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Hello,

Recently started trying to magnetize some Leman Russ'. Plastic-glued some ~6mmx2mm to the inside of the hull to hold sponsons, and let it dry pretty much nearly a full 24 hours. Tried to test it just now with an outmounted magnet from the outside - pull is strong, but so strong the interior magnet ripped free as soon as I tried to remove the other magnet!

I'd originally thought to use super glue instead of plastic glue, but know that super glue gets pretty brittle and figured plastic glue might seat it a bit better.

What experience have you had with keeping these things in place? Can't exactly counter-sink them inside a hull, but I have thought about building a box of sprue around the magnet pretty tight.

Thoughts?

M.

You can't use plastic glue, it only works for bonding plastic to plastic and isn't really a "glue" per se.

I use superglue, how brittle it becomes depends on the formula. There are super glues out there with rubber in them that settle more or less flexible. A large contact area is always the best way to get a solid connection though.

Only superglue will hold metal to plastic. Sand the area of the magnet to be glued to have something for the glue to grip. Also if the magnet is ripping out, glue some plastic discs to the magnet to have something between them to reduce the strength and not have a space between for them to pull out towards.

 Badablack wrote:
Only superglue will hold metal to plastic.

There's quite a few glues that will hold metal to plastic, it's just plastic cement is not one of them.

I typically just use superglue but for particularly troublesome areas, I prefer epoxy glue to superglue. The brand of choice out in Australia being Araldite but if I recall correctly you can't get Araldite in the USA, so use whatever good quality 5 minute epoxy adhesive you can find in a hardware store.

Sand the face of the magnet, and the plastic where it's attaching lightly - use superglue, preferably a gel. Alternately, the strongest method would be two part epoxy-resin, but it's unnecessary.

Yup super glue, but also thin patch of green stuff over the magnet goes a long way...

Magnets are extremely hard to get adhesive to work with, there are special 2 part epoxy glues that are specifically designed for magnets but these are usually out of reach to the general public.

Sanding the face of the magnet and then applying superglue is going to be the best bet as superglue works better on a roughened surface, probably wouldn't hurt either to slightly roughen the area where the magnet is going to go too for extra strength.

 Supershandy wrote:
Magnets are extremely hard to get adhesive to work with, there are special 2 part epoxy glues that are specifically designed for magnets but these are usually out of reach to the general public.

I've not heard of special magnet epoxy, how does it vary from hardware store epoxy?

When I spoke to a magnet supplier they just suggested Araldite.

At work we've used plexus to stick magnets in, though I couldn't say whether or not it's better than epoxy because it was in a joint designed to grip the magnet well (ie. the glue had minimal load on it).

Araldite or some other epoxy adhesive.

stuck some magnets into various models with that and never had a problem.

Superglue has the advantage you can actually remove them by freezing it

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Supershandy wrote:
Magnets are extremely hard to get adhesive to work with, there are special 2 part epoxy glues that are specifically designed for magnets but these are usually out of reach to the general public.

I've not heard of special magnet epoxy, how does it vary from hardware store epoxy?

When I spoke to a magnet supplier they just suggested Araldite.

At work we've used plexus to stick magnets in, though I couldn't say whether or not it's better than epoxy because it wasn't in a joint designed to grip the magnet well (ie. the glue had minimal load on it).

Blimey, there's a brand I haven't heard of in a while Their catalogue was quite good for industrial adhesives!

There's a company over here called Bondchem that designed a 2 part epoxy specifically for magnets in electric motors, there's really no difference between those, neodymium, fridge magnets etc when it comes to adhesive. Problem is I can't remember which one does it.

Henkel on the other hand (Or rather Loctite) do have this however

Loctite Magnet Bonding Guide

Just type in the product code and you should find something on amazon, ebay or a local distributor. If it's a distributor, they might be able to give you some more information on it and maybe a better alternative, Bear in mind though, this stuff isn't cheap BUT it's a high guarantee of success and a tube should last you a while as long as you look after it.

