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Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Hyperspace



Unit Analysis:
Spoiler:


Our best HQ by far - giving rerolls to hit for all models within 6". Cawl is the core of our army, and an integral part of the "CawlStar" (Kastelans, Cawl, Datasmith, and a screening unit). Very much worth his pricetag for what he does.

His armament is hardly to be laughed at, but is very much secondary to his utility usage. The Solar Atomizer's short range makes it a semi-decent CC monster deterrent (it will generally do significant damage to Carnifex sized creatures), but it being in range signifies that you're in a dangerous position. Kastelans being locked in combat generally spells doom for our army, if we cannot resolve the situation quickly.


Now that we have Enginseers to serve as a cheap HQ, the Dominus isn't particularly useful. Unless you're unable to run Cawl (say, you're playing mono-Stygies or mono-Lucius), I would advise skipping him. The TPD is simply not effective enough for his high price.


Gambling unit. For 17pts per model you have a little bit overpriced glass cannon, but if you meet certain prerequisites you get underpriced murder machines. They have normal movement(6”) and decent WS(3+), okay LD(8) and two attacks with crazy good weapon.

They can give mortal wounds at rate making Death Guard jealous. First giving at charge on 6 per model, and then in combat on 6+to wound d3 mortal wounds instead of normal damage. That thing can drop any tough target down, even superheavy, and if you would need to, you can repeat this electropounding with 3cp.

But there is a catch. They are only T3 W1 with 6+/5++/5+++. It wouldn’t be bad if they were not so high in target priority of your opponent. And here comes twist. If you wipe unit in fighting phase, they get 3++ for the rest of the game. Suddenly you have quite sturdy unit that punches like hammer. You want to use stygies stratagem to place them in optimal range from your opponent (9”+from enemy if first, somewhere in midfield behind LOS blocking terrain if second). If you went first, GG they probably single handily won you the game, if second you need to use them carefully since they are probably in unit size of 10+ and you don't want them to evaporate under enemy fire and morale loss.
You can also use Lucius startagem, but I saw to many failed 9” charges to add even more gambling to this equation.

Hordes are their weakness, since they deal multi wound damage, but not so many hits. Also, 2+ wound damage, since it almost nullifies their fnp. Never aim their first charge at something that they couldn’t destroy in first take. If you multicharge, activate them first. Vehicles, monsters, MEQ and TEQ are their preferred target. They are in destructive potential probably on par with Kastellans, but much trickier to pull of. Once they are in SuperSayan mode, they force your opponent to dedicate tremendous power to stop them from rampaging through their back line, giving rest of your army easy time. High risk, high reward unit.


Corpuscarii are relatively cheap, not troop’s level cheap, but 14 pts/model isn’t much for power they offer and for role they are going to do. They aren’t super durable since 5+ inv and 5+ FNP is just barely better (55% vs 50%) than 4+ on 1D attacks. You can’t bump their defense by cover or Shroudpsalm, since their normal save is 6+, and T3 doesn’t help either in world where bolters are common. And you would need every bit of defense since their weapon range is only 12”.
Now, their weapon is 12” assault 3 shots s5 ap0 and D1 exploding 6+ on hit rolls giving you 3 instead 1 hit AND 2 attacks in melee with the same stats. That is a lot of daka averaging with 33,(3) hits of 10 man shooting. It’s bit better than storm bolter in rapid fire range. What they lack in range, they add up to their value in melee averaging on 17,(6) hits on 10 man unit. That’s 50 hits in one round.
Their role is to get in front of your gunline with vanguard, catch charges and deny your opponent from deepstriking and fast attack units, preferably holding objective at the same time. They want to do that on high power opponents, like TEQ with plasma, scions with plasma, harlequins etc bikes. Preferred unit size is 5-10, anything over that will suffer from morale rolls. Look for places with LOS blocking terrain and hold that. Only horde type troops can reliably reclaim objective from them, since other ones won't stand chance in 1v1.
You could also drop them in size of 20+ with Lucius stratagem delivering nasty amounts of daka, but that may quickly backfire with morale rolls. Use with caution to sweep enemy backline objective holders on turn 2 or 3 and lock or distract artilery.

