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You are a direct grandson of the Emperor.

From his own flesh the Emperor created the primarchs to act as his generals, each a faucet of his own being. Demigods made after the vision of a Deity incarnate.
When the primarchs were cast across the universe their gene seeds were used to create soldiers based after their own particular faucet of warfare. The direct decedents of these Gods were imbued with their strength and will to act as their soldiers when called upon.

From the toughest environments the new legions were molded. Worlds where very existence is an everyday battle don`t have slow, weak or stupid inhabitants, their ancestors were killed off generations ago. You were pulled from such a world. Chosen because you were the fastest, strongest and had the greatest will to live. You were selected and then had your humanity stripped away. Any friends or family you might had had were to be forgotten as your old self died and your new self was reborn. Your DNA was altered and made you less human each day, turning you into something greater. Extra organs, implants, physical and mental conditioning raised you as far above humans as the primarchs were above you. One day you would see your primarch, the being who gave you your powers, and you would see that you yourself was imbued with the divine.

Through the crusade that brought humanity together you fought across worlds, inch by bloody inch. Traitors and xenos all fell to bolter and sword in your unending war of reconquest. Through valor and blood and brotherhood you were able to guide or capture world upon world back into the Imperial fold. With each new world that entered the Imperium new ideas, systems of government and technology were added to the lexicon that already existed. New patterns of weapons, medical practices and new ways to wage war were rediscovered, invented and practiced with each new contact. At this forefront your bore the heaviest fighting. The artists trailed after you like baby chickens taking pictures of your exploits, your deeds, sending them across the Imperium. Common people saw your actions across a thousand worlds and their hope buoyed you as just as much as the knowledge that you were doing just work.

Then came The Great Betrayal.

You now turned your awesome weaponry and grizzly, sanguine talents to bear upon your brother. This was not only a test of muscle and sinew but of spirit and of faith. Through the ensuing maelstrom you kept firm in resolve and survived to see your beloved legions broken. What was once a mirror of a single primarch were now a shattered visage of what they once were. Through this shattering you held your head high and continued to fight where needed, you are humanity's greatest hope. Just as new chapters were formed and old ones lost or destroyed you continued your eternal vigilant gaze upon the stars knowing that annihilation could come from any point. You are not just warriors but a symbol. The common people call you the Emperor`s Angels. You are worshiped on worlds and seen as divine agents. You act as agents of your grandsire and sires.

For ten thousand years you have been the shield that has broken the onslaught of uncountable foes.

For ten thousands years you have lost uncountable brothers to twisted and nefarious xenos and the corruption of chaos.

For ten thousand years you have been the veneer covering of what could be called civilization in the galaxy.

For ten thousand years you have asked for nothing knowing that you are direct descendant of Gods and if you cannot succeed than all hope is lost.

Here, in what seems to be the darkest of times a glimmer of hope has been seen. One of the original primarchs Roboute Guilliman has awoken. He will surely lead his host to victory against the insurmountable odds that are stacked against you.

One of the original now sweeps their gaze across you and your brothers. Your history. Your sacrifices and your deeds.

He finds you wanting.

He said that he knew from the beginning that a time would come that you would not be capable anymore. He new at some point in the future you would fail. He foresaw this and created Primarius Marines, a further advancement upon yourself. It then dawns upon you. Your history, deeds, brothers and history have all been a stop gap. You were temporary. Just like the Thunder Warriors of legend you were designed to be a step until the next plan could be enacted. The Primarius marines are given to some chapters and form chapters of their own. Some chapters accept their new Brothers with open arms but others shun them not liking the idea that they represent.

You are a direct grandson of the Emperor.

But you are his chosen children no more. There is a new favorite child in the family.



I wanted to write a little bit up (my grammar and editing is awful) about what some of the Space Marines might feel about the primarius marines. I am in love with the idea that even the indefatigable and super human space marines are not seen as being the best and brightest anymore. I like how just when you think things can`t get more grimdark they do. I love the fact that the primarius marines have come in and knocked the marines down a bit of a peg.

Let me know what you guys think!

