Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Evening all

So I was hoping to pick Dakka’s collective hive mind a little.

I'm considering the possibility of acquiring my FLGS from its current owner (retiring)

With that in mind, I was curious as to what people would want to see/have provided from their local gaming store/haunt.

Bearing in mind this isn't a "fantasy store Wishlist" - so I'm not likely to have a team of expert painters on hand to paint your army while you wait! Looking for genuine, realistic, achievable suggestions that would make you more likely to visit and spend (both time and your hard earned) at a store, maybe even travel a moderate distance to do so.

Look forward to hearing what you all come up with!

Cheers.

Beer.
Like seriosuly. No joke, I would love a gaming bar. Hell, it can be both, an arcade and Table top.

Good lighting.

If there's a lot of open space, some kind of sound dampeners - my current LGS gets so loud. It's nice that it's big and there's a lot of room for people but it's frustrating when I can barely hear my opponent from 4 feet away. It's the way the building is set up, though, I think. It's essentially warehouse-style, so sound is bouncing everywhere.

If you have staff and do events, please make sure all staff know something about those events. I get "Oh that's Rodney's event, I don't know anything about it." Well if you can't tell me anything about it, guess who's not showing up? (Rodney is a fake name, btw.)

And please, do events

A FLGS is a place where people hang out. Make it conducive to hanging out. A FLGS is more than just stuff it tries to sell. People are loyal to their community, wherein community really means their FLGS.

They buy things at the FLGS because they hang out there.

A pub added on would be perfect. Food. Drinks. Arcade. Gaming space. Late hours.

Clean
Nice people staff or otherwise
Clean
Good lighting
painting area
Snacks and soda
a well maintained bathroom
Clean
enough playing area depending on how many people come in.
Good stock of things to buy
Clean ffs dont perpetuate the disgusting nerd stereotype.

 Desubot wrote:
Clean ffs dont perpetuate the disgusting nerd stereotype.

There's a gaming center near me (more a place you pay to play than a store, and mostly video games), and right on the front door when you walk in is a sign with the store's odor policy. I giggled to myself when I first saw that, but it's actually a good idea.

For me, I know having a big stock is hella expensive, but I want to go to a shop and find what I want to find, especially newer releases. I'll be annoyed if I go there for something that just came out, and the store doesn't have it. I can understand if it's so new that it sold out quick and you're getting more, but some stores just order 1 or 2 copies of something and then never order it again, because there's something else new and shiney to focus on.

If you're going to promote in store play, sell refreshments. You don't need a full on restaurant or coffee shop, but at least have some well stocked vending machines. If you want something easy, there's lots of vending companies out there who will supply the machines and the food and will come fill it whenever you need it. They'll collect the cash and split it with you.

If you're going to have refreshments, have clean trash cans / recycling bins in the gaming area for people to throw away their trash, but don't expect everyone to do it. Do a quick run through the gaming area and throw away any trash left behind so the next players coming in don't have to see it or throw it away.

It's almost 2018, give people free wifi.

Welcoming atmosphere, gaming area slightly separated from the shop area - demo tables for displays and small games are good but keep the gaming and retail slightly separated for the benefit of customers of both.

Bathroom, kept clean

good lighting

some refreshments, or at least a table with a few chairs for people to eat their own (operate area or corner, easily cleaned). Tea/Coffee is not a bad idea but probably don't need more than that.

if you can get a ceiling that dampens sound so much the better.

Easily cleaned floor, heavy carpet is better than lino though, sound and nicer underfoot (e.g. floor tiles).

Reasonable range, doesn't need to be everything but should be the basics, with a good range of paints/glues/scatter etc

Anything in terms of modelling bits that don't take much space but are a pig to mail order (balsa, lengths of plastic etc where the postage usually swamps the products cost).


Think about opening hours, being open when people come home from work is a good idea, pick a night or two for games - look at clubs in the area and pick different days.

If there is another shop in the general area have a visit, see what you can stop thats complimentary more than competing - both will benefit that way - inter shop events also may be useful once established.

Scout local clubs to see what people in the area play.


