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Made in au
Splattered With Acrylic Paint




So currently I have a small problem.
I was planning to play AoS but got myself a small 1000point 40k army.
With that army I had no problems playing games at my local GW and FLGS.

But recently I moved to a different area and there is only one FLGS nearby and no GW.
The other day I hopped by to see if I would be able to play-
Lots of people were willing to play with me but they don't seem to play my point range.

I prefer having a small army (1000pts) because I don't like games going for too long but all the people seem to only play 1750pts and up.
Due to this I can't seem to play a lot.

I don't really plan to build up my army-

For my purposes should I play a different game?

If i prefer playing smaller skirmish type games would Warmachines or Age of Sigmar fit my style more?

Suggestions welcomed.
Oh and the next closest FLGS is like an hour drive for me so going to a different store seems unlikely :(
   
Made in us
Clousseau




The answer to your question is going to be it will depend on what games are going on at the store you are now going to and what point level they are playing at.

Sadly with tabletop games you are at the mercy of your local meta.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Denison, Iowa

Well, you have a few options. Ask REALLY nicely if someone would be willing to do 1,000 point games. Failing that you could just cave and go up to 1750. Depending on what army you play you could do it with not too many more models. For space marines that's a Character, a land Raider, and a small unit of elites.
   
Made in de
Witch Hunter in the Shadows



Aachen

Try asking for a 2v1 or 2v2 - at 2000 points per side your 1000 points would fit in well - but the game will obviously take much longer than a 1000pts game.
   
Made in dk
Khorne Veteran Marine with Chain-Axe






1500 hunded dosent take long time either. More fun aswell imo.

6000 World Eaters/Khorne  
   
Made in gb
Dakka Veteran



South East London

Admittedly I play pretty much exclusively at 1750 or 1850 points which seems to be normal these days for 40K.

getting a flexible, fun list to play at 1000pts is pretty tricky these days but not impossible.

The issue is more dropping 750 or 850 points from a pre-built list and still having something viable to play with. Also if you go to a pick up game expecting to play 1750 or 1850 that's what I would prefer to do.

However it isn't really a big deal to knock up a 1000 point list so I think the issue isn't necessarily with you or your FLGS but more your local players being a bit inflexible - you are after all new to the area.

These days though I would say if you wanted to stick with 40K you should consider increasing the size of your army as people rarely play 100pts any more (which is a shame as I see where you're coming from).

All is not lost thhough - for now you could encourage players to play Kill Team games and in the very near future you will be able to play Armageddon / Necromunda which I have a feeling will be very poular.

"Dig in and wait for Winter" 
   
Made in ca
Nasty Nob






What army are you playing? any options for superheavies in your faction so you can go up without needing to spend too much time expanding?

ERJAK wrote:


The fluff is like ketchup and mustard on a burger. Yes it's desirable, yes it makes things better, but no it doesn't fundamentally change what you're eating and no you shouldn't just drown the whole meal in it.

 
   
Made in ca
Posts with Authority




I'm from the future. The future of space

 auticus wrote:
The answer to your question is going to be it will depend on what games are going on at the store you are now going to and what point level they are playing at.

Sadly with tabletop games you are at the mercy of your local meta.


This is true for any approach to the hobby where you bring half of what's needed to play and hope someone else brings the other half.

A number of years ago I switched my gaming to one where I build both sides and the terrain and invite people over for a gaming dinner party. A friend also started renting out the multi purpose room in his condo building to host a club. Facebook, snapchat and Line chat have been instrumental in connecting with people. It took some doing, but I now have enough people I can invite that any particular weekend I get to play whatever miniatures game I want in the way that I want. I reciprocate, of course, and when a friend puts together a game, I play in it. This is how the hobby was organized for decades and it works.

It won't help the original poster solve his immediate problems, but it is a way forward in terms of a long term approach to the hobby. The best time to plant an oak tree is decades ago, the second best time is today.

