Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.
So my mate plays necrons and i play death guard and i am struggling to kill anything in his army (to be fair he cant budge me either). He has the decurion and harvest formatons so everything has 4+ reserection protocols. How would you suggest i deal with this, everything i throw at him just bounces off
I'd recommend taking the Cult of Destruction and the Haemotrope reactor.
Dropping down 6+ S7, AP 2 templates a round is hilarious. He's gonna fail some of them.
Still, the Haemotrope Reactor and the Cult of Destruction is hilarious.
This seems hilarious for every other turn, not every turn as Oblits cannot use the same weapon two turns in a row. This also restricts them to standing right next to the thing.
Go stand on Objectives. If you're running a warband and he's running a decurion you have ObSec and he doesn't. Since neither of you will be able to kill the other, you'll basically have one of the most boring games of 40k ever where both sides slowly shuffle onto objectives and you both roll dice endlessly without ever removing a model.
Peregrine wrote: What, you don't like rolling dice to see how many dice you roll? Why are you such an anti-dice bigot?
Drasius wrote: Go stand on Objectives. If you're running a warband and he's running a decurion you have ObSec and he doesn't. Since neither of you will be able to kill the other, you'll basically have one of the most boring games of 40k ever where both sides slowly shuffle onto objectives and you both roll dice endlessly without ever removing a model.
As the others have stated, you're both super tough hard to kill forces. Effectively just marines shooting marines, which all those who have seen not much happens.
Depending on mission type, either holding ground, which as deathguard you'll do better, or kill points, you'll have a slightly harder time than him.
Raptors/deamons are a good counter overall, as they can threaten anything he has. If you're feeling sassy, take a Cabal of sorcerors and just start summoning Deamons on a 3+. He'll have little to no counter since he has no psykers himself, and you can start spawning meatshields to mess up his gun lines and draw fire away from your more valuable units.
Lastly Artillery. Necrons are mid to close range specialist, with few weapons above 36", and don't have a good counter other than the doomsday ark (which isn't indirect). Ally in some traitor guard, marines or take fortifications (the battlecannon one) to just start lobbing some big old S8 ap3 pie plates.
8th Overhaul!
Over 18,000 SM
Over 7000 Tyranids
About 3000 Genestealer cult
About 6000 IG
About 2500 Chaos
About 5000 Skitarii/Admech *Current focus
About 3000 Deamons
2 Imperial Knigts... Soon to be a third
Vindicator. I know, Necrons have little problems in dealing with vehicles, but so far against decurion the vindi has been the only weapon for me to actually kill them. If you have three of them, take them in a squad.
Other than that, Cult of destruction. Maybe plague zombies to tarpit what you don't like, as Necrons lack punch.
My local necron player hates S8 Ap4, the Necrons go from being between Marines And Terminators to having Guard-grade defenses.
One of the few uses for my Forge Fiends, also works with Blast Masters and Decimators/Contemptors with Butcher Cannons.
This silence offends Slaanesh! Things will get loud now!
Everyone has so far offered great advice in different areas, so I'll try and cover a few different units.
First things first stop the wraiths. To do this focus on the spider first. A lascannon pred can make short work with it with a little support, it will also help for the monolith and stalker. The next step is either a huge weight of fire or S8 or higher to stop the wraiths. Someone mentioned forgefiend and decimator w/ butcher cannons. If you take the former with the template head you might get lucky and ID an extra wraith or 2. You could always just throw enough fearless cultists for a tarpit, but I think the wraiths would chop em up pretty quick.
Second, initiate close combat w/ everything but wraiths. Bikes, Raptors, Spawn, your choice. The low initiative kills Necrons and often forces them to be swept in combat. Special weapons on champs should be ready to deal with scythes from the heroes.
Third, Kill the rest. These options I haven't seen listed yet, but would have some great effectiveness. Auto/Hvy Bolter Predator with havoc and soul blaze. Have that combine fire with a unit of havoc full of Hvy Bolters and you will be leaf blowing crons left and right. Both units have about a foot on necrons average range so they should be safe for a turn at least.
