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**++ The Age of Darkness (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List) [1998pts] ++**

**+ HQ +**

**Legion Praetor [165pts]:** Artificer Armour, Iron Halo, Mastercraft a Single Weapon, Paragon Blade



**Priest of Fenris [125pts]:** Speaker of the Dead
**Additional Wargear:** Artificer Armour, Melta Bombs, Volkite Serpenta


**+ Elites +**

**Contemptor-Mortis Dreadnought [180pts]:** Kheres Pattern Assault Cannons x 2


**+ Troops +**

**Grey Slayer Pack [266pts]:** 15x Grey Slayers
· **Additional Wargear:** 13x Bolter, Legion Vexilla, 2x Power Fist **Huscarl:** Artificer Armour, Great Frost Blade


**Grey Slayer Pack [266pts]:** 15x Grey Slayers
· **Additional Wargear:** 13x Bolter, Legion Vexilla, 2x Power Fist·· **Huscarl:** Artificer Armour, Great Frost Blade

**Grey Slayer Pack [266pts]:** 15x Grey Slayers
·· **Additional Wargear:** 13x Bolter, Legion Vexilla, 2x Power Fist· **Huscarl:** Artificer Armour, Great Frost Blade


**+ Heavy Support +**

**Leviathan Siege Dreadnought Talon [310pts]**
**Leviathan Siege Dreadnought:** Armoured Ceramite, Cyclonic Melta Lance, Heavy Flamer, Heavy Flamer, Leviathan Siege Claw


**Sicaran Venator Tank Destroyer [210pts]:** Armoured Ceramite


**Sicaran Venator Tank Destroyer [210pts]:** Armoured Ceramite


**+ Legion +**
**Legiones Astartes:** VI: Space Wolves, Loyalist

**Rite of War:** The Bloodied Claws
**++ Total: [1998pts] ++**


Thoughts? I like the idea of this, troops move up with the leviathan, and they are supported by the dread and sicarans

Honestly a fee things.

You are short an hq as a command squad does not count as an hq choice.

Your apothecaries are way expensive and also make reporting grey slayers really bad. Apothecaries prevent them from running and charging or shooting and charging (though you can get around shoot and charge) but that's a really important mechanic for them as you'll probably be running them all game if playing on a 4×6 to try get them across the board.

Your grey slayer equipment is illegal they cannot take a power fist and a bolter it's only 1 weapon option outside of the sergeant. But honestly you should avoid bolters if foot slogging it you just won't get to use them better off grabbing 2-3 power weapons.

Your praetor and command squad are going to die on turn 1 to a single vindicator or medusa shot. They are very expensive and very squishy 1 model has an invulnerable save their loadout is also kind of useless just take power aces and shields don't bother with guns or you might as well have taken veterans.

All shoot leviathans waste a lot of their potential they are really good in combat as a suooty platform there are better things it's best to give it 1 gun and either claw or drill. Also of all places you could put vokjite this is one of the good platforms unlike a command squaf. As well if you want a second gun take the points give it phosphex launchers those are good.

Contemptors Morris yeah it's decent but as your only anti tank unit it's just not going to cut it. I'd you've got more anti tank I'd say keep it.

I'll correct the bolters on the Grey Slayers. And I didn't make the connection about the apothecarys stopping the Grey slayers from run/charging. I'm glad it was caught here. About the leviathan having two weapons, I understand they are short range, but unless I'm mistaken the damage output of those two weapons paired seem great on paper. I totally agree with the command squad comment, like I said its just filler,

I might have miss read the rules but its a required HQ for ever 1000 points, so because I didn't hit 2000, I don't need a second HQ.

 kinratha wrote:
I'll correct the bolters on the Grey Slayers. And I didn't make the connection about the apothecarys stopping the Grey slayers from run/charging. I'm glad it was caught here. About the leviathan having two weapons, I understand they are short range, but unless I'm mistaken the damage output of those two weapons paired seem great on paper. I totally agree with the command squad comment, like I said its just filler,

I might have miss read the rules but its a required HQ for ever 1000 points, so because I didn't hit 2000, I don't need a second HQ.

It's required 1 / 1000 for hq so for 0-1000 youd need one but at 1001 youd need to take a second.

The weapons look great points wise when you see the cost per a weapon the problem is it needs to factor in the 300+ point leviathan cost. To really get use of its special rules as well such as hammer of wrath and bonus initiative close combat is almost a must. The current go to loadout is normally melta lance a drill (destroys any vehicle including knights on the charge and the lance is essentially a 3 shot ap1 lascannon even without melta)

Ok, I see what you're saying. I'll be editing my list to fix the problems

Praetor- I'd go with Great Frost Blade (built in master-crafted, but two handed, not a big deal, you can buy Digital Weapons). Artificer Armor, Iron Halo, Digital Lasers, and an Archaeotech pistol. 185 total points.