Have a focus, or at least plan to attract younger potential gamers, find space to keep the collectable card players happy - they can help keep the lights on.


Keep an eye on the gaming club side, try to stop arguments before they occur and nip problems in the bud, have a clear set of rules for gaming, and enforce them



Also ask about successful shops within driving distance, visit, as a customer, try to get a feel for what they do well

Talked long insane hours with my FLGS owner.

In the end the whole thing amounts to "Gaming Space".
I can buy ANYTHING online for cheaper than your bricks and mortar.
We live now in a service based economy.
Run the place the same as an exercise club or a hockey arena.
Provide a comfortable space with all the amenities to support people's chosen activity.

Comfortable chairs say with coffee (K-cup?) available for the various hanger's on: parents, girlfriends, gamer's kids.

The "Basics"
- Clean washrooms with good facility and ventilation and available spray: you will not get women to hang out there otherwise.
- Painting bar: chairs, good overhead lighting and a ventilated paint booth to outside. Good for gluing if some people are sensitive.
- Good HVAC, we have... smells. Excess heat or cold will make people unwilling to hang-out and so some air exchange may be needed.
- Open space to place tables for a variety of games, no lag-bolted down permanent fixtures or it will make the space inflexible.
- Get snacks and soda/pop vending machines to feed the masses and free up your staff as well as give a source of income.
- Cash machine, in the hopes people need to top-up their wallet. You could be really evil and then only take cash...
- Sounds silly but a juke-box system. Music by vote of the masses seems to work better than what the owner decides...

- Hanging various banners from the ceiling will help with noise issues if it is a tall space (like what we have here).

- Lighting, more ambient than directed is wanted, especially since most of our hobbies are very visual.
- I want the FLGS to remain open so it needs good business, right now MTG is big, Pokémon is getting to be a bit better, RPG groups seem to be coming back, board game nights are becoming a surprising big hit and good old 40k has been a big show since 8th edition release ... all this translates to being able to seat some 40 odd people at a time.
- Big screen with computer for things like registration for Magic night or Pokémon or anything else of interest to display.
- Found that a ring of display counters about 1/4 of the way into the shop bordering the play space with a clear field of view is needed. Similar to a bar space but with expensive items behind the glass for display.
- Rent out lockers or some space so people can secure their stuff (check with your insurance on this). I have had a few painted items walk away / disappear where I could have locked it up and been a non-event. It is terribly convenient and easy money.
- Wi-Fi, free or minor fee, your choice. It is increasingly becoming a "must-have".

Some notes for general retail:
- Keep staple items (paint glue) near the back of the store so people have to walk past more "impulse buy" items.
- Keep stuff with good margin or trendy stuff near the cash register to again allow for impulse buying.
- Keep the front of store clean and well lit. Many customers will give a store a pass if they cannot see in or it looks dark (dark tinted glass or banners covering the glass is bad practice).

Service Based:
- Teach model assembly techniques.
- Teach painting techniques.

The above two items could be sign-up lessons that could be more formal with a general course outline and pay a fee or just have it on a "drop-in" basis and possibly no fee.

- Offer some miniature build/paint services.
- Offer a few later hours events.
- Have a higher end local food truck come by for a special event (see what terms can be arranged where you get a cut).
- Register your business with the various organizations for tournaments, I usually see an entry fee with prizes given out above what the supplier gives for the events.

My thoughts for now.

Talizvar covered a really solid list.

Few things that my LFGS does that I think are excellent ideas:

-They offer painting lessons for air brushes periodically and have all of the stuff you need to buy in store. I think they sell a fair number of compressors and air brushes that way. Apply this approach whenever possible, if you teach someone a neat new skill and they're excited about it they are more likely to purchase the items to do it then and there rather than go home and search for it cheaper online.

-Once a month they do what they call Thors Night, it's like the second Thursday of every month where they stay open until midnight. It offers a really good evening where you can play some of those longer games without having to show up first thing on a Saturday/Sunday to do it.