Are you sure it's not because they are severely undercosted?

Honestly with all the gak they have been through and they are getting thrown out like old toys I have to say I would be pissed. These are living breathing people. Not robots.

This only highlights one thing. The Imperium is now an even worse horrifying place when even your heroes will get replaced without a one whit to their thoughts or personality or opinions. If I was a Space Marine I would leave the Imperium forever. Gulliman doesn't even like anything you are anymore or your faith. The funny thing is though that the Greater Good would actually offer all of these individuals a place of honour it would even respect their faith (if they have any left). Sure it might not be as glamorous as working under the Imperium itself, but the Tau don't toss aside their own kind so callously and everyone has their place even when the most new thing comes out.

If they ever do a Gue'vesa auxiliary faction I would be genuinely interested to see old marines models in it. When the Primaris marines are tossed aside in the future they will be welcomed with open arms too. Granted I doubt GW will ever do this since they want to sell everyone the new shiny.

Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”

Lol, just read a comment - "hentai matines"

Apocritas wrote:
You are a direct grandson of the Emperor.

Spoiler:

From his own flesh the Emperor created the primarchs to act as his generals, each a faucet of his own being. Demigods made after the vision of a Deity incarnate.
When the primarchs were cast across the universe their gene seeds were used to create soldiers based after their own particular faucet of warfare. The direct decedents of these Gods were imbued with their strength and will to act as their soldiers when called upon.

From the toughest environments the new legions were molded. Worlds where very existence is an everyday battle don`t have slow, weak or stupid inhabitants, their ancestors were killed off generations ago. You were pulled from such a world. Chosen because you were the fastest, strongest and had the greatest will to live. You were selected and then had your humanity stripped away. Any friends or family you might had had were to be forgotten as your old self died and your new self was reborn. Your DNA was altered and made you less human each day, turning you into something greater. Extra organs, implants, physical and mental conditioning raised you as far above humans as the primarchs were above you. One day you would see your primarch, the being who gave you your powers, and you would see that you yourself was imbued with the divine.

Through the crusade that brought humanity together you fought across worlds, inch by bloody inch. Traitors and xenos all fell to bolter and sword in your unending war of reconquest. Through valor and blood and brotherhood you were able to guide or capture world upon world back into the Imperial fold. With each new world that entered the Imperium new ideas, systems of government and technology were added to the lexicon that already existed. New patterns of weapons, medical practices and new ways to wage war were rediscovered, invented and practiced with each new contact. At this forefront your bore the heaviest fighting. The artists trailed after you like baby chickens taking pictures of your exploits, your deeds, sending them across the Imperium. Common people saw your actions across a thousand worlds and their hope buoyed you as just as much as the knowledge that you were doing just work.

Then came The Great Betrayal.

You now turned your awesome weaponry and grizzly, sanguine talents to bear upon your brother. This was not only a test of muscle and sinew but of spirit and of faith. Through the ensuing maelstrom you kept firm in resolve and survived to see your beloved legions broken. What was once a mirror of a single primarch were now a shattered visage of what they once were. Through this shattering you held your head high and continued to fight where needed, you are humanity's greatest hope. Just as new chapters were formed and old ones lost or destroyed you continued your eternal vigilant gaze upon the stars knowing that annihilation could come from any point. You are not just warriors but a symbol. The common people call you the Emperor`s Angels. You are worshiped on worlds and seen as divine agents. You act as agents of your grandsire and sires.

For ten thousand years you have been the shield that has broken the onslaught of uncountable foes.

For ten thousands years you have lost uncountable brothers to twisted and nefarious xenos and the corruption of chaos.

For ten thousand years you have been the veneer covering of what could be called civilization in the galaxy.

For ten thousand years you have asked for nothing knowing that you are direct descendant of Gods and if you cannot succeed than all hope is lost.

Here, in what seems to be the darkest of times a glimmer of hope has been seen. One of the original primarchs Roboute Guilliman has awoken. He will surely lead his host to victory against the insurmountable odds that are stacked against you.

One of the original now sweeps their gaze across you and your brothers. Your history. Your sacrifices and your deeds.