Late to the party, but I'm going to repost this here:
WHAT TO DO IF PLAYING AGAINST A
NECRON DECURION
Do:
Spoiler:
- Focus on capturing objectives. (Decurions have zero ObSec. Most games won against Decuri'Crons are done so by out scoring them this way).
- Tie up their shooters in combat. (Your goal is not necessarily to kill them, so much as prevent them from being able to shoot. Necrons are usually most effective when shooting, so if you neuter them that way there's not much they can do. Note: the majority of their shooters are garbage in CC so you don't even really have to worry about your own stuff getting wiped out. Just sic something fast, disposable, and mildly survivable on them and you should be able to effectively remove that unit from the game. Bonus if your own unit is ObSec).
- Load up on AP3. (All their best stuff is 3+. Anything that's good against Marines is usually good against them).
- Take out the Spyder ASAP. (Tomb Blades being next on the target priority list. Then Stalkers. Then Destroyers and Praetorians. Anything else isn't as big a worry).
- Avoid the Deathstar. (It'll probably be combat based and very hard to kill. Luckily it'll probably also be slow. Less so if it has Wraiths. However, if it has Pylons, rush towards it and engage immediately to prevent it from firing a second time... I'm sorry, but I don't think you'll be able to stop that one's first/alpha strike).
- Beware their choppy guys. (Some of them are deceptively lethal, ie. Flayed Ones and Scarabs. Avoid getting caught by anything CC related for as long as you can).
Do not:
Spoiler:
- Aim to table them. (They're tough as nails, it's just going to end in frustration).
- Count on them being slow. (Some of them are. Many of them are not. Don't be surprised if you suddenly have a bunch of guys in your face turn two... or some times even turn one!).
- Expect to steamroll them in combat. (As mentioned above, a lot of their choppy things are actually quite effective in assault, and even their troops are hard to put enough wounds on to reliably lower their leadership to sweep).
- Fall for Wraith bait. (They're not as scary as you think, their primary role is tarpit. They're incredibly hard to kill, especially in a Harvest, so shooting at them may result in a lot of wasted shots. Best bet is to hope to engage them with your own speedy tarpit before they have a chance to catch your best unit and hold it there for the remainder of the game).
- Worry about how to kill Warriors. (Focus on killing the better stuff, they're going to be the ones really putting the hurt on you, and obviously anything that can kill T5 3+ can kill T4 4+ as well).
- Be too concerned with anti-AV. (Necron vehicles aren't that great anymore so many competitive players don't even bother bringing them. Why bother when the real star of the show is your infantry? A couple Meltas in your list should be fine, just in case).
- Stress about Gauss. (Yes, it has the potential to wound/glance anything in the game. The thing is, that only happens on a to-wound/to-pen roll of 6. So they have to be able to hit what they're aiming at, roll a 6 to wound/pen, then hope the target fails its save. Statistically not wonderful odds at doing a lot of damage. Most Necrons players are better off taking things that can do the job more effectively. Note: obviously those measly odds can be helped if you increase their number, so be aware that Warrior spam is a somewhat valid tactic. The good thing is, for it to work well they need to bring a LOT of Warriors, meaning they won't have points left for much of the scarier stuff).
TremendousZ wrote: Everyone has so far offered great advice in different areas, so I'll try and cover a few different units.
First things first stop the wraiths. To do this focus on the spider first. A lascannon pred can make short work with it with a little support, it will also help for the monolith and stalker. The next step is either a huge weight of fire or S8 or higher to stop the wraiths. Someone mentioned forgefiend and decimator w/ butcher cannons. If you take the former with the template head you might get lucky and ID an extra wraith or 2. You could always just throw enough fearless cultists for a tarpit, but I think the wraiths would chop em up pretty quick.
Second, initiate close combat w/ everything but wraiths. Bikes, Raptors, Spawn, your choice. The low initiative kills Necrons and often forces them to be swept in combat. Special weapons on champs should be ready to deal with scythes from the heroes.