Their best Dogmas are Sygies and Graia(boost defense), then Metallica. They don't benefit from Lucius. They lack serious synergy since we don't have any way to give them +1to hit. There are few stratagems that we can use them with, mainly Wrath of mars, Acquisition at any cost, Legio teleportarium, Clandestine Infiltration and Zealous Congregation, of which three are Forge World specific.
Not bad unit, but overshadowed by other that can do its job better(Sicarian Infiltrators, Dragoons) pushing priest to semi-vanguard role, even harder since codex came out.
6,5/10



Dragoons are the fastest unit in the Adeptus Mechanicus codex aside from Mechanicum Knights. Despite their speed, they are a surprisingly durable unit, due to T6, -1 to hit from Incense Cloud, cover in the open from possible Shroudpsalm, and no damage table. Dragoons should always be taken in a Stygies detachment, which grants it a monstrous -2 to hit past 12" making it impossible for Ork-level shooting to damage them, and causes supercharged plasma to explode 50% of the time. Stygies also grants a stratagem to allow Dragoons to infiltrate, which forces your opponent to adopt a more defensive posture--a situation in which you as a shooting army are clearly favored.

They have two weapon choices. The first is the Taser Lance, which allows AdMech to take a unit that is capable of fighting. It is the preferred option. Although 5 points cheaper, the Radium Jezzail suffers greatly from a lack of AP, is inferior to the Transuranic Arquebus, and is not recommended in any situation.

The primary role of Dragoons is to serve as a screening unit to prevent enemies from getting into close combat with your shooting units. They can also skirmish to tie up enemy screens and other shooting units in close combat, and grab objectives cleared by your artillery. Finally, they may act as shock cavalry to destroy T6-7 vehicles, especially transports and artillery. The size of a Dragoon unit dictates its usage, as the Dragoon's large 105x70mm base causes issues when piling-in--both for yourself and your opponent.

A unit of 1-2 is ideal for screening, as the unit can be deployed at maximum coherence without ever fearing being unable to pile-in correctly. The proper formation is a wall, with the Dragoons' sides facing the enemy. This wall should move sideways toward the enemy and should pile-in so that enemy models cannot fit in between the two Dragoons. Without any additional screening units, two units of 2 is considered ideal for a 2000 point army.

A unit of 3-4 is ideal for a shock cavalry role. With the Conqueror Doctrina Imperative stratagem, a unit of Dragoons becomes a battering ram. Normally mediocre Taser Lances explode on 4+, which in a unit of 4 translates to 24 S8 AP-1 D2 attacks that hit on 2+. A unit of 3 can be expected to consistently kill any T6 transport (such as Taurox Prime), and a unit of 4 any T7 transport (such as Razorback). A unit in this role should always be the last in your army to deploy, as you must position it as far to the opponent's flank and rear as possible. The proper formation for a unit of 3 is a wedge, with two Dragoons following a lead Dragoon facing the enemy, and the proper formation for a unit of 4 is a square, with two parallel lines facing the enemy.

When charging as a large unit, move your Dragoons together as far to the target's side as possible; the enemy should be on the immediate left or right of your Dragoons, a hair's breath under 1". After fighting, you may consolidate an addition 3". Use this to move further past and behind the enemy, being sure to end the consolidation move less than a hair's breadths under 1". The goal here is to get within 1" of as many shooting enemy units as possible. This "sliding" technique is essential for two reasons: 1) Tying up additional enemies without having to take Overwatch. 2) Allowing you to penetrate into the enemy rear by falling back past the enemy the following turn.


Forge Worlds:
Spoiler:

++PLACEHOLDER++


Relics:
Spoiler:

If your army is led by an Adeptus Mechanicus warlord, then you can give one relic to an Adeptus Mechanicus Character. Keep in mind named Characters like Belisarius Cawl can't have any relics, so I'll be giving advice based on the generic Characters. You have access to one free relic, and can buy a second one for 1 CP, or a third one for 3 CP (1 Relic = Free, 2 Relics = 1 CP, 3 Relics = 3 CP).

ARCANA MECHANICUM

Universal:
Pater Cog-Tooth: Replaces an Omnissian Axe, so usable by a Tech-Priest Dominus or an Enginseer. It gives 1 more Strength and 1 more Damage than an ordinary axe. It would be a waste on an Enginseer with his poor CC skill, but a Dominus would hit at S6 with it. It's an odd statline, because you wouldn't face that much T6 models except against Xeno armies like Aeldari flavours or Tyranids. It would probably be best against the latter, as Tyranids are more likely to face you in CC than Drukhari Raiders for example. Could be useful on a Stygies VIII Warlord with the Xenarites Studies trait, as you'd add +1 to your Wound rolls and so wound T7 models on 4+. So it's a highly specific relic that could be useful in a Xeno-heavy meta, otherwise you'd be best to leave it in the reliquary.