He finds you wanting.

He said that he knew from the beginning that a time would come that you would not be capable anymore. He new at some point in the future you would fail. He foresaw this and created Primarius Marines, a further advancement upon yourself. It then dawns upon you. Your history, deeds, brothers and history have all been a stop gap. You were temporary. Just like the Thunder Warriors of legend you were designed to be a step until the next plan could be enacted. The Primarius marines are given to some chapters and form chapters of their own. Some chapters accept their new Brothers with open arms but others shun them not liking the idea that they represent.

You are a direct grandson of the Emperor.

But you are his chosen children no more. There is a new favorite child in the family.



I wanted to write a little bit up (my grammar and editing is awful) about what some of the Space Marines might feel about the primarius marines. I am in love with the idea that even the indefatigable and super human space marines are not seen as being the best and brightest anymore. I like how just when you think things can`t get more grimdark they do. I love the fact that the primarius marines have come in and knocked the marines down a bit of a peg.

Let me know what you guys think!

Strong first post.
Indeed.

Apocritas wrote:

. . .
But you are his chosen children no more. There is a new favorite child in the family.

And they shall not fit through doors!

 Caveman wrote:
Are you sure it's not because they are severely undercosted?

LOL that's the first I've seen this.

New account.

Massive fluff post about how hot the new gw hotness is.

 Caveman wrote:
Are you sure it's not because they are severely undercosted?

Inceptors and aggressors are too expensive.
Intercessors and hellblasters feel about right (hellblasters cost as much as 4 las dev sqad--that's 5 wound potential vs 24 wound potential. TO get to 10 wounds the hellblasters have to risk death--and shorter range).
HQ are probably about right
Dread is a little too expensive, as is repulsor.

After reading the excellent Night Lords Trilogy, I came to the theory that Space Marines are perpetual emotional adolescents. Perhaps they reach late-adolescence or early adulthood before they're turned into marines, but they don't have normal human experience after that. They have none of the same reasons to change, grow, and develop. Not the least of which is sex.

Now, what happens if you're born in a vat?

If I were GW, I would write NuMarines as very dangerous and unstable children.

Containment_Failure wrote:

Now, what happens if you're born in a vat?

But they aren't.

Pancakey wrote:
New account.

Massive fluff post about how hot the new gw hotness is.

"Good, bad, it doesn't matter. I have tanks, lots and lots of tanks."
-IG tank commander Bob.

"Thinking of a new career? Boss not appreciating everything you've done for the company? Tired of being ripped off by The Man? Call us."
-Black Legion pamphlet

 Crimson wrote:

Containment_Failure wrote:

Now, what happens if you're born in a vat?

But they aren't.

Yup, the majority of these guys were actual marines left over from the legions before the 2nd founding. The fluff in the codex states that most of them remember seeing their primarchs alive and were witnesses to some battles from the end of the heresy and the scouring. Cawl put them all on ice until he had the go ahead, which is why he spent the rest of the time making fancy weapons and armor for them. It appears the program is capable of upgrading current marines as well, so there is much to be seen in the future. I had fun building mine because I swapped a lot of heads and shoulder pads so that they could get some precious chapter relics mixed into the new armor.

The situation somewhat reminds me of the movie Soldier. New model (of warrior) comes out and the old ones are tossed upon the garbage heap.

"We were to be the Emperor's Sword and Shield.

For ten thousand years, we served Him

We fought for Him, even against our own brothers

We died for Him

In the end, He found us wanting

He gave birth to new children to defend His empire.

We stood beside the Emperor and did not betray him.

But He has betrayed us.

Now we are the outcast, the unwanted, the inhuman, the failed experiment

Have strength brothers - we will avenge this wrong done to us

We will guard humanity, even if it means taking down our Father to do so

Mind if I steal that quote for my own purposes, Stormonu?

Go right ahead

Sigh, even if NuMarines were to replace Real Marines, that is no reason for them to turn their backs to the Imperium. They are better than that.

