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In the lore, people who are psykers generally become better (more powerful) psykers when they become astartes. Does the same happen to nulls?
More over, would nulls even be allowed to be astartes or would they be scooped up by the Assassinorum mucky mucks before they could be recruited by the astartes?

I have seen no lore examples of this, and i am not a huge space marine fan so if there were an example, it is unlikely i would come across it.

I know I have never seen any fluff for Null spezmarines

Forgeworld fluff directly stated in inferno that nondpace marine or Custodian had ever been a null, if I remember right.

Though I don't have sources, I'm sure I've read that only one in every million men could successfully become a Space Marine, while only one in a billion humans carry the Pariah gene.

If that's the case, the current day Earth could produce 3500 Space Marines (as only men are suitable) yet only 7 Blanks. As half are women, only 3.5 could even be considered for Space Marine recruitment. Bear in mind also that the 3500 number is successful Marines, while the 7 Blanks are just carriers with no guarantee of combat ability or even loyalty - they'd also need to pass the 1:1,000,000 test, meaning if only 1 man in 2 billion humans carries the Pariah gene, you'd need a sample size of 2 billion x 1 million, which equals 2 quintillion humans.

This is roughly the estimate I've read of the population of the entire Imperium, meaning if so, only once in a generation would one such person appear in the entire galaxy. And you'd need to find them before the age of puberty so the implants took, and be willing to risk sacrificing the lives of other unsuitable Blanks during the harsh training to become a Marine in order to weed out the successful one. Also, as most Psykers only manifest their talents around the age of puberty, this window would be even smaller.

So no, it is incredibly unlikely such an individual would exist, and it would be virtually imposible to find them anyway. Even then, a Blank is way more valuable to the Imperium than a Space Marine and the chance of combining the two would be a colossal waste of resources for relatively little benefit considering they have different roles in battle, so they'd make much better use of their skills as an Assassin, and have less chance of being randomly blown up in a Drop Pod fighting in some backwater campaign, and having all that effort wasted.

Horus Heresy: Inferno by Forgeworld directly states that during the early implantation processes and the creation of the space marines, they tried turning Nulls/Pariahs into Astartes but every single attempt failed. Eventually that experiment was abandoned and never attempted again, maybe even outright forbidden (Not so sure on the last part, would have to take a closer look again).

 The Observer wrote:
Horus Heresy: Inferno by Forgeworld directly states that during the early implantation processes and the creation of the space marines, they tried turning Nulls/Pariahs into Astartes but every single attempt failed. Eventually that experiment was abandoned and never attempted again, maybe even outright forbidden (Not so sure on the last part, would have to take a closer look again).

I guess I should revise my statement above, that the 1:1,000,000 number wasn't for the physical creation of a Marine, but the successful training too. I guess you could just put the implants in someone and make them posthuman, and not have them pass the training and indoctrination, but then the'd arguably not be a Space Marine - just a really strong Blank.

So the 1 in 2 quintillion number was just for someone to be a successful recruit. To just test the implants (as above) there'd be a ready supply of Blanks. Literally a million more.

The Imperium already trains regular human nulls and gives them genetic therapy and implants to turn them into superhuman warriors. They're called culexus assassins, and the amount of technology and genetic manipulation at work in them puts a space marine to shame.

Putting them in power armor and sending them charging at the enemy guns blazing with marine tactics would be a waste of their talents. They're difficult to focus on, can slip by mechanical and human sentries, and destroy the most dangerous of threats to a world just fine with the weapons they're trained with.

Hierophant wrote:
Though I don't have sources, I'm sure I've read that only one in every million men could successfully become a Space Marine, while only one in a billion humans carry the Pariah gene.

If that's the case, the current day Earth could produce 3500 Space Marines (as only men are suitable) yet only 7 Blanks. As half are women, only 3.5 could even be considered for Space Marine recruitment. Bear in mind also that the 3500 number is successful Marines, while the 7 Blanks are just carriers with no guarantee of combat ability or even loyalty - they'd also need to pass the 1:1,000,000 test, meaning if only 1 man in 2 billion humans carries the Pariah gene, you'd need a sample size of 2 billion x 1 billion, which equals 2 quintillion humans.

This is roughly the estimate I've read of the population of the entire Imperium, meaning if so, only once in a generation would one such person appear in the entire galaxy. And you'd need to find them before the age of puberty so the implants took, and be willing to risk sacrificing the lives of other unsuitable Blanks during the harsh training to become a Marine in order to weed out the successful one. Also, as most Psykers only manifest their talents around the age of puberty, this window would be even smaller.