-Not sure if it is possible in your store but separating the gaming and store areas of the store can be a big boon. The gaming area of my LFGS can get very loud but it is separated from the store portion so if you need a bit of quiet you can just step out real quick and not leave the store entirely.

-My LFGS does special all day gaming events occasionally throughout the year. You pay a set fee, they cater lunch, open early, stay open late, and the gaming area is restricted to just those people who have registered for the event. It provides another good opportunity for those long games people may hesitate to play or for groups to do special events and such.

-Last thing that my LFGS isn't fantastic on but the community is so they may just be leaving it to them but run events. Run leagues, tournaments, events, etc. It keeps interest or grows interest in games and tournaments for many people are the prime times where they can come out and play. Finding a free 3-4 hours to play a game of 40K is tough for me but I usually try and attend every tournament in my area because I can block out the day and know I will get in 3 games with little wasted time of waiting for an opponent to show up, figuring out mission, etc. 3 games, quickly and in an organized fashion are gaming gold to me.

Main thing?

Staff that know the difference between being friendly with customers, and being friends.

Not silly 'top dog' groups who feel they're owed preferential treatment because they've claimed the owner/till monkey a 'close personal friend'.

Talizvar's list is a good one, but since you're in the UK it's probably not going to be achievable in an easily accessable retail space given rents over here

and given far more folk (younger ones especially) will be using public transport compared to driving it's got to be easy to get to (so that cheap warehouse space in the out of town industrial/retail park is probably not a smart move)

run it as a business rather than a hobby,

it's a fine balance between having a healthy local community and a local clique who will put off new customers either accidentally (eg stinky, opinionated) or deliberately (they don't like strangers, they don't want to share table time etc) and you and your staff have to keep on top of it

A lot depends on how much space you've got and the area around you and the current customer base. Any plans that are going to work have to start with what you've got - its one thing to say that good lighting, good space and food are great things but if you're stuck in the backwaters of the highstreet with a shop only just big enough to swing a mouse in then you've got to adapt to that rather than dream of impossibilities.

I do second the motion on food if possible; if you look at the highstreet food is a big thing that is hanging on. If you're already offering gaming tables then offer food as well; don't let that be what makes people walk out the door to go buy elsewhere.


If you don't have space for tables and such consider networking. Local schools/college/universities are ideal places to see if you can make some local connections and drum up some support. You will find that you might not be able to or will be limited in what you can do at schools or colleges with under 18s however universities should be easier to network with. Always go through official channels and keep in mind things like DBS checks on yourself and staff as another line of protection (likely a requirement on insurance if you're offering table and gaming space for under 18s).



If you've got game tables and a healthy population consider that different game nights for different game types is important; but also that (where possible and practical) you break age groups up as well. It's not that older and younger can't play together; but if you've got a healthy older and healthy younger generation groups then letting them have their own game nights can be a big draw to them. Generation gaps are a real thing and people oft feel more relaxed where there isn't as big a gap with the rest of the players.
Of course if you've a smaller population then you'll have to link them up.


Again it really all hinges on what you have as to what else you can do.

I would say the rest is just good business sense - good staff, friendly atmosphere, knowledgeable staff; good products; good stock; etc....

I helped run a friend's FLGS in the US for about 4 years.

Being a FLGS owner is a lot of work for relatively little money. There were times business was booming, but mostly it was fight to stay out of the red. You have to love hobbies to take this on.

Some of the insights I gleaned from the experience were:

1) Stock stuff besides 40k. Biggest profit center for us was Thomas the Tank Engine trains. It was the first thing anyone saw coming into the store.

2) Community matters. Organize tournaments, have ample space for tables in the back. We found 6 was the optimal number, it meant people could always play when they wanted to. And find a way to track them. The store had a group of about 140 active players at it's height and we were always looking for ways to make it grow.

3) Community leaders matter. You are not going to have time to run the community the way it should be run. Find a group of people who are enthusiastic about a game, offer them discounts on product for hanging out in the store and being accessible to players.

4) Offer food. You don't need a kitchen, but you don't want to be losing dollars to that Chinese place down the street. When thinking about food, try to avoid things that generate a lot of crumbs (i.e. potato chips) or have smells some people might find offensive.