Still, I like Adeptus Custodes better if we're talking about superior super soldiers and GrimDark (tm). The Emperor handcrafted the genetic modifications for each and every one of them. They wear golden armor and fight with the best power weapons the Imperium has to offer. They are legendary and mythical heroes from the dawn of the Imperium and they are all, more or less, still fighting for the Imperium in the present day. And these guys are used mainly for guard duty.

RedCommander wrote:
Sigh, even if NuMarines were to replace Real Marines, that is no reason for them to turn their backs to the Imperium. They are better than that.

Still, I like Adeptus Custodes better if we're talking about superior super soldiers and GrimDark (tm). The Emperor handcrafted the genetic modifications for each and every one of them. They wear golden armor and fight with the best power weapons the Imperium has to offer. They are legendary and mythical heroes from the dawn of the Imperium and they are all, more or less, still fighting for the Imperium in the present day. And these guys are used mainly for guard duty.

that's because they are hangar queen pretty boy's next to the mailed fist that is the Guard.

 Frazzled wrote:

RedCommander wrote:
Sigh, even if NuMarines were to replace Real Marines, that is no reason for them to turn their backs to the Imperium. They are better than that.

Still, I like Adeptus Custodes better if we're talking about superior super soldiers and GrimDark (tm). The Emperor handcrafted the genetic modifications for each and every one of them. They wear golden armor and fight with the best power weapons the Imperium has to offer. They are legendary and mythical heroes from the dawn of the Imperium and they are all, more or less, still fighting for the Imperium in the present day. And these guys are used mainly for guard duty.

that's because they are hangar queen pretty boy's next to the mailed fist that is the Guard.

Bing is rank in the imprium.
They have the finest bling. There also the original ones to carry, and still do far as I recall have word is law status.

 Gamgee wrote:
If they ever do a Gue'vesa auxiliary faction I would be genuinely interested to see old marines models in it. When the Primaris marines are tossed aside in the future they will be welcomed with open arms too.

Spoiler:

Holy moly that would be an awesome thing to see on the table A gue'vesa force with a squad of disillusioned marines at the head. Oh my...

I think my issue with the Primaris is they were badly thought out. Between them and Rowboat, NuEmperor and Totally Saviour of Mankind and Hot Eldar, they have the taint of Matt Ward's writing.

The simple truth is, the new models would have worked equally well as a new, upgraded set of Power Armour. New models and makes in the face of a Galaxy that no longer has the power of Chaos that Rowboat had his pet Magos working (along with many others, in the event of other changes).

No one would have especially objected, I suspect. Even the Adeptus Mechanicus will likely bow to the will of a Primarch when he points out the whole 'You're sitting next to Chaos' biggest target and Aabbadon is heading this way' issue. Or simply have them based on STC facilities. It's not hard.

But instead, you make them NuMarines. To show they are the NuHotness (Did Rowboat demand the look like Space Elves?) you have the fluff make it clear that they're the ones who win the crusade, the ones who re-box Chaos, the ones who do it all and are totally, completely awesome by the way.

And you make it very clear that the old Marines are not.

Now, I know the writing at GW is basically someone going 'Wouldn't it be awesome if (insert event here) happened?' the writers all imagining it playing out as a Saturday Morning Cartoon episode and going 'gak yeah!', but you'd think they would have put some thought into potential consequences.

- 1. Telling the people you've had as you elite warriors that they're old news, get lost isn't smart, and while Rowboat 'My dad doesn't love me and it sucks/hey kids, get lost - I have new sons now! Hear that, Calgar!? BETTER SONS!' Guillamn hasn't done it quite so directly, he's not exactly been subtle with it either. I guess talking to the Emperor gave him the best ideas on how to deal with kids...

Assuming that just 10% of the loyal Space Marines are angry, upset and offended enough to get up and walk, that's effectively an entire Legion added to Chaos at a time when Chaos is on the upswing. One in ten Marines being that angry is not hard to imagine.

- 2. The Primaris are built by one man. One Magos. We'd better all hope he didn't include an Order 66 in them, hadn't we? Or made some mistake that causes massive problems down the line. Or that giving all this to one Magos won't upset the Masters of Mars...although apparently Rowboat has forseen this, so when Cawl turns Dark Mechanicus it will be an All As Planned moment.