So no, it is incredibly unlikely such an individual would exist, and it would be virtually imposible to find them anyway. Even then, a Blank is way more valuable to the Imperium than a Space Marine and the chance of combining the two would be a colossal waste of resources for relatively little benefit considering they have different roles in battle, so they'd make much better use of their skills as an Assassin, and have less chance of being randomly blown up in a Drop Pod fighting in some backwater campaign, and having all that effort wasted.

these figures also explain what makes marines recruiting worlds so important, a world that somehow, by dint of enviroment, training factors etc producing eneugh canidates to be a viable recruiting world are proably noted as exceptional fast.

Yeah, it always struck me as odd when you'd hear about a chapter almost being annihilated, and it being a couple of centuries before they were back up to strength, despite only needing 900 or so recruits. But when you realise you'd need a population of 2 billion to create a chapter from scratch in 20 years, if your recruiting world is a death world with only a population of 200 million, this could take some time.

Even when accounting for the harsh conditions likely making tha ratio of successful candidates more favorable from such a world, you're still losing Marines in combat too over that period.

Blanks are far, far too rare to risk/waste turning into astartes. Blanks are to psykers what psykers are to normal humans in terms of rarity. Tiny tiny grains of diamond in an astronomically long pig trough.

I've never heard of nulls being made into space marines but I have heard of space marines (or those on their way to becoming space marines) becoming quasi-nullish... The Exorcists, who have daemons exorcised out of them which - apparently - significantly reduces their warp presence and renders them effectively invisible to a lot of daemons.

Blanks are too rare to risk.

There are some things rare inside of the trillions of humans who populate the galaxy. They are one of those class. For perspective, there may be more inquisitors than blanks out there.

Psykers. There's tons in comparison to a blank as there aura makes them outcasts, some are killed before impirum finds them. They just feel wrong to a normal person, a monster to a psyker. A black void of nothing.

A blank is rare. A powerful blank. Priceless, too valuable to risk losing in marine training.

And as for who. Inquisition and assassins would definitely want them. They have great value to either organisation.

 jhe90 wrote:
Blanks are too rare to risk.

There are some things rare inside of the trillions of humans who populate the galaxy. They are one of those class. For perspective, there may be more inquisitors than blanks out there.

Psykers. There's tons in comparison to a blank as there aura makes them outcasts, some are killed before impirum finds them. They just feel wrong to a normal person, a monster to a psyker. A black void of nothing.

A blank is rare. A powerful blank. Priceless, too valuable to risk losing in marine training.

And as for who. Inquisition and assassins would definitely want them. They have great value to either organisation.

I don't think Null rarity preclude them from Space Marine training, working and training for the Inquisition, as an Assassin is at least as dangerous. Sister of Silence were numerous enough to form an entire armed forces capable of taking to the battlefield. I don't think there is more null women than men, thus its very possible in my opinion for a few null to becomee Space Marine. The only problem is that other Marines would hate and mistrust them because its one of the side effect of being a null.

The closest we get to a possible Pariah Space Marine is in Aaron Dembski-Bowdens Grey Knights novel The Emperor's Gift. As I recall the character is not described as a Space Marine outright but he was a null working for the Grey Knights and was a bit more than just human.

 Gogsnik wrote:
As I recall the character is not described as a Space Marine outright but he was a null working for the Grey Knights and was a bit more than just human.

Could be enhanced cybernetically. What does a null do for the Grey Knights other than cause them pain?

SomeRandomEvilGuy wrote:

 Gogsnik wrote:
As I recall the character is not described as a Space Marine outright but he was a null working for the Grey Knights and was a bit more than just human.

Could be enhanced cybernetically. What does a null do for the Grey Knights other than cause them pain?

Elisihorn can seem to work with the female blank but not touch her.
So I guess he got used to the feeling of wrongness she eminated.

He was a psyker and less warded than than the grey knights who anti chaos layers, and psi circuit's may provide some kind of buffer or maybe reduce the effect as armour is so specialised.

eaither way there is no mention of a psykic blank in "the emperor's gift"

There probably are a few "blanks" who got swept up in Marine recruitment drives. They probably all wash out during training, even if they're never diagnosed as blanks.

BrianDavion wrote:
eaither way there is no mention of a psykic blank in "the emperor's gift"

Really?

"Traditional words filtered back into my mind, recalled through the discomfort of standing before the soulless figure."
Page 145-146

"The Inquisition made use of psychic nulls... ...Outwardly, he was one of us - his bulky physique was unarguably the result of Adeptus Astartes genetic enhancement..."
Page 146

"My revulsion got the better of me. 'What are you?' I asked."
Page 146

"'Who are you?' / The Ferryman turned... ...I knew that was a lie born of my deprived psychic sense... ...'I am Phlegyras of Titan,' he said calmly."
Page 147

"'Who are you?' I asked again, feeling my voice growl through my teeth. 'You were one of us once, weren't you?'"
Page 147

I was mistaken in my recollection, not only is the Ferryman, Phlegyras, a null, he is also a space marine.