5) Use social media. At the bare minimum, Facebook. It should be a journal of everything happening at your store. It's a great way to find out what can be improved, customers really only used it to complain.

6) Create a culture of preference and identity. Hard to explain. We found ways to connect players based on mutual interests, i.e. 2nd edition / 4th edition nights, introductions between all the players of a certain faction, recognition for the best painters at the shop. One of the things that started happening is people would want to change their identity. When the 6th edition Codexes would hit, someone would say, 'Space Marines suck. I need to be playing Eldar.' And right there we would sell $3,000 worth of army, there was some special happy feeling that overrode knowledge the same item could be purchased cheaper online. A lot of it was driven by this sense of belonging to something bigger than a store and people were cheering while you did it.

Basic tactics? Give your customer a reason and an invitation to come back.

Whatever it is you sell, try to have some kind of event for it in the next few weeks. Don't just tell people about it, invite them.

Invites stick in the mind

TBH?

A staff that actually is active with its community. Until very recently I managed an FLGS and one of the things we were told we did right is engage with the community. I was never hesitant to call out someone being toxic, and we always cultivated a fun welcoming enviroment

Also, having the balls to have the conversation with a smelly dude for the good of the store is a really important thing for you as an owner/manager.

That said if you're getting into the FLGS game be sure you know MTG. That's where your money is going to be.

I think people need to consider the difference in licensing etc in the UK compared to the states and elsewhere. Offering food and drinks of any kind in the UK is a lot more hassle than it's worth as you need to have a range of different licenses and washrooms etc.

I appreciate that the OP might not want to go into too much detail but some basic info on the kind of shop it is might help a lot in giving advice.

 Hollow wrote:
I think people need to consider the difference in licensing etc in the UK compared to the states and elsewhere. Offering food and drinks of any kind in the UK is a lot more hassle than it's worth as you need to have a range of different licenses and washrooms etc.

I appreciate that the OP might not want to go into too much detail but some basic info on the kind of shop it is might help a lot in giving advice.

Thats fair enough

at best probably just have a shop near a pub or food establishment for convenience.

True, though you might be able to offset some difficulties if you twin with an established outlet. I know bookshops have looked at getting coffee shops inside them - either by linking up two shops next to each other or giving over space and having a shared premises (though of course that comes with its own risks).

At a very simple level you could do a deal with one or two local outlets - discount cards and such. Regular customers for you get 15% off Pizza at Pizza Hut down the road kind of deals could well be a good way to network locally and encourage more support for the store.



Again a lot of this depends on space - and I'm reminded that a lot of UK stores are often very tiny so chances are even a vending machine would be serious retail space being taken up.

 Desubot wrote:
Clean
Nice people staff or otherwise
Clean
Good lighting
painting area
Snacks and soda
a well maintained bathroom
Clean
enough playing area depending on how many people come in.
Good stock of things to buy
Clean ffs dont perpetuate the disgusting nerd stereotype.

Amen.

Personally? the same thing I want from any other shop. Staff who are professional and knowledgeable about the stock. A shop that has a good range of stock (if you stock a paint range, keep them all in stock. For miniatures games, at least have the rules, the most useful game aids and the starter sets. For RPGs, the core rules).

Gaming space? I'm not bothered. I don't go into Currys to wash my clothes, only to buy a washing machine. If you do have it, make a effort, though.

 Desubot wrote:

 Hollow wrote:
I think people need to consider the difference in licensing etc in the UK compared to the states and elsewhere. Offering food and drinks of any kind in the UK is a lot more hassle than it's worth as you need to have a range of different licenses and washrooms etc.

I appreciate that the OP might not want to go into too much detail but some basic info on the kind of shop it is might help a lot in giving advice.

Thats fair enough

at best probably just have a shop near a pub or food establishment for convenience.