Anzion's Pseudogenetor: Each time the bearer fights, it can make 1D6 additional attacks with this S4 AP-1 D1 weapon. Clearly meant to deal with hordes, you could use this on a backfield character, like a Datasmith or Tech-Priest, to deal with tarpits that reach your artillery so as to dispose of them faster and get back firing earlier. Otherwise, could be used offensively against horde armies with a Tech-Priest supported by Infiltrators with Tasers for clearing the area. There are more useful relics, but it's not terrible either.

Autocaduceus of Arkhan Land: The bearer regains 1W lost earlier each turn, and allows him to reroll the die for the number of Wounds repaired when repairing a friendly Adeptus Mechanicus unit. It's a great relic, best used on a Dominus dedicated to repairing your artillery like Onagers and Robots, as it greatly enhances the lifespan of those units. Best used with the Necromechanic Warlord trait, as you'll reliably heal between 2 and 4 Wounds per turn, maybe double that if used with the Tech-Adept stratagem. Your Onager ate a Lascannon shot ? There it's fixed. The regenerating 1W per turn in just the cherry on the cake, in case Snipers noticed you you just heal between 2 and 4 Wounds with your Dominus each turn. A must-have in any army that relies on its artillery.

Uncreator Gauntlet: Replaces a Power Fist, so usable only by your Datasmith. It's a regular Power Fist that deals a Mortal wound each time you successfully wound a Vehicle with it. Not worth wasting a slot for this most of the time, the only use I could see for it is to make your Datasmith useful when accompanying Punching Bots, but it's a highly situational/useless Relic otherwise.

Phosphoenix: Replaces a Phosphor Serpenta, so usable only by a Tech-Priest Dominus. It's a S5 AP-3 D1 Ignore Cover Assault weapon. I don't see the use of this to be honest, its statline being great against TEQ but you'd still need the 3 shots to hope to bring one down so that looks like an underperforming weapon to me. Could be used with the Xenarit Studies Warlord trait to wound Xeno T6 units on a 4+ but that's a lot of adjusting to do to make it usable. Not worth a Relic Slot.

Raiment of the Technomartyrs: Gives the bearer a 6+ FnP equivalent, and each time a friendly <Forge-World> model within 6" of the bearer shoots in Overwatch and obtains a 6 to Hit, this model can make a bonus attack with the same weapon (this bonus attack can't generate more bonus attacks). The only way I see to make this item useful barring the FnP is to use it near Corpuscarii Electro-Priests to try to trigger even more Tesla shots, otherwise hoping to have one or two more shots in Overwatch won't likely change the game. Congrats if you manage to get a bonus Neutron Laser attack with it, though. I'd not recommend it, but it's a way to add more survivability to a character otherwise.

The Skull of Elder Nikola: Once per game, in your Shooting phase, the bearer can use this to deal one Mortal Wound to each enemy Vehicle unit within 2D6" on a roll of 2+. Not worth it at all, keep away from this. One mortal Wound will never help you more than the other available relics we have access to.

Omniscient Mask: Allows you to reroll failed Hit rolls in CC for friendly Skitarii units within 6" of the bearer. The only Skitarii units that would benefit this are the Sicarians and Dragoons, and they'll both be faster and most likely far away from your relic bearer. Using the Conqueror Doctrina Imperative for 1 CP is costlier but far more effective than this relic, because they'll hit on a 2+ and their Taser weapons will proc on a 5+ for Infiltrators and 4+ for Dragoons. A way to use this would be if somehow you screened your backline with Sicarians near your relic bearer and artillery and want to defend against a charge more efficiently, but it's still a situational relic that'd be best left for another one.

Forge-World specific:
Graia - The Cerebral Techno-Mite: Tech-Priest Dominus only, gives +1 CP at the start of the battle if your army is Battleforged. Don't buy another relic for this obviously. Could benefit a Graia Detachment if you're hungry for CPs, but as it will be your only relic you'll have to consider if it's absolutely necessary to have this bonus CP. I'd not recommend it, seeing how easier it is to grab CPs now that we have a 52 pts HQ.