- 3. Hey, Imperial Citizen, you know who's your hero? No, not those old Marines, but these NuMarines! They're like the old ones we told you were your eternal protectors against the heretic and the xeno, only better. Yes, we know we said it was Heresy to change them, but that was before we really, really wanted to.

Boy, better hope the local citizenry never realize that the Marines look different to the vids all of a sudden...

- 4. The Ecclesiarchy make it pretty clear that messing with the form of Humanity is Heretical. Sure, the Marines did that, but that's OK. The Emperor made them, and it's Extra Heretical to suggest he made a mistake.

But...these ones aren't made by the Emperor. Based on His works, sure, but...maybe Easy E knew a good reason why making Marines Stronger Better Faster Harder wasn't the best move?

Better not tell the Sisters, either, then. They just got an extra ration of Promethium.

~~~

But Rowboat gets to pretend he's the Emperor, making Space Marines and going on Crusades and NO HE DOESN'T HAVE DADDY ISSUES, SHUT UP CALGAR and totally making he universe a pure, human place.

In fact, all of thise would be kinda awesome if I thought GW had intentionally done Rowboat's obvious paralles to how the Emperor treated him and the Primarchs with how he's now treating the Space Marines, or having any kind of consqeunces, but next edition we'll probably learn that all the Old Marines went into one giant happy retirement planet and left the NuMarines to just be more awesome.

People like to bitch a lot.

 Gamgee wrote:
Honestly with all the gak they have been through and they are getting thrown out like old toys I have to say I would be pissed. These are living breathing people. Not robots.

This only highlights one thing. The Imperium is now an even worse horrifying place when even your heroes will get replaced without a one whit to their thoughts or personality or opinions. If I was a Space Marine I would leave the Imperium forever. Gulliman doesn't even like anything you are anymore or your faith. The funny thing is though that the Greater Good would actually offer all of these individuals a place of honour it would even respect their faith (if they have any left). Sure it might not be as glamorous as working under the Imperium itself, but the Tau don't toss aside their own kind so callously and everyone has their place even when the most new thing comes out.

If they ever do a Gue'vesa auxiliary faction I would be genuinely interested to see old marines models in it. When the Primaris marines are tossed aside in the future they will be welcomed with open arms too. Granted I doubt GW will ever do this since they want to sell everyone the new shiny.

Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”

Spoiler:

I'm sorry what faith is that? you mean the Imperial Faith that Space Marines with few exceptions don't actually belive in?

 Jon Garrett wrote:
I think my issue with the Primaris is they were badly thought out. Between them and Rowboat, NuEmperor and Totally Saviour of Mankind and Hot Eldar, they have the taint of Matt Ward's writing.

The simple truth is, the new models would have worked equally well as a new, upgraded set of Power Armour. New models and makes in the face of a Galaxy that no longer has the power of Chaos that Rowboat had his pet Magos working (along with many others, in the event of other changes).

No one would have especially objected, I suspect. Even the Adeptus Mechanicus will likely bow to the will of a Primarch when he points out the whole 'You're sitting next to Chaos' biggest target and Aabbadon is heading this way' issue. Or simply have them based on STC facilities. It's not hard.

But instead, you make them NuMarines. To show they are the NuHotness (Did Rowboat demand the look like Space Elves?) you have the fluff make it clear that they're the ones who win the crusade, the ones who re-box Chaos, the ones who do it all and are totally, completely awesome by the way.

And you make it very clear that the old Marines are not.

Now, I know the writing at GW is basically someone going 'Wouldn't it be awesome if (insert event here) happened?' the writers all imagining it playing out as a Saturday Morning Cartoon episode and going 'gak yeah!', but you'd think they would have put some thought into potential consequences.

- 1. Telling the people you've had as you elite warriors that they're old news, get lost isn't smart, and while Rowboat 'My dad doesn't love me and it sucks/hey kids, get lost - I have new sons now! Hear that, Calgar!? BETTER SONS!' Guillamn hasn't done it quite so directly, he's not exactly been subtle with it either. I guess talking to the Emperor gave him the best ideas on how to deal with kids...

Assuming that just 10% of the loyal Space Marines are angry, upset and offended enough to get up and walk, that's effectively an entire Legion added to Chaos at a time when Chaos is on the upswing. One in ten Marines being that angry is not hard to imagine.

- 2. The Primaris are built by one man. One Magos. We'd better all hope he didn't include an Order 66 in them, hadn't we? Or made some mistake that causes massive problems down the line. Or that giving all this to one Magos won't upset the Masters of Mars...although apparently Rowboat has forseen this, so when Cawl turns Dark Mechanicus it will be an All As Planned moment.

- 3. Hey, Imperial Citizen, you know who's your hero? No, not those old Marines, but these NuMarines! They're like the old ones we told you were your eternal protectors against the heretic and the xeno, only better. Yes, we know we said it was Heresy to change them, but that was before we really, really wanted to.

Boy, better hope the local citizenry never realize that the Marines look different to the vids all of a sudden...

- 4. The Ecclesiarchy make it pretty clear that messing with the form of Humanity is Heretical. Sure, the Marines did that, but that's OK. The Emperor made them, and it's Extra Heretical to suggest he made a mistake.

But...these ones aren't made by the Emperor. Based on His works, sure, but...maybe Easy E knew a good reason why making Marines Stronger Better Faster Harder wasn't the best move?

Better not tell the Sisters, either, then. They just got an extra ration of Promethium.