If there is a good one nearby it doesn't hurt to be friendly with them either - get a menu up for them, and see if they will put up something in the pub/fast food place or whatever - many here seem to promote local clubs etc

- Monthly Specials: October is Ork month. All Orky related merchandise is 20% off. St. Patricks day gets anything green (Orks/Nurgle/Salamanders) gets 20% off. Walt Disney birthday gets all Skaven related merch 20% off, so on & so on.

- Guest painters class. With a small fee & pre-selected paint kit (brought at the store) a small class can get quality time with a well known painter.


- $100 discount special. Drop over $100 get the discount.

I agree with the general sentiment here.

Well stocked.
Well lit.
Clean.
Well ventilated.
Gaming space.
Spacious enough.
Reasonable prices.
A welcoming atmosphere.
Staff who know the games they sell.
Gaming events.
Profitable enough to stay around.

I don't really care a lot about snacks and drinks, it doesn't need to look fancy or have a nice address (proximity helps though, but close by for one is far away for another).

Do try to avoid showing your preference for certain games. If you sell Yu-Gi-Oh, be as accomodating to the YGO players as you are to the Warhammer players. I know of a LGS that made clear to its customers that there was a hierarchy of games, if you were playing a game they didn't like there, and people showed up wanting to play a game they preferred, you'd get kicked out. They're not around anymore.

I forgot about PARKING
I now live outside of NYC & getting to a store is not what stops me. It's the idea of finding a place to park in NYC that makes me say screw it & Amazon it. Found a shop near my job in Poughkeepsie, NY that not only carries GW product but is open late, has space for playing & actually is in a strip mall with plenty of parking.

After chatting them up, I went to that store right after work & dropped $$$ for some fresh gear. I was so happy to have finally found a place where parking is not a major, major consideration. Seriously, if I can't park I'll just purchase online.

Many other things mentioned previously are quite important but the lack of parking thing is my red line.

 Cream Tea wrote:

Well stocked.

Gaming events.

These are the two of the most crucial ones for me. With the former, It's those seven worst words an FLGS owner can utter: "I can order it in for you.". Mate, I can get it for cheaper and in less time it takes you to "order it in" from online places. Kinda defeats the purpose if you don't have stuff on the shelf, and I'm talking core products here; not just niche stuff.

Also events. A community can thrive on these. You can create mini "arms races" between players needing new bits to shore up their forces (see also, "well stocked") in long campaigns. You can get people motivated to play games they may have not played in a while and dust off their forces. I've seen to many communities die on their arses due to the LGS owners not running events other than for MTG.

I saw this come up a few times: knowledgeable staff.
One guy at my FLGS is amazing with knowing all there is to know about MTG cards and strategy.
Another guy is a retired gentleman that has forgotten more than I know about models yet he still knows how to get a beginner started well.
They are a bit weak in the 40k product but many of us "hangers-on" are happy to give a nice introduction to new players (yes! more new players... try not to scare them off! )

I can understand the comment of confusing customers with friends.
When the store is made to be a place to hang-out, the regulars become pretty familiar (myself as one of them).
We have been rather lucky where the owner is very happy to take suggestions on improving things and some more "entitled" community personalities were told to hit the road when they started trying to "dictate".

The website and facebook groups seem to work well for us all trying to coordinate getting our opponents.
Many of us even get a quick message when they get new product in to see if we want anything reserved.
Dedicated evenings of the week for various games is also a boon.

Having people that take the time to offer a variety of service does a good job of getting my money.
Unfortunately, if I need to make a big purchase, a hobby store up the road tends to be 30% cheaper (!!??) so is difficult on my loyalties.

 Talizvar wrote:
I saw this come up a few times: knowledgeable staff.
One guy at my FLGS is amazing with knowing all there is to know about MTG cards and strategy.
Another guy is a retired gentleman that has forgotten more than I know about models yet he still knows how to get a beginner started well.
They are a bit weak in the 40k product but many of us "hangers-on" are happy to give a nice introduction to new players (yes! more new players... try not to scare them off! )

...

While helping me pick out paint, the employee asked out loud what are good colors for Death Guard & bone. No less than 3 guys piped in with help & offered technique that I can consider. All you "game-shop flies" are all right with me.