Mars - The Red Axe: Replaces an Omnissian Axe to give it an AP-5 profile instead of AP-1. It's not great at all, as your Dominus/Enginseer won't have enough Strength to reliably wound the targets that have a 2+ armour save. Avoid !

Lucius - The Solar Flare: Once per game, at the end of any of your Movement phases, the bearer can teleport instead of moving normally. Remove him from the Battlefield and replace him anywhere within 30" of his previous position and 9" away from any enemy units. Could be useful when playing Maelstrom missions when you have a card that asks your Warlord to control a certain objective for example, given there's no enemy nearby. Could be useful to save your Warlord's backside from a tedious situation and deny your opponent the Slay the Warlord.

Metalica - Adamantine Arm: Gives a Melee S*3 AP-3 D3 weapon to the relic bearer. You can only hit once each time the bearer fights in CC with it though, so hitting at S12 might be tempting but for just 3 Damage you'd best leave it where it is. Not worth taking.

Stygies VIII - The Omnissiah's Hand: The bearer rolls a die at the end of each Fight phase for each enemy unit within 1" of him, on a 4+ that unit suffers a Mortal Wound. Could be useful if your bearer gets assaulted by Characters or something, but in that case he will probably die before fighting anyway so it's not worth picking this relic.

Ryza - Weapon XCIX: Replaces a Volkite Blaster, so usable by a Tech-Priest Dominus only. Changes the profile to a S7 AP-1 D2 weapon with the same Mortal wound on a 6+ to Wound ability. If you run Ryza and really want a powerful weapon for your Dominus this can be nice, as it's a nice anti-vehicle weapon, but keep in mind you have access to the First-hand Field Testing Warlord trait that gives +1S and +1D to a weapon of your choice barring a relic, so you just win a AP-1 with this. It's a choice between a relic slot and a Warlord trait.

Agrippina - Eye of Lexum: At the beginning of each of your Shooting phases, pick an enemy Vehicle unit within 18" of the bearer, and all friendly Agripinaa units can reroll 1s to Wound against that target until the end of the phase. If the target is a Chaos Vehicle, you can reroll all failed to Wound rolls against that target until the end of the phase instead. Can be great when used with Onagers, when you really need to destroy a Vehicle.


Strategy:
Spoiler:
Wrathbots

This strategy revolves around a specific combination of models, rules, and strategems. The concept is simple, but gives our already powerful Kastelan robots an added buff.

Forge World: Mars
Strategem(s): Wrath of Mars (2CP), Binharic Override (1CP)
Key Units:
Belisarius Cawl
4-6 Dakkastelan
Datasmith [Optional]

Overview:
The “Dakkastelan” - or a Kastelan Robot configured with a trio of Heavy Phosphor blasters - is the lynchpin and ideally we want to take a larger squad for economy of CP. Each Robot puts out 9 shots in Aegis (the default) or 18 when in Protector Protocols.

Once your Robots and Cawl are in position, you either switch to Protector Protocols via a Datasmith or Binharic Override. The unit of Dakkastelans should be within Cawl’s Lord of Mars Aura. This allows all friendly Mars units to re-roll their to-hit rolls in the Shooting Phase. The volume of fire plus the increased number of hits via re-rolls means that when we use Wrath of Mars, we have a large pool of hits which will ideally translate to additional Mortal Wounds.

This simple strategy enables our already deadly Robot unit to deliver a staggering number of Mortal Wounds, giving us an answer to large threats like Magnus.

By-the-Numbers:
Six Dakkastelans puts out 108 shots in Protector Protocols. On average rolls with Cawl’s Aura, this translates to roughly 80 hits. The likelihood of rolling a 6 to trigger a Mortal Wound via Wrath of Mars is 16%, meaning around 13 mortal wounds in a single round of shooting in addition to our standard damage. This is why Wrathbots will be a staple of all AdMech lists, because being able to one-round extremely tough units is an asset. It also increases our overall damage pool, meaning we can wipe out additional models from units, making this a solid strategy for knocking out must-kill horde units in addition to tough single-model units.

Goondozer

This strategy is a general formation of models utilizing specific buffs. Sydonian Dragoons with Taser Lances under Conqueror Doctrina Imperative and the Chant of the Remorseless Fist Canticle. Due to the addition of -1 AP to the Taser Lance and the new strategem, this unit becomes our premier close-combat unit.