~~~

But Rowboat gets to pretend he's the Emperor, making Space Marines and going on Crusades and NO HE DOESN'T HAVE DADDY ISSUES, SHUT UP CALGAR and totally making he universe a pure, human place.

In fact, all of thise would be kinda awesome if I thought GW had intentionally done Rowboat's obvious paralles to how the Emperor treated him and the Primarchs with how he's now treating the Space Marines, or having any kind of consqeunces, but next edition we'll probably learn that all the Old Marines went into one giant happy retirement planet and left the NuMarines to just be more awesome.

Time to pick everything apart because I'm bored at work.

1. Bad writing? They're new tools to supplement the crusade and are treated as such. I'll give you Primarchs coming back but I can live with it, and Cawl is a actually a great character.
2. New armor for normal sized marines? Yeah they probably would be sold a good amount. I'll give you this as well. However these are different units. So they need different fluff.
3. Um how are they looking even close to Eldar? gak hyperbole at its finest.
4. They're treated like garbage in the fluff as far as I know. So yeah they're a tool that might help win the crusade, but it creates tension and therefore potential fights between them and the Imperium, and makes the pure Primaris armies even more fluff worthy in those situations.
5. I'll grant you the Saturday Morning Cartoon Villain thing. GW wasn't ever good at writing outside maybe the 3rd edition Necrons codex. Now THAT had excellent atmosphere.
6. That's you making up an interpretation. Literally just to make this post.
7. That's why Cawl is a great character. He gets to do literally anything he wants and everyone is afraid of it. He potentially has his own frickin AI. You wanted grimdark and he does it.
8. Refer to Point #6. What's been given that would actually say it?
9. That's more potential clash material which is great. The Primaris Marines are against what they stand for, and they have to sit back because Roboute says so. You want tension and grimdark...you got it again.
10. They ARE drawing those parallels. You're frickin ignoring them...

It's almost as if people forget that some of those Primaris are the old marines getting upgrades. Yes, old marines are getting the the treatment too.

A positive for new players coming into the imperium is that they can now build multiple different factions alot more easily/cheaply. For instance, I am starting to collect some space wolves soon, but I only really want TWC/wulfen, not blood claws/grey hunters. I can buy primaris space marines, paint everything in a custom successor chapters colours.

Then if say, dark angles take my fancy, I already have my troops. All I have to do is buy the cool stuff like the terminators or ravenwing, same with grey knights etc. Its only a minor thing but its making astartes look alot more appealing to me. Plus the models look beautiful

 NenkotaMoon wrote:
It's almost as if people forget that some of those Primaris are the old marines getting upgrades. Yes, old marines are getting the the treatment too.