My suggestion for the OP would be to scour eBay and the trade section here and find the extra 750 points using second hand models. Then once those are painted as well, start working on terrain. Then start putting together another 1000 point force (perhaps again with 2nd hand models) and start inviting people over to play. Start getting active on social media related to hobby gaming in your area.

40k might be going through a major transition soon, so I probably wouldn't put a bunch of money into new models at retail prices right now. Just like the people who bought in big into the End Times for WHFB into AoS, you might end up building an army and then having the player base you were counting on shift to a new version of the game and your army might not be what you want it to be after the transition.

Balance in pick up games? Two people, each with their own goals for the game, design half a board game on their own without knowing the layout of the board and hope it all works out. Good luck with that. The faster you can find like minded individuals who want the same things from the game as you, the better. 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

I don't suppose you're playing a force that can summon/reanimate/etc

it wouldn't be ideal but you could use the 750/850 point buffer you don't have as a summoning pool to replace killed minis/units back on the table

not ideal as you wouldn't normally reserve such a large proportion of your force but better than nothing (and free)


Edit: Ignore me I thought you were playing AoS rather than 40K so it won't work

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/03/17 12:21:53


 
   
Made in gb
Posts with Authority






Norn Iron

What Frozenwastes said. +1, QFT, and all that.

I'm sooo, sooo sorry.

Plog - Random sculpts and OW Helves 9/3/23 
   
Made in bg
Dakka Veteran





 frozenwastes wrote:

A number of years ago I switched my gaming to one where I build both sides and the terrain and invite people over for a gaming dinner party. A friend also started renting out the multi purpose room in his condo building to host a club. Facebook, snapchat and Line chat have been instrumental in connecting with people. It took some doing, but I now have enough people I can invite that any particular weekend I get to play whatever miniatures game I want in the way that I want. I reciprocate, of course, and when a friend puts together a game, I play in it. This is how the hobby was organized for decades and it works.


I've been doing this for the past 2 years since I switched towns. It is time and resource consuming, but you end up not relying on anyone else's efforts but your own. You just invite someone or bring something to their house and you have a game. People are willing to try and play games so long as they don't have to make the investment - do it yourself and you'll never go dry again

Age of Sigmar gets really boring at small games if you don't play it a little like rpg, invent rules yourself, go for umpired games etc. In short you have to pull a lot of stuff right from your behind... Others may disagree , but this is my experience since I don't like big games of AoS (too convoluted, too much effort for what it brings) and have been playing, lets say in your terms , up to 1000pts

Warmachine is kind of ok if you wanted only the starter boxes. After them prepare to spend some serious cash. The game is much better than AoS although not setup in the same type of fantasy setting.

I have a suggestion that you may find not to your liking initially, but it has enourmous return potential - try 15mm or 6mm historical gaming. A DBA game is really easy and straightforward to organize and play. Your units are cheap and most importantly they contribute when you want to play bigger battles as opposed to AoS which is virtually unplayable at higher point levels (you basically get to switch your old units for some new ones instead of adding them to your amassed force), I've read nothing but good things about Hail Caesar aswell , but have not yet tried it (no moneyZ for the book as of now )

If you fancy yourself as a longterm gamer buildup 2 small armies for 2-3 different games and bring them with yourself. Someone's bound to accept your invitation. Just choose your games wisely though.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/03/17 14:46:27


 
   
Made in ca
Posts with Authority




I'm from the future. The future of space

15mm historicals (or 10mm or 6mm, whatever really) are a great choice if you're going to provide two armies and the terrain. The play space can be smaller and everything, including terrain can end up fitting in a bag or box small enough you can take it on transit if you really wanted to.

Actually 15mm sci-fi is going through a continued explosion of stuff being available.


One thing I will say though, is that if the OP is having trouble convincing people to play a game they already own with miniatures they already have and rules they already know but just at a lower points value, then these are probably not the sort of people who are going to accept an invite to play some other random game they've never heard of. I bet the type of people are out there, but finding them can be a challenge.

Balance in pick up games? Two people, each with their own goals for the game, design half a board game on their own without knowing the layout of the board and hope it all works out. Good luck with that. The faster you can find like minded individuals who want the same things from the game as you, the better. 
   