Forge World: Stygies VIII
Stategem(s): Conqueror Doctrina Imperative (1CP), Clandestine Infiltration (1CP), Machine Spirit's Revenge (1 CP) [Optional]
Canticle(s): Chant of the Remorseless Fist
Key Units:
4+ Sydonian Dragoons w/ Taser Lances

Overview:
This strategy is straight-forward and powerful. Forge World Stygies adds an additional layer of protection from shooting, adding to our innate -1 to-hit via Incense Cloud, for a total of -2 to-hit from shooting outside of 12”. This is a major boon to keep our unit alive so it can close in and start getting locked into combat(s). Via Clandestine Infiltration, we can position our Dragoons as close as we dare to the opponent’s units - given that we can make our normal movement of 10” and declare out charge, we do not need to be so close as to allow the enemy to move up and shoot within 12”, though. Position just where you think best via pre-measuring movements/ranges to enable a likely charge.

Each Dragoon has a Broad Spectrum Data-tether, which is a prerequisite for the Conqueror Doctrina Imperative to provide its maximum benefit, which is +2 to-hit in the Fight phase. The reason this is impressive is due to the Taser Lance triggering on a 6+, meaning under this strategem it will trigger on a 4+, leading to significantly improved chances to get the three hits instead of just one.

In addition to the strategem, we should strive to get the Chant of the Remorseless Fist activated, to allow us to maximize our hit potential via re-rolling 1’s in the Fight Phase. This gives us more chances to roll 4+ and have our single miss turn into three hits instead. With the addition of -1 AP on our weapons and the high strength of the attacks translating our increased volume of attacks into a high volume of wounds, we should be able to put out a solid amount of damage in a single round. Given the nature of our army, having a solid close-combat element can be vital for locking into place units while we address others via our artillery.

By-the-Numbers:
A unit of six Sydonian Dragoons with Taser Lances will start with three attacks each, for a total of eighteen initial attacks. Half of these will result in a 4+, meaning 27 attacks from our exploding hits. Of the 2 or 3 misses we get via 1’s, when we re-roll via Chant, we will get an additional 1 or 2 hits - for additional chances to explode. This translates into about 30ish hits or more, meaning against most enemies we are wound on 2+, for a total of about 25 wounds at -1 AP. Even against toughness 8 models, we are doing 15 wounds. Those are the two most common scenarios for our Goondozer unit to encounter. Given our high toughness, modest wounds, and somewhat mediocre save (4+), it would likely not be prudent to engage dedicated melee units, especially those with weapons that do d3 and d6 damage. That being said, we can always do a last resort Machine Spirit's Revenge when one of our Dragoons inevitably dies - exploding automatically and causing 1 mortal wound to each unit within 3”. Not particularly deadly, but in some instances it might prove useful.



Allies(?)
Spoiler:

++PLACEHOLDER++


Current Objective - Update unit entries.

Credits:
Spoiler:

em_en_oh_pee - Wrathbots and Goondozer tactics
Aaranis - Relics overview
Suzuteo - Sydonian Dragoon entry
Spera - Fulgurite and Corpuscarii entry

This message was edited 20 times. Last update was at 2017/09/27 21:39:53




Peregrine - If you like the army buy it, and don't worry about what one random person on the internet thinks.
 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




Don't forget a placeholder for Forge Worlds as well. That'll be mildly important.

Now should we have a separate section for allies? After all that garbage thrown in the last thread by that one poster, it would be immoral for us not to help new players understand why Grey Knight Terminators are not a good idea as an allied screen haha!

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Hyperspace

I’ll make a provisional allies tab.

I’m not pleased about how GW only made those beautiful unit headers for half of our units, now I have to figure out how to make some of my own to finish the set. May be hard to do in MS Paint. I may even have to (shock horror) use a more advanced image editing software.

Let’s be nice and civil in this thread, we do not need more schisms.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/09/24 04:53:38




Peregrine - If you like the army buy it, and don't worry about what one random person on the internet thinks.
 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




I simply don't want misinformation being posted in the thread. What you want to do in your games is whatever you want to do, but I want facts, statistics, and common sense in a Tactica thread.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus






I might have gotten carried away.

