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Made in us
Clousseau




https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/01/06/new-year-new-armies-reveals-new-years-open-day/

So death will be getting a major book.
   
Made in us
Enigmatic Chaos Sorcerer




Tampa, FL

This is a really good thing but at the same time I was kind of hoping for separate battletomes for the different factions. This is essentially Grand Alliance death 2.0 which also makes sense because death is still one faction.

Still, some death love is way overdue

- Wayne
Formerly WayneTheGame 
   
Made in us
Ollanius Pius - Savior of the Emperor






Gathering the Informations.


Battletome: Legions of Nagash is designed to make sure that Death players have just as many options as their counterparts. Inside, you’ll find the warscrolls for every single Death model (so far…) alongside four new Allegiances within Death – the Grand Host of Nagash, Legion of Shadows, Legion of Sacrament and Legion of Blood. You’ll also find rules for the Soulblight vampires, if you’re looking to field one of Death’s most elite armies. If you would rather have an army formed from multiple facets of Nagash’s legions, there are also rules for those who pledge themselves more generally to the powers of Death.

I feel like this is a really smart way to do it. If it's done like the Stormcast book, then you'll be able to field each part separately with no overlap required.
   
Made in es
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain




Vigo. Spain.

Yeah. Death needs more sinergy intra-faction (Necromances and Zombies in different sub-factions? WTF), but if they give their own proper sub-faction their own things, thats good!

Now... will this superseed the Ghouls Battletome? You know, the Crypt Horrours and all of that.

 Crimson Devil wrote:

Dakka does have White Knights and is also rather infamous for it's Black Knights. A new edition brings out the passionate and not all of them are good at expressing themselves in written form. There have been plenty of hysterical responses from both sides so far. So we descend into pointless bickering with neither side listening to each other. So posting here becomes more masturbation than conversation.

ERJAK wrote:
Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.

 
   
Made in no
Longtime Dakkanaut






Shure, i`ll buy the book, but if the horribly ways of subfactions rules in ghb 17 has been carried over to this new book, i see no reson for me to steer away from the death soup.

darkswordminiatures.com
gamersgrass.com
Collects: Wild West Exodus, SW Armada/Legion. Adeptus Titanicus, Dust1947. 
   
Made in us
Damsel of the Lady





drinking tea in the snow

 Galas wrote:

Now... will this superseed the Ghouls Battletome? You know, the Crypt Horrours and all of that.


I'm wondering this too, i've had the impression that they're one of the more popular factions?

at any rate, i'm happy for more skeleton stuff, i hope. Zombies, vampires and ghouls i can take or leave, but skeleton armies are something i've always had a soft spot for. Probably a result of watching Jason and the Argonauts too much as a kid.

realism is a lie
 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






I think this is a vood direction for Death. They need some reorganizing of sub-factions and a whole heap of allegiance options should really help them out.

So it looks like Death will have:

-Generic Death (Nagash Battletome)
-Grand Host of Nagash (Nagash Battletome)
-Legion of Shadows (Nagash Battletome)
-Legion of Sacrament (Nagash Battletome)
-Legion of Blood (Nagash Battletome)
-Soulblight (Nagash Battletome)
-Nighthaunt (GHB2)
-Flesh Eater Courts (GHB2)

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in us
Enigmatic Chaos Sorcerer




Tampa, FL

FEC aren't going to be part of this book, they said. it'll be the other Death factions.

- Wayne
Formerly WayneTheGame 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Yeah, the Nagash book is the forces of Death that he controls. The honorable Courtiers are living creatures and aren't under his influence.

They can go with or against Nagash and even Vampires like Mannfred had to bargain with them rather than effortlessly command them as he does with undead.
   
Made in us
Loyal Necron Lychguard






South Dakota

I’m not too sure that FEC and Nighthaunt aren’t in this book. The announcement said that it includes warscrolls for every Death Unit so far. I’m excited.