Third, Kill the rest. These options I haven't seen listed yet, but would have some great effectiveness. Auto/Hvy Bolter Predator with havoc and soul blaze. Have that combine fire with a unit of havoc full of Hvy Bolters and you will be leaf blowing crons left and right. Both units have about a foot on necrons average range so they should be safe for a turn at least.
Hope this helps!
Wraiths are T5, Str8 isn't going to help. it takes ~81 bolter shots to drop 3 wraiths WITHOUT reanimation or ~44 BS3 str8 shots. That's 5 turns of a hades forgefiend firing every turn and only just dropping the last 1 when you're starting to roll to see if the game ends while costing 175 vs the 129 of 3 wraiths with whip coils (because they always have whip coils).
Flayed ones, praetorians and lychguard will also rape anything but a deathstar silly so ramming them into combat isn't really a great plan. You'll also have to be packing some serious weapons to be able to plow through both armour saves and 4+++ to get them to be testing Ld at all, let alone at a significant enough modifier to get them to break.
If you think that heavy bolters and sould blaze are the answer, I really have to wonder when the last time you actually played against Necron was because while Str5 AP4 may look good on paper against T4 4+, it doesn't really work in game
Peregrine wrote: What, you don't like rolling dice to see how many dice you roll? Why are you such an anti-dice bigot?
Drasius wrote: Wraiths are T5, Str8 isn't going to help. it takes ~81 bolter shots to drop 3 wraiths WITHOUT reanimation or ~44 BS3 str8 shots. That's 5 turns of a hades forgefiend firing every turn and only just dropping the last 1 when you're starting to roll to see if the game ends while costing 175 vs the 129 of 3 wraiths with whip coils (because they always have whip coils).
Restating for emphasis:
STOP TRYING TO SHOOT WRAITHS Especially Harvest Wraiths.
It's just wasted shots.
Don't be too concerned about trying to kill them in combat, too. Your goal should be tying them up with something fast. Otherwise they'll do what they're best at: catching and tarpitting your best units for the entire game.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/04/08 13:48:57
Drasius wrote: Wraiths are T5, Str8 isn't going to help. it takes ~81 bolter shots to drop 3 wraiths WITHOUT reanimation or ~44 BS3 str8 shots. That's 5 turns of a hades forgefiend firing every turn and only just dropping the last 1 when you're starting to roll to see if the game ends while costing 175 vs the 129 of 3 wraiths with whip coils (because they always have whip coils).
Restating for emphasis:
STOP TRYING TO SHOOT WRAITHS Especially Harvest Wraiths.
It's just wasted shots.
Don't be too concerned about trying to kill them in combat, too. Your goal should be tying them up with something fast. Otherwise they'll do what they're best at: catching and tarpitting your best units for the entire game.
I know, I was pointing out how pointless it was to the person I quoted who seemed to think that hitting them with str8 was going to matter and suggested forgefiends and decimators were a good idea.
Peregrine wrote: What, you don't like rolling dice to see how many dice you roll? Why are you such an anti-dice bigot?
Drasius wrote: Wraiths are T5, Str8 isn't going to help. it takes ~81 bolter shots to drop 3 wraiths WITHOUT reanimation or ~44 BS3 str8 shots. That's 5 turns of a hades forgefiend firing every turn and only just dropping the last 1 when you're starting to roll to see if the game ends while costing 175 vs the 129 of 3 wraiths with whip coils (because they always have whip coils).
Restating for emphasis:
STOP TRYING TO SHOOT WRAITHS Especially Harvest Wraiths.
It's just wasted shots.
Don't be too concerned about trying to kill them in combat, too. Your goal should be tying them up with something fast. Otherwise they'll do what they're best at: catching and tarpitting your best units for the entire game.
I know, I was pointing out how pointless it was to the person I quoted who seemed to think that hitting them with str8 was going to matter and suggested forgefiends and decimators were a good idea.
I know, I was restating for further emphasis because it seems like a lot of people just cannot grasp why it's a bad idea.
12,000 