Spoiler:
Sydonian Dragoons

Dragoons are Skitarii vehicles that stand out as the fastest unit in the Adeptus Mechanicus codex aside from Mechanicum Knights. Despite their speed, they are a surprisingly durable unit for their relatively cheap price of 68 points. They have T6, -1 to hit from Incense Cloud, cover in the open from possible Shroudpsalm, and no damage table. Dragoons should always be taken in a Stygies detachment, which grants it a monstrous -2 to hit past 12", making it impossible for Ork-level shooting to damage them, and causes supercharged plasma to explode 50% of the time. Stygies also grants a stratagem to allow Dragoons to infiltrate, which forces your opponent to adopt a more defensive posture--a situation in which you as a shooting army are clearly favored.

They have two weapon choices. The first is the Taser Lance, which allows AdMech to take a unit that is capable of fighting. It is the preferred option. Although 5 points cheaper, the Radium Jezzail suffers greatly from a lack of AP, is inferior to the Transuranic Arquebus, and is not recommended in any situation.

The primary role of Dragoons is to serve as a screening unit to prevent enemies from getting into close combat with your shooting units. They can also skirmish to tie up enemy screens and other shooting units in close combat, and grab objectives cleared by your artillery. Finally, they may act as shock cavalry to destroy T6-7 vehicles, especially transports and artillery.

The size of a Dragoon unit dictates its usage, as the Dragoon's large 105x70mm base causes issues when piling-in--both for yourself and your opponent.

A unit of 1-2 is ideal for screening, as the unit can be deployed at maximum coherence without ever fearing being unable to pile-in correctly. The proper formation is a wall, with the Dragoons' sides facing the enemy. This wall should move sideways toward the enemy and should pile-in so that enemy models cannot fit in between the two Dragoons. Without any additional screening units, two units of 2 is considered ideal for a 2000 point army.

A unit of 3-4 is ideal for a shock cavalry role. With the Conqueror Doctrina Imperative stratagem, a unit of Dragoons becomes a battering ram. Normally mediocre Taser Lances explode on 4+, which in a unit of 4 translates to 24 S8 AP-1 D2 attacks that hit on 2+. A unit of 3 can be expected to consistently kill any T6 transport (such as Taurox Prime), and a unit of 4 any T7 transport (such as Razorback). A unit in this role should always be the last in your army to deploy, as you must position it as far to the opponent's flank and rear as possible. The proper formation for a unit of 3 is a wedge, with two Dragoons following a lead Dragoon facing the enemy, and the proper formation for a unit of 4 is a square, with two parallel lines facing the enemy.

When charging as a large unit, move your Dragoons together as far to the target's side as possible; the enemy should be on the immediate left or right of your Dragoons, a hair's breath under 1". After fighting, you may consolidate an addition 3". Use this to move further past and behind the enemy, being sure to end the consolidation move less than a hair's breadths under 1". The goal here is to get within 1" of as many shooting enemy units as possible. This "sliding" technique is essential for two reasons: 1) Tying up additional enemies without having to take Overwatch. 2) Allowing you to penetrate into the enemy rear by falling back past the enemy the following turn.

If you want me to cut it down, I can. I also plan to do the Knights tomorrow. All of them. These are the units that I probably differed on the most with people in the past. >_>

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/09/24 07:12:37


 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




Take off the unit stats, but it should be that detailed.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Most interested in the Allies section. Many to chose from and will keep changing over next year. Astra Millitarum fills a lot of niches better than AdMech. Scions, Primaris Psykers, fodder, mechanized fodder, tools.

I'm gonna try skirmishing Space Marine bikers. No clue how good it'll be but I wanna mix Ravenwing. Playing them as Raven Guard until codex.

Battlescribe Catalog Editor - Please report bugs here http://battlescribedata.appspot.com/#/repo/wh40k 
   
Made in gr
Stalwart Tribune





Greece

There is a simple prologue you can use in 1d4chan page that many have contributed there for that result. You can start with those and we can build on them. Suzuteo has made a thesis on Dragoons hahahahah
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




 axisofentropy wrote:
Most interested in the Allies section. Many to chose from and will keep changing over next year. Astra Millitarum fills a lot of niches better than AdMech. Scions, Primaris Psykers, fodder, mechanized fodder, tools.

I'm gonna try skirmishing Space Marine bikers. No clue how good it'll be but I wanna mix Ravenwing. Playing them as Raven Guard until codex.