Actually that rumour isn't true original coke can't become new coke.

hobojebus wrote:

 NenkotaMoon wrote:
It's almost as if people forget that some of those Primaris are the old marines getting upgrades. Yes, old marines are getting the the treatment too.

Actually that rumour isn't true original coke can't become new coke.

I was about to ask about that. I have been hearing that "old Marines can convert too" statement since almost when Primaris were introduced but have never seen it in any of the fluff (rulebook and codex) or even from a GW source.

 ClassicCarraway wrote:


I was about to ask about that. I have been hearing that "old Marines can convert too" statement since almost when Primaris were introduced but have never seen it in any of the fluff (rulebook and codex) or even from a GW source.

Pete Foley said it in one of the 8th edition Q&As. He was pretty clear about it so, this is indeed a curious case.Either he was flat out wrong (which seems unlikely) or it is something that will be covered later. Personally I'd like to see this to be clarified, as it is kind of big deal.

 Gamgee wrote:

If they ever do a Gue'vesa auxiliary faction I would be genuinely interested to see old marines models in it. When the Primaris marines are tossed aside in the future they will be welcomed with open arms too. Granted I doubt GW will

I am building a "renegade" space wolf army, whose sole purpose is primaris hunting. I think they will take this under consideration, better to die besides fish-heads than be slaves to knife-ears who mock the All-Father. and those traitor wolves who take in the primaris heretics, WOE TO THEM (well, once I buy enough stuff)

 Jon Garrett wrote:

- 1. Telling the people you've had as you elite warriors that they're old news, get lost isn't smart, and while Rowboat 'My dad doesn't love me and it sucks/hey kids, get lost - I have new sons now! Hear that, Calgar!? BETTER SONS!' Guillamn hasn't done it quite so directly, he's not exactly been subtle with it either. I guess talking to the Emperor gave him the best ideas on how to deal with kids...

Assuming that just 10% of the loyal Space Marines are angry, upset and offended enough to get up and walk, that's effectively an entire Legion added to Chaos at a time when Chaos is on the upswing. One in ten Marines being that angry is not hard to imagine.

- 2. The Primaris are built by one man. One Magos. We'd better all hope he didn't include an Order 66 in them, hadn't we? Or made some mistake that causes massive problems down the line. Or that giving all this to one Magos won't upset the Masters of Mars...although apparently Rowboat has forseen this, so when Cawl turns Dark Mechanicus it will be an All As Planned moment.

- 3. Hey, Imperial Citizen, you know who's your hero? No, not those old Marines, but these NuMarines! They're like the old ones we told you were your eternal protectors against the heretic and the xeno, only better. Yes, we know we said it was Heresy to change them, but that was before we really, really wanted to.

Boy, better hope the local citizenry never realize that the Marines look different to the vids all of a sudden...

- 4. The Ecclesiarchy make it pretty clear that messing with the form of Humanity is Heretical. Sure, the Marines did that, but that's OK. The Emperor made them, and it's Extra Heretical to suggest he made a mistake.

But...these ones aren't made by the Emperor. Based on His works, sure, but...maybe Easy E knew a good reason why making Marines Stronger Better Faster Harder wasn't the best move?

Better not tell the Sisters, either, then. They just got an extra ration of Promethium.

~~~

But Rowboat gets to pretend he's the Emperor, making Space Marines and going on Crusades and NO HE DOESN'T HAVE DADDY ISSUES, SHUT UP CALGAR and totally making he universe a pure, human place.

exalted, friend. The All-Father shall not be mocked, not by the Bob "Eldar" Gulliman, not by some fat heretek. where was eldar bobby when fenris was bent over a table by magus? oh that's right, he was running around WITH THE XENOS WHO "RESSURECTED" HIM. funny later he was there at baal, helping codex chapters. convenient that fenris left for demon fodder. THE PRIMARIS HERESY MUST BE STOPPED. THE LINE MUST BE DRAWN HERE!! WHO IS WITH MY WOLVES!?