this becoming a case where the officer states that he thought the victim was reaching for his pistol and since he was in fact carrying the officer is going to be cleared of charges. That would be a bad outcome for a host of reasons but it's an outcome that seems to occur with shocking regularity these days.

 kronk wrote:

 redleger wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:
Yeah, unfortunately I think he should be charged with manslaughter. This definitely wasn't a case of self defense.

I haven't seen details released on just exactly how the traffic stop happened, but I myself have a huge distrust of LEOs in general. If this LEO does not get prosecuted, based on the facts as they have been reported, then I might hop on the bandwagon. So far most of the shootings being reported can be justified in accordance with procedure. When you do not comply with police, you automatically bring suspicion upon yourself, and a less disciplined weapon holder can over react.

As of right now, this LEO should be calling to whatever higher power he has, because he just committed a murder.

We don't know any of that.

The video starts after the guy was shot.

All we know is that that cop shot him, the guy had a CC License.

Where was the gun? Did they tell the cop he had a CCL? Did he tell the cop he had a gun? Did he move slowly or quickly reach for his wallet? Did he reach for his gun?

We don't know ANY of this, yet. Let's see the dash cam footage. Let's hear both sides of the story before we start calling people murderers.

The cop very well could be an donkey-cave and deserve to rot in jail. I'm certainly not a police apologist, but all we have right now is footage from after the event.

 kronk wrote:

 redleger wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:
Yeah, unfortunately I think he should be charged with manslaughter. This definitely wasn't a case of self defense.

I haven't seen details released on just exactly how the traffic stop happened, but I myself have a huge distrust of LEOs in general. If this LEO does not get prosecuted, based on the facts as they have been reported, then I might hop on the bandwagon. So far most of the shootings being reported can be justified in accordance with procedure. When you do not comply with police, you automatically bring suspicion upon yourself, and a less disciplined weapon holder can over react.

As of right now, this LEO should be calling to whatever higher power he has, because he just committed a murder.

We don't know any of that.

The video starts after the guy was shot.

All we know is that that cop shot him, the guy had a CC License.

Where was the gun? Did they tell the cop he had a CCL? Did he tell the cop he had a gun? Did he move slowly or quickly reach for his wallet? Did he reach for his gun?

We don't know ANY of this, yet. Let's see the dash cam footage. Let's hear both sides of the story before we start calling people murderers.

The cop very well could be an donkey-cave and deserve to rot in jail. I'm certainly not a police apologist, but all we have right now is footage from after the event.

 redleger wrote:


yes, all true. facts are scarce.

 redleger wrote:

Prestor Jon wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
The difficulty is its their word against hers, absent other evidence.

Yeah, unfortunately I can see this becoming a case where the officer states that he thought the victim was reaching for his pistol and since he was in fact carrying the officer is going to be cleared of charges. That would be a bad outcome for a host of reasons but it's an outcome that seems to occur with shocking regularity these days.

Unless the victim touched his weapon, reaching for anything inside your vehicle is not hostile intent, and therefore should not get the officer off. If the driver said he was carrying, then suddenly reached for his weapon, then I might side with the LEO. Unfortunately I don't think truth will come out.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 kronk wrote:

 redleger wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:
Yeah, unfortunately I think he should be charged with manslaughter. This definitely wasn't a case of self defense.

I haven't seen details released on just exactly how the traffic stop happened, but I myself have a huge distrust of LEOs in general. If this LEO does not get prosecuted, based on the facts as they have been reported, then I might hop on the bandwagon. So far most of the shootings being reported can be justified in accordance with procedure. When you do not comply with police, you automatically bring suspicion upon yourself, and a less disciplined weapon holder can over react.

As of right now, this LEO should be calling to whatever higher power he has, because he just committed a murder.

We don't know any of that.

The video starts after the guy was shot.

All we know is that that cop shot him, the guy had a CC License.

Where was the gun? Did they tell the cop he had a CCL? Did he tell the cop he had a gun? Did he move slowly or quickly reach for his wallet? Did he reach for his gun?

We don't know ANY of this, yet. Let's see the dash cam footage. Let's hear both sides of the story before we start calling people murderers.

The cop very well could be an donkey-cave and deserve to rot in jail. I'm certainly not a police apologist, but all we have right now is footage from after the event.

yes, all true. facts are scarce.

Prestor Jon wrote:
It really strains credulity to think that somebody who passed the background checks and invested the time and effort into getting his license and carrying concealed would for some reason try to draw a gun on a cop during a traffic stop over a broken tail light with his family in the car with him.

 Frazzled wrote:
Well, considering we literally have no information on what actually happened, I would make no statements until evidence appears.

Very sad.

 Howard A Treesong wrote:
For all you know he was going for the gun, who can say? There's no information here.

I think in a country where guns are common place, legally and illegally held, you should make your intentions very clear during things like a traffic stop, and your movements slow and precise. If you don't like this, then you need to think about what it means to have a culture where guns are so widely owned. I somehow doubt the policeman intended to kill someone that morning, but it's no wonder things like this happen when someone makes a move that isn't clear in its intent. It takes a moment for someone to pull a gun and shoot someone, snap decisions are made.

 Desubot wrote:
The only thing im confused about is usually when police pull you over, they will ask for license and registration first before you get out of the car. so why would be have been reaching for his wallet once he was out of the car.

Also not sure about else ware but in CA they generally keep you in the car for safety.

still this sucks :/

SemperMortis wrote:
I read earlier about this (cant remember where honestly) that the man identified himself to the officer as having both a concealed weapon and a CC permit, and after telling the cop this he reached behind his back for his wallet. From that point onward the details are completely non-existent but based solely on that I think both acted poorly, but the officer should not have fired his weapon at all. By the same token though I just recently read this article and it shows how this stop SHOULD have happened.

http://www.wnd.com/2015/10/soldiers-message-for-black-lives-matter-goes-viral/#!

