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I got one of those old Battle boxes for IG (Command squad 20 infantry 3 hwt and a sentinel) and have finally decided to sit down and make it.

How would you guys recommend I kit out the Command squad weapon wise?

I'm not sure where this force is gonna go just yet. I have tons of 3rd party infantry to add..a Valkyrie...some tanks down the line. But I want to ease into it build and paint wise so I'm gonna try to finish this box and play it first.

Thanks Dakka!

Banners are pretty good now since commissar nerf. I'd personally keep them cheap with a banner and maybe a single special weapon.

You can use the Trenchcoat legs to represent any manner of Officer / Commissar / Officer of the Fleet legs. Combine with a "fancy" head, and you're laughing.

There's a head, in the Chimera kit, or maybe the Hellhound kit, that comes with a visor type thing on it. I combined the "pointing finger" with that head, added a modified Vox backpack, and had a Master of Ordnance.

There's also a "Commissar" looking head that has a respirator on it. I used that with the body, put it on the trenchcoat legs, gave him a bolt pistol and had a Commissar.

As mentioned, the Banner is probably the better Ld buff these days.

I'd personally use the bits to buff up your Infantry upgrades. A Plasma Pistol is a nice add-on to an Infantry Squad with a Flamer. Good to advance with a Russ to screen it.

Plasmagun and bolter for an Infantry squad [Plus heavy] to sit back and protect Artillery.

I look at those boxes as handy bitz to make characters and infantry upgrades out of. You can still use regular Lasgunners with "just" a banner for the Ld buff from a command squad. They should be a big target, so I'd keep them cheap.

So your recommendation is to keep the Command squad as just las rifles and banner and vox as opposed to giving them any kind of weapon load out?

Abalaitive wounds for my Company Commander basically?

Well, that's the thing, the CC is now a separate Character unit. The Command Squad is just a 4-dude unit that can be targeted like any other, to the best of my knowledge.

So the Commander himself benefits from the Character targeting rules, like all other characters, but the command squad is just 4 dudes with a big flag that says, "Shoot me!".

I think, I don't have the codex, and my index is at home.

Assuming I have my rules straight, then yes, it would be best to make the Command Squad as cheap and disposable as possible.

Though then you are losing benefit of BS3+ and not sure I would be paying 29 pts min for 4 guys with +1LD. I find often enough that if I'm taking morale tests it's with enough modifiers that +1LD isn't going to make much of difference. Squad often wiped out anyway.

As a bare minimum I would at least take sniper rifles for rest! Not much but you might occassionally at least take away some weak character or something and gives you some return for BS3+.

Would arming them all with plasma guns be maybe worth it?


Enemy has to chew through infantry to get to them and 4 plasma guns can wreak some decent havoc. Or is that just a waste of points?

Problem there comes into price. That's EXPENSIVE and remember if they can see enemy to shoot their plasma's the enemy can see them...Basically one hit wonders. You move them to shoot something, then they get shot down. Enemy is in no obligation to chew through anything to get to them unless they are h2h enemy. Shooting enemy just shoots at them rather than infantry between. And even h2h enemy often shoots pistol at them and then charges your infantry...

For me, Plasma would be a big no.

As noted, there's nothing to prevent that squad from being shot at, unlike a character. So each wound is a Plasmagun down. That doesn't play well to IG's strength of lose 7 dudes before an upgrade goes down.

Scion command squads are different. Those have "deep strike" to land exactly where you want them to, to deliver that rapid fire plasma. Yes, they die, but they probably trade up in terms of value.

The Sniper thing might be ok. I'm not sure how they stack against Ratlings these days. Our characters are vulnerable to snipers, other armies are less so. But if you can snipe a one-wound character, you've almost surely made a wise investment, especially if you get rid of some kind of buff.

If I recall, the LD buff is an aura, so if you can leverage that onto 4 nearby units, you'd be laughing. Worst case scenario, is a unit spends it's shots going after those 4 dudes, preventing your other unit from needing to take a Ld check. Like I said, I don't have the Codex.

I'd probably just use the models to make one-off characters or upgrades for other units.

Ratlings might be more efficient as snipers but they wouldn't be carrying that LD banner you would be taking squad for. Here you would get that banner and spend what 6 pts or so for trio of sniper rifles. You don't need to kill much with them to pay up that 6 pts...Heck just one 6 to wound against TACTICAL marine squad will have paid those sniper rifle upgrades. One issue albeit is heavy rather than rapid fire so moving and shooting is less efficient.