Well, picked myself up some "thick" superglue at the new local Hobby Lobby. I think I'll do the rough surfacing, then glue, and then cage the thing in place with glued down sprue. Maybe GS if I can figure out where mine went off to.

I suppose the real issue is for hull weapons - I suppose I can sink it a little further and seal the whole thing inside the backing with GS?

Brand new ground for me, to be sure!

M.

 Supershandy wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Supershandy wrote:
Magnets are extremely hard to get adhesive to work with, there are special 2 part epoxy glues that are specifically designed for magnets but these are usually out of reach to the general public.

I've not heard of special magnet epoxy, how does it vary from hardware store epoxy?

When I spoke to a magnet supplier they just suggested Araldite.

At work we've used plexus to stick magnets in, though I couldn't say whether or not it's better than epoxy because it wasn't in a joint designed to grip the magnet well (ie. the glue had minimal load on it).

Blimey, there's a brand I haven't heard of in a while Their catalogue was quite good for industrial adhesives!

There's a company over here called Bondchem that designed a 2 part epoxy specifically for magnets in electric motors, there's really no difference between those, neodymium, fridge magnets etc when it comes to adhesive. Problem is I can't remember which one does it.

Henkel on the other hand (Or rather Loctite) do have this however

Loctite Magnet Bonding Guide

Just type in the product code and you should find something on amazon, ebay or a local distributor. If it's a distributor, they might be able to give you some more information on it and maybe a better alternative, Bear in mind though, this stuff isn't cheap BUT it's a high guarantee of success and a tube should last you a while as long as you look after it.

Ah ok. Those Loctite ones are either acrylics or 1 part epoxies (oven cured) rather than 2 part epoxies, couldn't find any magnet specific epoxies on the Bondchem website.

I've used a bunch of epoxies (both consumer level and industrial) but had never come across specific magnet ones, figured anything that was designed to work on a metal substrate would be equally designed to work on a magnetic substrate.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Supershandy wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Supershandy wrote:
Magnets are extremely hard to get adhesive to work with, there are special 2 part epoxy glues that are specifically designed for magnets but these are usually out of reach to the general public.

I've not heard of special magnet epoxy, how does it vary from hardware store epoxy?

When I spoke to a magnet supplier they just suggested Araldite.

At work we've used plexus to stick magnets in, though I couldn't say whether or not it's better than epoxy because it wasn't in a joint designed to grip the magnet well (ie. the glue had minimal load on it).

Blimey, there's a brand I haven't heard of in a while Their catalogue was quite good for industrial adhesives!

There's a company over here called Bondchem that designed a 2 part epoxy specifically for magnets in electric motors, there's really no difference between those, neodymium, fridge magnets etc when it comes to adhesive. Problem is I can't remember which one does it.

Henkel on the other hand (Or rather Loctite) do have this however

Loctite Magnet Bonding Guide

Just type in the product code and you should find something on amazon, ebay or a local distributor. If it's a distributor, they might be able to give you some more information on it and maybe a better alternative, Bear in mind though, this stuff isn't cheap BUT it's a high guarantee of success and a tube should last you a while as long as you look after it.

Ah ok. Those Loctite ones are either acrylics or 1 part epoxies (oven cured) rather than 2 part epoxies, couldn't find any magnet specific epoxies on the Bondchem website.

I've used a bunch of epoxies (both consumer level and industrial) but had never come across specific magnet ones, figured anything that was designed to work on a metal substrate would be equally designed to work on a magnetic substrate.

Yeah, there's something about magnets that meant adhesive wouldn't work well, I never managed to figure it out due to leaving my role but I think it had something to do with the magnetite from previous discussions with my contact.

As it's not the same as Steel, Iron, Alloys etc, most adhesives wouldn't work, or if they did, they would fail after a small amount of time (weeks, months etc, that is short in adhesive terms).