Contemptor is a solid choice, and even better if your opponent has flyers.

The Vet's just don't fit with the rest of your list. Deathsworn Pack would be better here, but actually, the best thing would be another Grey Slayer pack so you can have more scoring units (only Infantry Troops are scoring in 30K). Plus, seven models foot slogging across the table with a 3+... yeah, they probably won't make it very far.

I like the Grey Slayers!

The Leviathan Siege- You gave it dual Heavy Flamers, but two shooting weapons? You'd probably be better served with a claw and the Storm Cannon.

Overall, you are a bit light on anti-armor. Every list I make, I ask myself four questions: Can I destroy a Spartan in one round of shooting? How will I deal with a Primarch? Do I have three or more objective scoring units? How will I deal with flyers? You just need to answer the questions honestly. "I can't destroy a Spartan in one round of shooting, but I can blow it up in close combat." or "I have a Mortis Contemptor for flyers". At lower points values, the Spartan and Primarch are not such a big issue- but you could face a tooled up Praetor, or a Sicararian Battle Tank. Something to consider. Also, your meta. If no one plays with flyers, then you don't really need anti-aircraft. If no one uses a Spartan, etc. etc.

Good luck!

 Tamwulf wrote:
Praetor- I'd go with Great Frost Blade (built in master-crafted, but two handed, not a big deal, you can buy Digital Weapons). Artificer Armor, Iron Halo, Digital Lasers, and an Archaeotech pistol. 185 total points.

Contemptor is a solid choice, and even better if your opponent has flyers.

The Vet's just don't fit with the rest of your list. Deathsworn Pack would be better here, but actually, the best thing would be another Grey Slayer pack so you can have more scoring units (only Infantry Troops are scoring in 30K). Plus, seven models foot slogging across the table with a 3+... yeah, they probably won't make it very far.

I like the Grey Slayers!

The Leviathan Siege- You gave it dual Heavy Flamers, but two shooting weapons? You'd probably be better served with a claw and the Storm Cannon.

Overall, you are a bit light on anti-armor. Every list I make, I ask myself four questions: Can I destroy a Spartan in one round of shooting? How will I deal with a Primarch? Do I have three or more objective scoring units? How will I deal with flyers? You just need to answer the questions honestly. "I can't destroy a Spartan in one round of shooting, but I can blow it up in close combat." or "I have a Mortis Contemptor for flyers". At lower points values, the Spartan and Primarch are not such a big issue- but you could face a tooled up Praetor, or a Sicararian Battle Tank. Something to consider. Also, your meta. If no one plays with flyers, then you don't really need anti-aircraft. If no one uses a Spartan, etc. etc.

Good luck!

Your last blurb I'd agree with but if disagree on some of the other things.

A gfb is good awful compared to a paragon blade. In a challenge you can't gain the +1a but now you've most initiative so you could see yourself dead fast and you lost murderous strike. You are still very much better with a paragon blade on a praetor now when you can't get one a gfb is a good choice on other models. In terms of archeotech pistol they are ludicrously expensive and for what 1 s6 ap3 shot there is a reason no one takes them they kind of just suck. I'd say take as follows if non terminator (iron halo paragon blade melta bomb - if no one else in his unit has one, power fist) a power fist is straight better than digital lasers still grants +1a costs the same and is way more flexible this also keeps him cheap praetor die all the time can't spend to much there.

Your point about troops is wrong here in unafraid veterans do intact score as does any unit with implacable advance not just infantry troops. So terminators seekers and veterans all score and so do bikes row dependent. Now is that veteran squad loadout good no it's pretty useless but they would still score. I would highly recommend trying to focus less on just adding volkite and take either more bodies transports and just better upgrades. Volkite isn't really much better than the boltgun equivalent but you land up spending the cost of a rhino for slightly stronger pistol shots isn't really worth it.

I'd disagree on storm cannon claw that loadout is for killing rhinos which really doesn't agree with your next paragraph he needs a good way to stop a Spartan venator independent so is still recommend drill and melta (s9 ap1 can hurt through flare shields even and if you get side armour you can do just as much damage as a lascannons support squad and then still charge)

 Tamwulf wrote:
Praetor- I'd go with Great Frost Blade (built in master-crafted, but two handed, not a big deal, you can buy Digital Weapons). Artificer Armor, Iron Halo, Digital Lasers, and an Archaeotech pistol. 185 total points.

Contemptor is a solid choice, and even better if your opponent has flyers.

The Vet's just don't fit with the rest of your list. Deathsworn Pack would be better here, but actually, the best thing would be another Grey Slayer pack so you can have more scoring units (only Infantry Troops are scoring in 30K). Plus, seven models foot slogging across the table with a 3+... yeah, they probably won't make it very far.

I like the Grey Slayers!

The Leviathan Siege- You gave it dual Heavy Flamers, but two shooting weapons? You'd probably be better served with a claw and the Storm Cannon.