Wouldn't take them just for sniper rifles but if you want to have the banner then additional 6 pts gives you ~30% chance of causing at least one mortal wound per round. Not that great but 6 pts isn't much you pay to begin with though...

The command squad box is excellent for cool weapons and making a few characters. The command squad unit isn't that great unless you plan on taking 3 and jumping them out of a Chimera or a Valkyrie. Tragically, Scions are better at that too because of deep strike.

Personally I used the box to make some badass veterans, a lieutenant, a Commissar, and some special weapons guys. I have banners too but I haven't used them in 8th edition and in 7th they were just decorative because the banners we're trash.

Oh poor command squads. They dont have that good many uses currently. You can give them viable offensive output via 4x flamer/melta/plasma but then they are four T3 dudes with massive "SHOOT US TO EASILY REDUCE OUR ARMY'S DAMAGE OUTPUT"-sign. Personally I only see them as either slight cheaper, and maybe slight more effective alternative to Ratlings if equipped with 4x sniper rifles. Other use is give them those 4x special weapons and shove them inside Valkyrie/Vendetta. The transport allows them to go where needed. But even in this case Scions will do this job better.

Poor poor Command Squads.

so..general consensus is abandon the command squad completely and just use the miniatures to make OTHER squads of miniatures look better. Or use hem to make other elite units like Master or Ordnance , Fleet captains etc etc.

Additonal question. Who would you put in a Valkyrie?

Thanks Dakka

A unit of Veterans stands out as probably getting the best value out of it.

Vets don't have alternative deployment options like Scions. They can't bulk up numbers like Infantry Squads.

Vets do stack a lot of special weapons into a single unit. Triple Plasmagun + Plasma Pistol is Good Times. Add a cheap Heavy Weapon, you're just at -1 on the move, and once you get deployed into cover you're laughing. You're almost certainly getting worse value out of this than dropping a pair of Scion units, though, by the time you pay for the Valk.

That's part of what makes Scions soooooo good, is "free" deployment option.

I believe you can add a Character, like a Platoon Commander, to be carried in the Valk as well? They used to have enough transport capacity for that, I might be wrong now. Anyhow, bringing orders with you is a good idea, if you can swing it. Check the rules on that.

That's what I'd start to look at, anyhow.

 rayphoton wrote:
Enemy has to chew through infantry to get to them and 4 plasma guns can wreak some decent havoc. Or is that just a waste of points?

Well, they wouldn't have to chew through anything to get to a command squad. They would just shoot the 4 guys that cost 80 points first, and the 10 guys who cost 40 points second. Or never.

 rayphoton wrote:
so..general consensus is abandon the command squad completely and just use the miniatures to make OTHER squads of miniatures look better. Or use hem to make other elite units like Master or Ordnance , Fleet captains etc etc.

Additonal question. Who would you put in a Valkyrie?

Thanks Dakka

Thats what I would do too, as much as I have tried to work a command squad it dosen't have a definite place without bodies to absorb hits or move quickly. THEY DO have a place in a valkyrie, however. You can easily load them up with 4 flamers or plasma and drop them in with a commander, 2 command squads would be best, esp if you were taking advantage of regimental tactics (i.e. catachan flamer rerolls, mordian assassin orders, vostroyans, etc.).

Command squads also can be a safe place to hide a higher BS lascannon, giving it at least 2 extra wounds for a small cost. But that is not the strength of having a whole infantry squad guarding your lascannon now that split fire is a thing.

As for Valks themselves because of their cost they really need to transport something that is worth the cost of fielding the flyer in the first place. Considering that chimeras are a bit over priced for an Infantry squad then they are definitely overpriced for a Valk. They can do some work with a fully equipped vet squad, however, especially if its loaded to the gills with flamers/plasma, heavy flamer, and a lascannon. You can easily do some work with 2 or more command squads as well, but 2 with a company commander for orders is best. I prefer transporting Bullgryns myself since they hit like a ton of bricks and are impossible to kill.