Yeah, the Bondchem ones weren't consumer facing and acted more by supplying to smaller parties, hence why the magnet MMA wasn't on there, It was only for interested parties as they produced according to demand.

However, for lightweight applications, the scrubbing of the magnet and the surface it's going to be attached to and using superglue should suffice.

There, that'll hold 'em



M.

 Infantryman wrote:
There, that'll hold 'em

Spoiler:

M.

One way of doing it I suppose

There are two big issues to contend with when gluing magnets.

1. The magnets are very smooth and hard to get a grip on.

2. Superglue really likes to be in a perfectly flush joint. The more gap between the surfaces, the worse the hold. My solution is to drill the hole slightly bigger than the magnet and put some green stuff in the hole, then press the magnet in deep enough it is just below the surface of the piece. Then use Green stuff to cover the magnet with about 1mm of GS. Superglue as necessary. That makes a physical support for the magnet and it is much less likely to come out than with glue alone.

Interesting about the flush joint; I'd think more surface area would give a better hold?

For those internal hull magnets I have that cage now, but future ones probably will just use some GS - I was mostly just messing around, there. I have magnetized "struts" for the sponsons but I haven't actually installed them into said sponsons yet - busy as late.

I did get a chance to start applying the small magnets to the sponson "turrets" and some of the weapons. The guide I was following called for a friction fit, but I'm reinforcing them with the magnets as well. My main observation is that my "large" drill bit is exactly the diameter of the magnets he calls for, and result in a very satisfying fit. These I glue from within the hollow of the turret, basically just piling some superglue on it. Also, trying to drill straight down the middle of the weapon you want to attach is difficult, as the little barrier between the chambers is slightly thinner than the magnet / drill bit, and it likes to cam to one side. Just pile some superglue up on it...

I'll need to finish up on the various options for the sponsons this evening if I have time - my PIP heads for infantry conversions have come in and I'm a bit eager to knock all those out (except the sergeants - still need some bolters!)

I may actually share my prototype guy up here tonight.

M.

Regular two part 5 minute epoxy is great on magnets to hold them in place. I use it on all my models and over years of use have not had any pull the magnet out.

Use liberally when gluing inside a part of the model that will not be seen.

Only issue is with drilled holes the same size as the magnet, you need to cut a small notch to let air and excess epoxy out.

Hope that helps,

CB

If feasible (it usually is with a little engineering), I use a tiny ball of green stuff with the magnet sunk in flush. That way the side of the magnet has friction/hold on it as well. Plus if the green stuff won't hold stick to the plastic on its own, it is a much better surface for gluing.

 Todosi wrote:
There are two big issues to contend with when gluing magnets.


2. Superglue really likes to be in a perfectly flush joint. The more gap between the surfaces, the worse the hold. My solution is to drill the hole slightly bigger than the magnet and put some green stuff in the hole, then press the magnet in deep enough it is just below the surface of the piece. Then use Green stuff to cover the magnet with about 1mm of GS. Superglue as necessary. That makes a physical support for the magnet and it is much less likely to come out than with glue alone.

I use this method. Unless you use a forstner bit, the bottom of the hole is going to be concave, and this will allow the magnet to rotate a little unless you very carefully set it. The GS at the bottom prevents this.

I magnetised a Wraithlord, NemDreadKnight, several dreadnoughts (metal) as well as a couple of imperial tanks and haven't had the magnets come out yet (and these were all done in 5th ed).

I use Zap-a-gap for almost everything non-plastic. It works with every magnet type I use it on.

For sponson magnets in the hull, I used one of these:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/N42-40mm-x-20mm-x-5mm-Strong-Neodymium-block-magnets-MRO-DIY-science-var-PACKS-/131742248566?var=&hash=item6460c17bc1
The thickness of the hull meant it was not overly powerful on the outside, and was easier to place. Being wide, the sponson piece is moved around until it clicks into place.