[1500] - Iron hands gladius

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**xscoutsniperx**

So I'm thinking of coming back to warhammer after leaving during the beginning of 6th edition. I used to play space wolves and have a nurgle CSM boxed away. I've always loved the fluff of iron warriors and their chapter tactics is amazing. I'm trying to learn these new battle formations things and refuse to use forge world. So here's my first try at a MSU strike force

Captain w/ Cataphractii armor, SS, TH -150pts

3x5 tac squad w/ MG -240pts

X5 assault marines w/ 2xflamers 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 3x HB, 1 ML -115pts

Chaplain -90pts

3x5 tac squad w/ grav gun -255pts

X5 assault marines w/ x2 flamers 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 4xMM, and combi melta -120pts

2x5 scouts w/ MB -120
5 scouts w/ cloaks, Snipers -70

X9 free Razorbacks with las/plas -180pts
X1 free drop pod (MM devs w/ capt)

total =1500

Should be 1500pts on the nose. If I did my math wrong or completely misunderstand the formation please let me know. Thank you dakka!

**Neophyte2012**

You need 165pts for a min 10th company task force tax to form a legal Gladius strike, before that, there won't be free transports.

**xscoutsniperx**

Neophyte2012 wrote:
You need 165pts for a min 10th company task force tax to form a legal Gladius strike, before that, there won't be free transports.

ok I must have misunderstood the formation rules. does it have to be 10th company or can I take a suppression force?

**Nevelon**

It can be a suppression force. It just needs to be something from the selection of auxiliary choices. You could even take one of the huge ones, like the strike force ultra, but would have a hard time getting that under the point limit.

Overall your list looks OK. It’s hard to pay for all the bodies at lower points and still have what I think is acceptable upgrades. You’ve got a good mix though.

One thing that sticks out is the captain. Naked he’s a pure tax unit. I’d shave some points to give him some gear. If you have access to the AoD supplement, a capheracti TDA captain is S&P, which is a great thing to add to a squad of MM devs.

**xscoutsniperx**

Nevelon wrote:
It can be a suppression force. It just needs to be something from the selection of auxiliary choices. You could even take one of the huge ones, like the strike force ultra, but would have a hard time getting that under the point limit.

Overall your list looks OK. It’s hard to pay for all the bodies at lower points and still have what I think is acceptable upgrades. You’ve got a good mix though.

One thing that sticks out is the captain. Naked he’s a pure tax unit. I’d shave some points to give him some gear. If you have access to the AoD supplement, a capheracti TDA captain is S&P, which is a great thing to add to a squad of MM devs.

don't have the rules for the capheractii TDA. whats it do? I reworked the list and have 85pts to play with.

edit so if I read it right it gives his unit slow and purposeful/ allowing the devs to move and shoot?

so 30pts for the TDA armor- upgrade to capheractii for free- plus storm shield 5pts - plus Lighting claw -10pts = 45pts. is my math correct? that would leave me with 40pts to play with. maybe upgrade the HB devs to Lascanoon devs?

**Corennus**

hi scoutsniper

The rules for the Gladius are:

1-2 Demi-Battle Company
0-3 Command Squads
1+ Auxilary Squads

Captain -90pts

3x5 tac squad w/ grav gun -255pts

X5 assault marines w/ 2xflamers 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 4xHB -110pts

Chaplain -90pts

3x5 tac squad w/ grav gun -255pts

X5 assault marines w/ x2 flamer 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 4xMM -110pts

FORMATION
3x5 scouts -165pts

Personally i'm hating the Dev squads . Yes you get a lot of shotswith the HBs but they're only Strength 5, and so unless you want to shooting at infantry only from afar I would consider upgrading to lascannons or Plasma Cannons.
You Mullti-Melta Dev squad I don't really get. They are a Suicide unit? Drop in, melta ONE vehicle first turn then get entire army firing at them in second turn?

Change your Devs to long range where they belong. Plasma Cannons or Grav Cannons for the win!

Also consider combi-grav guns on Sgts for your tacticals. If your Grav Gun doesn't bring a vehicle down the sgt can take it with combi.

**xscoutsniperx**

Corennus wrote:
hi scoutsniper

The rules for the Gladius are:

1-2 Demi-Battle Company
0-3 Command Squads
1+ Auxilary Squads

Captain w/ MB -95pts

3x5 tac squad w/ grav gun -255pts

X5 assault marines w/ 2xflamers 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 4x ML -130pts

Chaplain -90pts

3x5 tac squad w/ grav gun -255pts

X5 assault marines w/ x2 flamer 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 4xLC -150pts

FORMATION
3x5 scouts -165pts

x10 free razorbacks with lasplas =200pts

1500pts

Personally i'm hating the Dev squads . Yes you get a lot of shotswith the HBs but they're only Strength 5, and so unless you want to shooting at infantry only from afar I would consider upgrading to lascannons or Plasma Cannons.
You Mullti-Melta Dev squad I don't really get. They are a Suicide unit? Drop in, melta ONE vehicle first turn then get entire army firing at them in second turn?