Made in bg
Dakka Veteran





 frozenwastes wrote:

One thing I will say though, is that if the OP is having trouble convincing people to play a game they already own with miniatures they already have and rules they already know but just at a lower points value, then these are probably not the sort of people who are going to accept an invite to play some other random game they've never heard of. I bet the type of people are out there, but finding them can be a challenge.


Trying to play people who want to nothing to do with something that's not PP or GW at the "official" point level (for the club or organised or whatever) is a challenge in itself :\ . There is no obvious resolution to the matter, only options for the future..

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/03/17 17:38:42


 
   
Made in us
Clousseau




Yep thats what I experience as well. Moving beyond any "official" point level (where "official" represents the commonly played tournament level) in any system is a test of patience and fortitude.

I'm too old for that now lol.
   
Made in us
Committed Chaos Cult Marine





@Sikplex

That's a tough place to be for sure. Noting Australia flag, I can completely understand not wanting to increase your army on price alone.

I can also empathize with you on wanting to play smaller point games. In general, I like smaller point games as I can keep track of everything much better. I myself can barely field a 'standard' size game by joining everything I have together, and it is still not a very good list composition. Also, I feel as the 40K rules just seem designed for smaller games given all the special loadouts, keyword special abilities, number of phases and all the steps in assault.

That said, I have to agree with the other posts here. Once a group, especially a pick up game setting, establishes a certain point total most players don't want to deviate from it. First off it would require bringing multiple lists to accommodate the more common totals (1000, 1250, 1500, 1850 and 2000 seem pretty common to me). Each list having to be adjusted as it isn't a simple matter of more or less stuff.

Secondly, once established the point total becomes how most players think about the game and becomes the head space they use for drafting out lists. There is a comfort in knowing in general just how much stuff you can bring and how much your opponent can bring to develop your strategy around.

You are much better off biting the bullet and getting your army up to the point total as the rest of the group sadly.

As for trying a different game, my experience with GW players that in a non-conversation. Many GW players don't venture out of GW and often Warhammer 40K is there only tabletop game. Even if you have two forces with any other game many of these players can't be bothered to try anything they don't already know.

I am not necessarily saying don't try. However, it you do want to introduce a new game make sure it is one your are excited and want to play very much yourself. You are very likely going to have a uphill battle to get new players. I know, I done it myself. Even once you get players, you are very likely going to spend many games handicapping yourself and playing simple games until they learn how to play as to not frustrate them.

You are going to have to be extroverted and friendly asking other players if they would like to try a game and be ready to accept rejection for whatever reason they give as silly as you think it is. I have had players say they won't play Bolt Action because the models' heads are too big. Seriously.

You will need to provide everything needed to play (dice, measuring tapes, terrain, painted miniatures) and the nicer the presentation the better. Basically you need to be a good salesman.

Is it worth it? I don't know. I found teaching my friend how to play miniatures war games to be very rewarding as I enjoy hanging out with him and getting to game while doing so was a bonus. Him becoming a challenging opponent is awesome. I feel very lucky to have been able to accomplish this. I also find store, pick-up gaming is kinda terrible too. So avoiding that has also been great.

Good luck in whatever you decide.
   
Made in us
Enigmatic Chaos Sorcerer




Tampa, FL

I notice a lot the people will build like one list and then always want to play that because it works and dropping points means they can't field all the formations or whatever that they normally do. One of my friends is like that he only plays 2,000 points because he has everything you want in a list in that 2000 points and is unwilling to drop points because it means he has to drop units. I don't understand that mentality because you should not in my opinion build just a single list and then always play it

- Wayne
Formerly WayneTheGame 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




Had similar problems a while back, older editions of warhammer where people would only play a single point value and a single scenario, same in 40k, both played with minimal terrain by players who had carefully optimised lists for this exact set up and no desire to change.

40 and warhammer eventually died out to be just occasional games to be replaced by other games (which I had a hand in) where more variation was considered normal.