I can help give tips on good units to ally in if you're that interested.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





So few observations from my game last night:

The auto blow up strategem can be nice if used correctly.
Agrapinaa + bots is a nasty combo
Surrounding and encircling might be a good strategy. Once I have more games in with different armies I'll write a bit up on this.

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Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Hyperspace

Don’t worry about it, detail is good. I think the worst thing that could happen is partitioning that data into the tactics section and unit section.



Peregrine - If you like the army buy it, and don't worry about what one random person on the internet thinks.
 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




A definitive changes list would be a good idea in these early days, to help people who might overlook things.

Also, do Breachers have a better role now that they're 10 points cheaper and have an extra attack? It seems you'd still not really want them in combat, and they still have worse firepower than destroyers for little payoff.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





WEAPON XCIX might be good if it wasn't a ryza only model. it's not damage 1 as previously thought it's damage 2. GW what the hell were you thinking with ryza....

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Made in be
Mysterious Techpriest





Belgium

I'll write a summary about the different relics and stratagems, in competitive and non-competitive settings, just give me a little time to write about it. Thinking about writing a summary about the Dominus too, but be warned that I tend to write really lengthy texts

40K: Adeptus Mechanicus
AoS: Nighthaunts 
   
Made in us
Moustache-twirling Princeps





PDX

Now we can just count down the days until the FAQ.

I think someone should go into detail on:
Wrathbots
Dragoon Bulldozer

Those are two definitive strategies I see us using.

   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





Are Grav-Cannon Destroyers as great as I think they are?
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




 tpogs wrote:
Are Grav-Cannon Destroyers as great as I think they are?


210 points of grav destroyers produces 15 str5, -3, D3 against 3+ shots.
220 points of phosphorbots produces 18 str6, -2, ignore cover, d1 shots without double shoot mode.

The grav destroyers have 9 wounds at T5 with a 4+/6++
The phosphorbots have 12 wounds at T7 with a default 2+/4++

Until there is a FAQ, Robots in defense mode are outshot by the grav destroyers against 3+ save targets, but the Robots are dramatically tougher in either mode with the double shoot mode being double the firepower of the grav destroyers.

TLDR: grav destroyers outshoot defensive mode robots against very specific targets (terminators, primaris, T4/3+), but are always flimsier and put out significantly worse firepower than double shooting robots.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/09/24 23:24:08


 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





Wulfey wrote:
 tpogs wrote:
Are Grav-Cannon Destroyers as great as I think they are?


210 points of grav destroyers produces 15 str5, -3, D3 against 3+ shots.
220 points of phosphorbots produces 18 str6, -2, ignore cover, d1 shots without double shoot mode.

The grav destroyers have 9 wounds at T5 with a 4+/6++
The phosphorbots have 12 wounds at T7 with a default 2+/4++

Until there is a FAQ, Robots in defense mode are outshot by the grav destroyers against 3+ save targets, but the Robots are dramatically tougher in either mode with the double shoot mode being double the firepower of the grav destroyers.

TLDR: grav destroyers outshoot defensive mode robots against very specific targets (terminators, primaris, T4/3+), but are always flimsier and put out significantly worse firepower than double shooting robots.


But GW won't sell me Robots and also I can't paint their guns glowy-green. =(
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





anyone try the fresh converts strategem? curious to see how that works. also priest bombs.

011000100111010101110100001000000110100 100100000011101000110010101101100011011 000010000001111001011011110111010100100 000011101110110010100100000011101110110 010101110010011001010010000001100111011 011110110010001110011001000000110111101 101110011000110110010100100000011000010 110111001100100001000000111011101100101 001000000111001101101000011000010110110 001101100001000000110001001100101001000 000110011101101111011001000111001100100 000011000010110011101100001011010010110 1110  
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




 tpogs wrote:
Wulfey wrote:
 tpogs wrote:
Are Grav-Cannon Destroyers as great as I think they are?


210 points of grav destroyers produces 15 str5, -3, D3 against 3+ shots.
220 points of phosphorbots produces 18 str6, -2, ignore cover, d1 shots without double shoot mode.

The grav destroyers have 9 wounds at T5 with a 4+/6++
The phosphorbots have 12 wounds at T7 with a default 2+/4++

Until there is a FAQ, Robots in defense mode are outshot by the grav destroyers against 3+ save targets, but the Robots are dramatically tougher in either mode with the double shoot mode being double the firepower of the grav destroyers.