Regardless of your rights and what you think should happen, you should always act extra cautiously when interacting with law enforcement when you are armed. They aren't all racists, they aren't out to get you, but they do want to be treated like a human being and at the end of their shift they want to be alive and go home to their families.

Do I need to have my permit with me when carrying my pistol?
Yes, the permit holder must have the permit card and a valid driver’s license, state identification card, or other government-issued photo identification in immediate possession at all times when carrying a pistol and must display the permit card and identification document when requested by a peace officer.

Do I have to disclose to a peace officer that I am a permit holder and carrying a firearm?
Yes, upon request of a peace officer, a permit holder must disclose to the officer whether or not the permit holder is currently carrying a firearm.

Prestor Jon wrote:

SemperMortis wrote:
I read earlier about this (cant remember where honestly) that the man identified himself to the officer as having both a concealed weapon and a CC permit, and after telling the cop this he reached behind his back for his wallet. From that point onward the details are completely non-existent but based solely on that I think both acted poorly, but the officer should not have fired his weapon at all. By the same token though I just recently read this article and it shows how this stop SHOULD have happened.

http://www.wnd.com/2015/10/soldiers-message-for-black-lives-matter-goes-viral/#!

Regardless of your rights and what you think should happen, you should always act extra cautiously when interacting with law enforcement when you are armed. They aren't all racists, they aren't out to get you, but they do want to be treated like a human being and at the end of their shift they want to be alive and go home to their families.

Minnesota law says concealed carry permits have duty to inform LEOs that they have a permit and are armed and need to produce the permit. If the victim informed the officer that he was armed and had a permit, as required by law, he would then need to reach for his wallet and produce his permit. I have seen some people on other forums question the wisdom of the deceased carrying his wallet in his back pocket where it was close to the holstered pistol on his hip. Personally I wouldn't advise somebody to carry that way either but I prefer IWB appendix carry, of course that's just personal preference, carrying the way the deceased did is perfectly legal. Once he informed the officer he was armed and reaching for his permit the officer shouldn't have been alarmed by the sight of a holstered pistol.

https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/bca/bca-divisions/administrative/pages/permit-to-carry-faq.aspx

Do I need to have my permit with me when carrying my pistol?
Yes, the permit holder must have the permit card and a valid driver’s license, state identification card, or other government-issued photo identification in immediate possession at all times when carrying a pistol and must display the permit card and identification document when requested by a peace officer.

Do I have to disclose to a peace officer that I am a permit holder and carrying a firearm?
Yes, upon request of a peace officer, a permit holder must disclose to the officer whether or not the permit holder is currently carrying a firearm.

SemperMortis wrote:

Prestor Jon wrote:

SemperMortis wrote:
I read earlier about this (cant remember where honestly) that the man identified himself to the officer as having both a concealed weapon and a CC permit, and after telling the cop this he reached behind his back for his wallet. From that point onward the details are completely non-existent but based solely on that I think both acted poorly, but the officer should not have fired his weapon at all. By the same token though I just recently read this article and it shows how this stop SHOULD have happened.

http://www.wnd.com/2015/10/soldiers-message-for-black-lives-matter-goes-viral/#!

Regardless of your rights and what you think should happen, you should always act extra cautiously when interacting with law enforcement when you are armed. They aren't all racists, they aren't out to get you, but they do want to be treated like a human being and at the end of their shift they want to be alive and go home to their families.

Minnesota law says concealed carry permits have duty to inform LEOs that they have a permit and are armed and need to produce the permit. If the victim informed the officer that he was armed and had a permit, as required by law, he would then need to reach for his wallet and produce his permit. I have seen some people on other forums question the wisdom of the deceased carrying his wallet in his back pocket where it was close to the holstered pistol on his hip. Personally I wouldn't advise somebody to carry that way either but I prefer IWB appendix carry, of course that's just personal preference, carrying the way the deceased did is perfectly legal. Once he informed the officer he was armed and reaching for his permit the officer shouldn't have been alarmed by the sight of a holstered pistol.

https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/bca/bca-divisions/administrative/pages/permit-to-carry-faq.aspx

Do I need to have my permit with me when carrying my pistol?
Yes, the permit holder must have the permit card and a valid driver’s license, state identification card, or other government-issued photo identification in immediate possession at all times when carrying a pistol and must display the permit card and identification document when requested by a peace officer.

Do I have to disclose to a peace officer that I am a permit holder and carrying a firearm?
Yes, upon request of a peace officer, a permit holder must disclose to the officer whether or not the permit holder is currently carrying a firearm.

You have to put yourself in the cops shoes though. If you read the link i posted you can see how it should have happened. I think it is a better policy for the PD to disarm the man first and return the weapon afterwards. Of course this then strays into the grounds of unreasonable search and seizure and and a host of other problems. But like I said, It is always better to be extra careful when dealing with the police when you are armed.

 TheMeanDM wrote:
Minnesota does not require you to identify yourself as having a CCW...from what I have found.

http://concealednation.org/2015/07/do-you-have-a-duty-to-inform-when-carrying-concealed-we-look-at-all-50-states-for-the-answers/

Questions I have are:

1) did the officer approach with weapon already out?
--- if so, wtf would he do this in a busted tail light stop?!?

2) if the officer asked the man for his license (as the woman says he did) wtf did he get so jumpy for when he went to get it?!?

3) I assume that even though they dont have body cams, they have vehicle cams that usually have audio...?

4) if she was the driver, why were they asking for HIS liscense?


This situation, on its face, is a horrible black eye for LEO's everywhere.