Your best bet is try and lead a change, suggest a small escalation campaign say, get people playing your size with the intention of building up - small steps
   
Made in ca
Grumpy Longbeard





Canada

I would play 100 points if someone asked, but would prefer to play the standard size if I can.

AoS is not a smaller game, it runs faster because the rules are simpler, but is really not a smaller scope. It's made for quite a full table.

If you want a a smaller/skirmish game the Infinity, Malifaux, Warmahordes or KillTeam are what you are looking for. I honestly don't think any are really better than others, the main deciding factor is what you can get opponents for (most people have the models for KillTeam from 40k). Note that while it does take less time than a Warhammer (either one) game, the models do more, so it will take longer than Warhammer with a similar number of models.

 frozenwastes wrote:

I have a suggestion that you may find not to your liking initially, but it has enourmous return potential - try 15mm or 6mm historical gaming. A DBA game is really easy and straightforward to organize and play. Your units are cheap and most importantly they contribute when you want to play bigger battles as opposed to AoS which is virtually unplayable at higher point levels (you basically get to switch your old units for some new ones instead of adding them to your amassed force), I've read nothing but good things about Hail Caesar aswell , but have not yet tried it (no moneyZ for the book as of now .


Smaller scale is definitely awesome (putting together a 6mm Alexandrian army at the moment) and I would add Basic Impetus to that list. It's also way cheaper; I ordered 3 units for my army today (the full army will have 11and units are bigger than DBA ones) and the cost came to £6 (yes, six) excluding postage (which I split). The problem of finding someone to play comes up aging though. I my experience historical gamers have club/groups separate from FLGS's.

An important point is that you should promote what you want to play, if what you want to play isn't common then you have tp change to match the situation or change the situation. Give intro games and drive the game yourself.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/03/20 19:50:38


Nightstalkers Dwarfs
GASLANDS!
Holy Roman Empire  
   
Made in ca
Posts with Authority




I'm from the future. The future of space

The quote above was actually from CoreCommander, not me.

I'm currently in the process of rebasing my DBA armies into Basic Impetus 2.0 ones. I'm going with big units with 4+ times the figures of the same army in DBA though.

This talk about small scale does bring up an important consideration if you're going to bring both sides and some terrain. Portability. My impetus table is 4x3 and I'll be able to take both armies, the game mat and all the terrain with me in one of those roller suitcases.

Age of Sigmar might be better in terms of smaller games if that's what the local people are doing. I finally got to try it out (again, a local put together two armies and terrrain and ran a game of it at a local small convention) and apparently here lots of people play with like 25-50ish miniatures per side. Which is probably in the ball park of a 1000 point 40k army. I have no idea what is the norm though, just what the locals do. As the original poster discovered, this can vary quite a bit from location to location.


Balance in pick up games? Two people, each with their own goals for the game, design half a board game on their own without knowing the layout of the board and hope it all works out. Good luck with that. The faster you can find like minded individuals who want the same things from the game as you, the better. 
   
Made in ca
Grumpy Longbeard





Canada

Going over to Basic Impetus 2 myself. There are so few figures in my DBA army (and 6mm is so cheap) that ripping them up is not really worthwhile. I'm just starting at the bottom and keeping my DBA as is.

Nightstalkers Dwarfs
GASLANDS!
Holy Roman Empire  
   
Made in us
Sinewy Scourge




Boulder, Colorado

I prefer larger games, just because its more fun to include the models I love.

However, maybe try kill team? I find people usually love that, at least for a little bit.

   
Made in ca
Posts with Authority




I'm from the future. The future of space

DarkBlack wrote:Going over to Basic Impetus 2 myself. There are so few figures in my DBA army (and 6mm is so cheap) that ripping them up is not really worthwhile. I'm just starting at the bottom and keeping my DBA as is.


I made the mistake of using mounting board for the bases and they are warping. So I figured why not get some good laser cut MDF bases and make the switch. At 15mm, it's still worth rebasing.

gummyofallbears wrote:I prefer larger games, just because its more fun to include the models I love.