TLDR: grav destroyers outshoot defensive mode robots against very specific targets (terminators, primaris, T4/3+), but are always flimsier and put out significantly worse firepower than double shooting robots.


But GW won't sell me Robots and also I can't paint their guns glowy-green. =(


Yeah, I was looking at ways to convert my old destroyers into robots somehow. I couldn't figure a way that wouldn't look stupid so they are rotting on the shelf. Some of my favorite models.
   
Made in us
Cog in the Machine






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Hail, fellow tech-adepts.

Has anyone tried running a 2000 point brigade Mars detachment with 50% shooting and 50% melee?

I want a solid assessment of the validity of a hybrid list built as such.

 
   
Made in lt
Mysterious Techpriest






If by melee you mean Dragoons and nothing else as our melee is terrible when it doesn't deepstrike/infiltrate. Then it can be good. Still Dragoons are probably better in a stygies detachment. Mars is mostly for artilery.

Mathammer(primarily Chaos Daemons, Adeptus Mechanicus, Necrons and Orks) https://drive.google.com/open?id=1mhwa-d77ztppXP9ZUQxur9HewqDTFZ6k
12k pts Daemons
5k pts Orks
5k pts AdMech
3k pts Necrons  
   
Made in au
Speed Drybrushing





Newcastle NSW

So Kataphrons both have a extra attack and Breachers are a Power level cheaper
Infiltrators lost an attack
Onager and Ruststalkers went up a power level

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/09/25 03:06:53


Not a GW apologist  
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Technically the infiltrators lost that attack in the index faq.

I'm really curious to see what the consensus for mixing Mars and stygies ends up as. I can see all Mars and all stygies both being possible choices, as well as mixing the two in different ways. I basically know what I want my army to be at this point, now it's just figuring where to a lot everything.

Also, are people still trying Lucius?
   
Made in us
Pewling Menial




KY, US

Is there any logic to the triple detachment set up?

Styges screen
Lucian deepstrike
Mars artillery

Is it even doable / worth it?
   
Made in us
Ragin' Ork Dreadnought




Speaking as someone who just has one Cawl (from back during that three month stretch where he was useful to my Iron Hands) and three Imperial Knights....
How much does this effect me?
   
Made in lt
Mysterious Techpriest






 gally912 wrote:
Is there any logic to the triple detachment set up?

Styges screen
Lucian deepstrike
Mars artillery

Is it even doable / worth it?


Most lists will be: Mars+Stygies or Mars+Stygies+Lucius, I think. So yes, it may be more than worth it

Mathammer(primarily Chaos Daemons, Adeptus Mechanicus, Necrons and Orks) https://drive.google.com/open?id=1mhwa-d77ztppXP9ZUQxur9HewqDTFZ6k
12k pts Daemons
5k pts Orks
5k pts AdMech
3k pts Necrons  
   
Made in us
Cog in the Machine






Is it possible to build a competitive list with a Mars brigade detachment and a Lucius Vanguard detachment in under 2000 points?

 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




LexOdin9 wrote:
Is it possible to build a competitive list with a Mars brigade detachment and a Lucius Vanguard detachment in under 2000 points?


No. But you could run a Lucius Auxilliary detachment at the -1 CP and put 20 priests in that single unit. Unlike space marine chapter tactics, there is no requirement that a forge world be a non-auxiliary detachment. So an aux detachment of a single unit can get the full benefits of a forgeworld dogma. It is kind of odd and feels like an oversight.

EDIT: or even better, run a Stygies auxiliary detachment of a single unit of 3 dragoons. Infiltrate it every game and if you get first turn then you get a first turn dragoon charge. Lols

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/09/25 05:05:03


 
   
Made in us
Cog in the Machine






Wulfey wrote:
LexOdin9 wrote:
Is it possible to build a competitive list with a Mars brigade detachment and a Lucius Vanguard detachment in under 2000 points?


No. But you could run a Lucius Auxilliary detachment at the -1 CP and put 20 priests in that single unit. Unlike space marine chapter tactics, there is no requirement that a forge world be a non-auxiliary detachment. So an aux detachment of a single unit can get the full benefits of a forgeworld dogma. It is kind of odd and feels like an oversight.

EDIT: or even better, run a Stygies auxiliary detachment of a single unit of 3 dragoons. Infiltrate it every game and if you get first turn then you get a first turn dragoon charge. Lols


I love this idea. Thanks! I think I'll try it out...

 
   
 
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