Change your Devs to long range where they belong. Plasma Cannons or Grav Cannons for the win!

Also consider combi-grav guns on Sgts for your tacticals. If your Grav Gun doesn't bring a vehicle down the sgt can take it with combi.

I did a edit to what you said. what do you think?

**Corennus**

Better. What is the Captain taking?

If he's just a base model then consider taking the Chaplain. You get a power weapon for free!

What are scouts armed with?

Change the Lascannons to Missile Launchers on your second dev squad . you have enough las on the razorbacks

If you do that you can afford Artificer Armour for captain, make him more survivalble.
No point making Slay the Warlord an easy objective!

**xscoutsniperx**

Corennus wrote:
Better. What is the Captain taking?

If he's just a base model then consider taking the Chaplain. You get a power weapon for free!

What are scouts armed with?

Change the Lascannons to Missile Launchers on your second dev squad . you have enough las on the razorbacks

If you do that you can afford Artificer Armour for captain, make him more survivalble.
No point making Slay the Warlord an easy objective!

scouts are naked bare bones since I have to take them. probably outflank for later game objectives or camp if I can infiltrate on a objective with cover for a 3+. took your advice and heres what I got!

Captain w/ MB, artificer armor 115pts

3x5 tac squad w/ grav gun -255pts

X5 assault marines w/ 2x flamers 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 4x ML -130pts

Chaplain -90pts

3x5 tac squad w/ grav gun -255pts

X5 assault marines w/ x2 flamers 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 4x ML -130pts

FORMATION
3x5 scouts -165pts

x10 free razorbacks with lasplas =200pts

1500pts! with 67 bodies getting 6+FNP and 10 razorbacks with IWND!!!!!

**Corennus**

That's not a bad list now!

The alternative would be to drop art armour and give the scouts some sniper rifles...

**xscoutsniperx**

Corennus wrote:
That's not a bad list now!

The alternative would be to drop art armour and give the scouts some sniper rifles...

I could drop his MB and give one squad rifles? and outflank the other 2 maybe?

**Corennus**

Captain doesn't need Melta Bombs

Give one unit sniper rifles. gives you more flexibility

**Nevelon**

It would be nice to see the captain with at least a power weapon. You pay a lot for his CC stats, and a a PW gets you a lot more out of them. AA/power weapon is the minimum loadout I’d put him on the table with. Giving him a sword is more important then another grav gun in a tac squad IMHO.

MLs are kinda mediocre at everything. For the points, I’d rather have 4xLC and 4xHB then 8xML. Or even 3xLC in each squad.

I’d go melta (melta gun, c-melta sarge) on some of your tac squads. You are spamming a lot of AP2 on the razors, but there are still things out there that need a little melta lovin’.

If you are going to upgrade the scouts, I’d look into camo cloaks first, followed by snipers for a squad of them. Long term (higher points, variant lists) LSSs are very nice. But better for CC scouts or bolter guys.

**Corennus**

TBH in this list I can't see Captain and Chaplain doing anything.

You could put them with the assault squads I guess.

**xscoutsniperx**

Nevelon wrote:
It would be nice to see the captain with at least a power weapon. You pay a lot for his CC stats, and a a PW gets you a lot more out of them. AA/power weapon is the minimum loadout I’d put him on the table with. Giving him a sword is more important then another grav gun in a tac squad IMHO.

MLs are kinda mediocre at everything. For the points, I’d rather have 4xLC and 4xHB then 8xML. Or even 3xLC in each squad.

I’d go melta (melta gun, c-melta sarge) on some of your tac squads. You are spamming a lot of AP2 on the razors, but there are still things out there that need a little melta lovin’.

If you are going to upgrade the scouts, I’d look into camo cloaks first, followed by snipers for a squad of them. Long term (higher points, variant lists) LSSs are very nice. But better for CC scouts or bolter guys.

hows this? also I did a different style list in my first post. let me know what you think of both!

Captain w/ artificer armor, LC 125pts

3x5 tac squad w/ grav gun -255pts

X5 assault marines w/ 2x flamers 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 4x HB -110pts

Chaplain -90pts

3x5 tac squad w/ MG -240pts

X5 assault marines w/ x2 flamers 80pts
12
X5 dev squad w/ 4x ML -130pts

FORMATION
2x5 scouts -110pts
x5 scouts with cloaks and rifles -70pts

x10 free razorbacks with lasplas =200pts

leaves 10pts. not sure what to do with it?