Overall, you are a bit light on anti-armor. Every list I make, I ask myself four questions: Can I destroy a Spartan in one round of shooting? How will I deal with a Primarch? Do I have three or more objective scoring units? How will I deal with flyers? You just need to answer the questions honestly. "I can't destroy a Spartan in one round of shooting, but I can blow it up in close combat." or "I have a Mortis Contemptor for flyers". At lower points values, the Spartan and Primarch are not such a big issue- but you could face a tooled up Praetor, or a Sicararian Battle Tank. Something to consider. Also, your meta. If no one plays with flyers, then you don't really need anti-aircraft. If no one uses a Spartan, etc. etc.

Good luck!

The vets ride in the Land raider with the HQs. They roll up and provide support where ever its needed.

Titanicus wrote:


Your last blurb I'd agree with but if disagree on some of the other things.

A gfb is good awful compared to a paragon blade. In a challenge you can't gain the +1a but now you've most initiative so you could see yourself dead fast and you lost murderous strike. You are still very much better with a paragon blade on a praetor now when you can't get one a gfb is a good choice on other models. In terms of archeotech pistol they are ludicrously expensive and for what 1 s6 ap3 shot there is a reason no one takes them they kind of just suck. I'd say take as follows if non terminator (iron halo paragon blade melta bomb - if no one else in his unit has one, power fist) a power fist is straight better than digital lasers still grants +1a costs the same and is way more flexible this also keeps him cheap praetor die all the time can't spend to much there.

Your point about troops is wrong here in unafraid veterans do intact score as does any unit with implacable advance not just infantry troops. So terminators seekers and veterans all score and so do bikes row dependent. Now is that veteran squad loadout good no it's pretty useless but they would still score. I would highly recommend trying to focus less on just adding volkite and take either more bodies transports and just better upgrades. Volkite isn't really much better than the boltgun equivalent but you land up spending the cost of a rhino for slightly stronger pistol shots isn't really worth it.

I'd disagree on storm cannon claw that loadout is for killing rhinos which really doesn't agree with your next paragraph he needs a good way to stop a Spartan venator independent so is still recommend drill and melta (s9 ap1 can hurt through flare shields even and if you get side armour you can do just as much damage as a lascannons support squad and then still charge)

It would seem we play two very different games here my friend.

The more I wrote, the more I realized I was telling you how to play this game, and that's something I never want to do. The only thing I'll say is I can't believe I've never noticed that Veterans had Implacable Advance. /shrug guess I was screwing myself out of a scoring unit for a while now. Then again, I don't use them. Might have to take another look at them.

To the OP: The Proteus has 3 TL Lascannons, which is the bulk of your anti-armor. Do you really want it to "Roll Up" and have your guys with range 12" pistols of S5 jump out to shoot? I mean, if that actually works for you, great. For me, I'd see a juicy, non-melee unit standing next to a Land Raider less then 12" away. Can you say Multi-charge? 'Cuz Sergeants have either Meltabombs or P-Fists, both of which can take out that Land Raider. This tactic could work if your Veteran Squad was tooled up for close combat or you are picking on an already depleted/almost destroyed unit. At which time I'd say Meltaguns or Plasma guns would be better, but then I'd ask why not just make them into a Support Squad? Basically, you are not playing to the strengths of the Veteran squad (multi-role adaptability) and pigeon holing them into one specific role that other, cheaper squads could easily do. Again, if this works for you in your meta, then great!

To the OP: The Proteus has 3 TL Lascannons, which is the bulk of your anti-armor. Do you really want it to "Roll Up" and have your guys with range 12" pistols of S5 jump out to shoot? I mean, if that actually works for you, great. For me, I'd see a juicy, non-melee unit standing next to a Land Raider less then 12" away. Can you say Multi-charge? 'Cuz Sergeants have either Meltabombs or P-Fists, both of which can take out that Land Raider. This tactic could work if your Veteran Squad was tooled up for close combat or you are picking on an already depleted/almost destroyed unit. At which time I'd say Meltaguns or Plasma guns would be better, but then I'd ask why not just make them into a Support Squad? Basically, you are not playing to the strengths of the Veteran squad (multi-role adaptability) and pigeon holing them into one specific role that other, cheaper squads could easily do. Again, if this works for you in your meta, then great!

I will probobly go with the Melts lance. Giving me some close AT. My idea/tactics behind this list, depending on the game, will be to let each unit support each other as the move up the field. Target priority is obviously a must. I'm honestly debating on if I should replace the Leviathan with a Deredero and use that as an AT platform. To me it looks way more effective in its roll, I just like the leviathan model more.

My plan with the vets isn't going to be "drive to a deathstar and jump out and shoot it" I'm going to use it as a stop gap in my lines. Both HQs will sit with the vets inside the land raider, they will roll up to and support a side that is taking heavy casualties. honestly the Vet are a filler unit because I can't find a good unit to put my HQs in.