However, maybe try kill team? I find people usually love that, at least for a little bit.


The new Armageddon based skirmish game (apparently a Necromunda variant) might also be worth checking out when it comes out.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/03/21 00:21:53


Balance in pick up games? Two people, each with their own goals for the game, design half a board game on their own without knowing the layout of the board and hope it all works out. Good luck with that. The faster you can find like minded individuals who want the same things from the game as you, the better. 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






SoCal, USA!

If the problem is that you need to add 750 points, just get a Warhound Titan with dual Turbolasers laying down the S(D) Large Blasts. If they want to play 1750, no problem, break out the Warhound and start cleaning up the board. Or, they can play 1000 pts without your Scout Titan. Problem solved!

   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






New Orleans, LA

Wayniac wrote:
I notice a lot the people will build like one list and then always want to play that because it works and dropping points means they can't field all the formations or whatever that they normally do. One of my friends is like that he only plays 2,000 points because he has everything you want in a list in that 2000 points and is unwilling to drop points because it means he has to drop units. I don't understand that mentality because you should not in my opinion build just a single list and then always play it


On that topic, come to a store with multiple lists. Find a way to make that 2000 point list work at 1500, even if you bring a few different units to make it happen. Be prepared for whatever if you're looking for pickup games.

When I played at a local store for a month or so, I noticed a similar problem. There was only so much room to play, so players often played 2 on 2, 3 on 3, or even 2 on 3. After discussion, people would usually make either a 1000 or 1500 point list. Every night, people had to hand write out a new list. Every. fething. Time.

These are guys that play every week for years.

And they still came to game night with random gak, no lists, and wasted an 60 to 90 minutes getting their gak together.

They are great people and players. Don't get me wrong. I'd play any of them any time. But come on, guys. Get your gak together.

DA:70S+G+M+B++I++Pw40k08+D++A++/fWD-R+T(M)DM+
 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Moustache-twirling Princeps





Gone-to-ground in the craters of Coventry

If people are happy with you proxying as you build up, try that. If they won't budge from 1750 and up, get there by any means.
It is their rule, and should be flexible with you bending to their demands.

6000 pts - 4000 pts - Harlies: 1000 pts - 1000 ptsDS:70+S+G++MB+IPw40k86/f+D++A++/cWD64R+T(T)DM+
IG/AM force nearly-finished pieces: http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/images-38888-41159_Armies%20-%20Imperial%20Guard.html
"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw (probably)
Clubs around Coventry, UK 
   
Made in us
Homicidal Veteran Blood Angel Assault Marine






Asking us is not going to be overly helpful to you. You need to talk to the people at the store and see what other games are played there, otherwise you're going to buy into a game system just to find out no one plays it. They'll also be able to demo games for you so you can see if you want to go with them or not.

4500
 
   
Made in gb
Posts with Authority






Norn Iron

Skinnereal wrote:get there by any means.
It is their rule, and should be flexible with you bending to their demands.


This just seems wrong.

troa wrote:You need to talk to the people at the store and see what other games are played there, otherwise you're going to buy into a game system just to find out no one plays it. They'll also be able to demo games for you so you can see if you want to go with them or not.


I think Frozenwastes' and CoreCommander's posts need to be brought up again. I've kept people entertained with a handful of cowboy minis and a small town built out of corrugated cardboard. I've got a few people in a strange LGS interested in 10mm fantasy with a couple of small Warmaster armies and some printouts from Mayhem. I waved a copy of Black Powder about when a club was getting fed up with WAB. I got the same club into Dystopian Wars with a bare-resin Covenant of Antarctica starter set split into two puny fleets. The caveat, as with the other posters, is that these were among gamers who were at least unopposed to the existence of games besides 40K. (With Sikplex's experience one more piece of evidence that it's less a game and more some kind of listbuilding cult. Bend to their demands!) But point standing: I demo'd games that I wanted to go with, that no-one else played.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/03/22 12:08:22


I'm sooo, sooo sorry.

Plog - Random sculpts and OW Helves 9/3/23 
   
 
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