**Corennus**

I'd almost say if you're going to go Heavy Bolters on Dev squads go big and do both of them.

Would give you 30 points to tool up your Captain and also give a tac squad a combi-weapon

**xscoutsniperx**

Corennus wrote:
I'd almost say if you're going to go Heavy Bolters on Dev squads go big and do both of them.

Would give you 30 points to tool up your Captain and also give a tac squad a combi-weapon

that's where I run into this list I made. would me interesting id think considering the amount of melta that can move and shoot and the capt to tank hits. makes them deal with it or get smashed! allowing the rest of the army to move up and get set up.

Captain w/ Cataphractii armor, SS, TH -150pts

3x5 tac squad w/ MG -240pts

X5 assault marines w/ 2xflamers 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 4x HB -110pts

Chaplain -90pts

3x5 tac squad w/ grav gun -255pts

X5 assault marines w/ x2 flamers 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 4xMM, and combi melta -120pts

5 scouts -55s
2x5 scouts w/ cloaks, Snipers -140

X9 free Razorbacks with las/plas -180pts
X1 free drop pod (MM devs w/ capt)

**Nevelon**

Both lists look interesting, and should be viable. I like the captain/MM dev combo from the first one, but the second one more overall.

There are a lot of places to spend those last 10 points. One issue with cramming a full company list into 1,500 points is you can’t get all the upgrades you want.

Swap the LC on the captain for a relic blade. (trade shred for +2S)
Upgrade dev guns. Shift 2 MLs to LCs. (or 2 HBs to MLs)
Add some melta bombs. If the scouts are going to infiltrate up, they might be a good spot.
Combi weapons

**Corennus**

Put the Chaplain in with the Devs too. may as well.

**xscoutsniperx**

Nevelon wrote:
Both lists look interesting, and should be viable. I like the captain/MM dev combo from the first one, but the second one more overall.

There are a lot of places to spend those last 10 points. One issue with cramming a full company list into 1,500 points is you can’t get all the upgrades you want.

Swap the LC on the captain for a relic blade. (trade shred for +2S)
Upgrade dev guns. Shift 2 MLs to LCs. (or 2 HBs to MLs)
Add some melta bombs. If the scouts are going to infiltrate up, they might be a good spot.
Combi weapons

Captain w/ Cataphractii armor, SS, (TH or Relic blade not sure?)-150pts

3x5 tac squad w/ MG -240pts

X5 assault marines w/ 2xflamers 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 3x HB, 1 ML -115pts

Chaplain -90pts

3x5 tac squad w/ grav gun -255pts

X5 assault marines w/ x2 flamers 80pts

X5 dev squad w/ 4xMM, and combi melta -120pts

2x5 scouts w/ MB -120
5 scouts w/ cloaks, Snipers -70

X9 free Razorbacks with las/plas -180pts
X1 free drop pod (MM devs w/ capt)

alright I think I have it finally finalized. last thing I cant decide is either Relic Blade or TH on the captian? im thinking RB so I can use the I5 and still hit with S6. since hes only T4 would be better to try and hit first?

**Nevelon**

Felling lucky? The captain is pretty tough, but not invulnerable. I5 strikes before a lot of stuff, and almost everything that’s AP2. But while S6 is nice, there is a lot of very nasty things out there. And the relic blade is only AP3.

The TH sacrifices your nice initiative, but hitting at S8 AP2 will let you threaten pretty much everything.

I’d risk going for the TH. CTDA with a SS is pretty solid on defense. The only way to get better is to invest in relics. You may occasionally get punked before swinging, but that should not be that often. And the rest of the time you get to put the hammer down and crush thing.

**Corennus**

Three words:

LOOK OUT SIR

**xscoutsniperx**

Nevelon wrote:
Felling lucky? The captain is pretty tough, but not invulnerable. I5 strikes before a lot of stuff, and almost everything that’s AP2. But while S6 is nice, there is a lot of very nasty things out there. And the relic blade is only AP3.

The TH sacrifices your nice initiative, but hitting at S8 AP2 will let you threaten pretty much everything.

I’d risk going for the TH. CTDA with a SS is pretty solid on defense. The only way to get better is to invest in relics. You may occasionally get punked before swinging, but that should not be that often. And the rest of the time you get to put the hammer down and crush thing.

sounds like TH it is! fits with iron hands also! would you say its best to put the chaplain with them or hide him in one of the squads?

**Nevelon**

Luckily that’s a decision you can shift around as games dictates.

If there is one big ugly thing that needs to die, probably together. In a game vs. another MSU army, I’d probably split them up, so you could blender through more units faster.