As for the Valk itself, since you are already paying the high bar for it to be on the field always take the upgrades. HBs are relatively cheap anyways and 10 points for a lascannon when multilasers are awful is a steal. As for the rocket pods or hellfire missiles it really depends on how much anti tank vs anti-infantry your army has at the moment, although these days im preferring the hellstrikes because they are pretty reliable.

So...is this Real?

A Valkyrie carrying 2 platoon commanders and 2 command squads with the Mordian keyword can dump all those guys a few inches from a HQ/Character and then hit that HQ (Cause Mordian they can target characters) with 2 heavy flamers. 6 plasma guns and 2 plasma pistols.

Can you assassinate a HQ on turn one With IG?

 rayphoton wrote:
So...is this Real?

A Valkyrie carrying 2 platoon commanders and 2 command squads with the Mordian keyword can dump all those guys a few inches from a HQ/Character and then hit that HQ (Cause Mordian they can target characters) with 2 heavy flamers. 6 plasma guns and 2 plasma pistols.

Can you assassinate a HQ on turn one With IG?

you dont even need 2 commanders either! Mordians make up for their lackluster trait by having one of the most ballin orders out there. Only thing is I think it may only apply to rapid fire weapons, but even then that means you can air drop some guys in fancy suits and chuck a load of plasma at their lynchpin special character. This is the one thing that command squads can do that scions cannot do currently. Same thing goes for Catachan flamers too!

 generalchaos34 wrote:
you dont even need 2 commanders either! Mordians make up for their lackluster trait by having one of the most ballin orders out there. Only thing is I think it may only apply to rapid fire weapons, but even then that means you can air drop some guys in fancy suits and chuck a load of plasma at their lynchpin special character. This is the one thing that command squads can do that scions cannot do currently. Same thing goes for Catachan flamers too!

If your running 2 command squads..don't you need a platoon commander to give each one the execution order? And yeah it only applies to Rapid fire. So..take a command squad with 4 plasma guns each...have a valk dump them 9 inches away and that's 16 plasma shots (maybe overcharged) being pumped into an enemy character HQ.

Thats kinda nuts

 rayphoton wrote:

 generalchaos34 wrote:
you dont even need 2 commanders either! Mordians make up for their lackluster trait by having one of the most ballin orders out there. Only thing is I think it may only apply to rapid fire weapons, but even then that means you can air drop some guys in fancy suits and chuck a load of plasma at their lynchpin special character. This is the one thing that command squads can do that scions cannot do currently. Same thing goes for Catachan flamers too!

If your running 2 command squads..don't you need a platoon commander to give each one the execution order? And yeah it only applies to Rapid fire. So..take a command squad with 4 plasma guns each...have a valk dump them 9 inches away and that's 16 plasma shots (maybe overcharged) being pumped into an enemy character HQ.

Thats kinda nuts

You need 2 commanders to buy 2 command squads, but you don't have to have them anywhere near the command squads! Remember that the commander and his squad are not attached anymore and a company commander can issue 2 orders. You will need minimum 2 commanders but you can have one hang out with the rest of your infantry while your other commander gets air dropped in with the command squads, quite nasty indeed, especially with high synergy characters like Eldar and Death Guard, or competing company commanders!

So whats the point of a platoon commander?

 rayphoton wrote:
So whats the point of a platoon commander?

to fill an elite slot for battalions, also a nice choice to throw in a chimera for a lone vet squad.

Company command squads work best when kept cheap. Either just a flag, or a flag and cheap weapons that won't make them a big target, like snipers or a heavy bolter.

Melta and plasma pay a big premium to be bs3+ so with so few men in the squad it's best to keep them cheap.

As for the box, make the heavy weapon teams tripod mounts so you can magnetize most of the options. That way you can try them out and see what works best.

Infantry squads will desperately want plasma, it's their go to weapons. I love lascannons on mine but heavy bolters, mortars, and autocannons/missile launchers can work too.

Sentinel is probably best as scout for infiltrate/deepstrike denial, but you could hear it up as armored and make it be fire support, especially if you use a regiment like tallarn.

Company commander should get some sort of weapon, plasma pistol is solid as is just a plain old bolter. Believe it or not CqC weapons can be good too. Sword is cheaper with better accuracy, fist is more damage and strength. Depends on what you prefer honestly. You'd be amazed what he can do in close combat though for no more than he costs. Just don't go overboard.

Thanks Mr Moustsffa, That's some solid build advice.