DS:70+S+G+MB--I+PW40k10-D++A++/sWD391R+T(R)DM+

My Project Blog: Necrons, Orks, Sisters, Blood Angels, and X-Wing
"
"One morning I shot an elephant in my pajamas. How it got into my pajamas, I'll never know." Groucho Marx
~A grammatically correct sentence can have multiple, valid interpretations.
Arguing over the facts is the lowest form of debate. 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






Units yes, allegiance abilities it seems a no.

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in us
Enigmatic Chaos Sorcerer




Tampa, FL

 Anpu-adom wrote:
I’m not too sure that FEC and Nighthaunt aren’t in this book. The announcement said that it includes warscrolls for every Death Unit so far. I’m excited.


GW facebook specifically said FEC weren't. But I am certain Nighthaunt will be in it, and hopefully they'll finally give the mortis engine the nighthaunt keyword. I know a few people who were incredibly pissed off they didn't fix that.

- Wayne
Formerly WayneTheGame 
   
Made in no
Longtime Dakkanaut






Wayniac wrote:
 Anpu-adom wrote:
I’m not too sure that FEC and Nighthaunt aren’t in this book. The announcement said that it includes warscrolls for every Death Unit so far. I’m excited.


hopefully they'll finally give the mortis engine the nighthaunt keyword. I know a few people who were incredibly pissed off they didn't fix that.



that the mortis still after 3 years dont have a NH key word dont piss me off anywhere near as mutch as the trait nerfs NH got in ghb17.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/07 13:57:37


darkswordminiatures.com
gamersgrass.com
Collects: Wild West Exodus, SW Armada/Legion. Adeptus Titanicus, Dust1947. 
   
Made in us
Enigmatic Chaos Sorcerer




Tampa, FL

I know one person who stopped playing AOS becuse GH17 "ruined" her Nighthaunts.

- Wayne
Formerly WayneTheGame 
   
Made in no
Longtime Dakkanaut






Wayniac wrote:
I know one person who stopped playing AOS becuse GH17 "ruined" her Nighthaunts.


yea, good old gw:
put a bandaid rule on the blackcoach cuz they where to dumb to see their own mistakes when they first made the rules for it, but in the same prossess remove/nerf all the utility tools they needed to actualy make the subfaction work..............
there is a reason to why i refuse to play with ghb17 if im playing my nighthaunts...

i can only hope they have seen the light if NH is part of this book, but i have my doubts.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/01/07 17:11:10


darkswordminiatures.com
gamersgrass.com
Collects: Wild West Exodus, SW Armada/Legion. Adeptus Titanicus, Dust1947. 
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




 FrozenDwarf wrote:

yea, good old gw:
put a bandaid rule on the blackcoach cuz they where to dumb to see their own mistakes when they first made the rules for it, but in the same prossess remove/nerf all the utility tools they needed to actualy make the subfaction work..............
there is a reason to why i refuse to play with ghb17 if im playing my nighthaunts...

i can only hope they have seen the light if NH is part of this book, but i have my doubts.


Am I missing something? Surely all the GHB '17 added was optional extra rules for Nighthaunts; you can still use the Death abilities which are mostly unchanged from '16, can't you?
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






Nighthaunt got a ton of stuff they didn't have before, the only nerf was to the 'death save' allegiance ability that was scaled back for all the death factions. Allies are also a thing now, though the lack of Deathmages being an option seems a massive oversight.

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in no
Longtime Dakkanaut






Thommy H wrote:
 FrozenDwarf wrote:

yea, good old gw:
put a bandaid rule on the blackcoach cuz they where to dumb to see their own mistakes when they first made the rules for it, but in the same prossess remove/nerf all the utility tools they needed to actualy make the subfaction work..............
there is a reason to why i refuse to play with ghb17 if im playing my nighthaunts...

i can only hope they have seen the light if NH is part of this book, but i have my doubts.


Am I missing something? Surely all the GHB '17 added was optional extra rules for Nighthaunts; you can still use the Death abilities which are mostly unchanged from '16, can't you?


it is a choise.
play NH and you get ALOT more utility from the heros and the coach becomes usefull but give up the generic death traits that are overall better then NH, or play generic death soup but you can no longer run a pure NH army.
(shure you can just add bare minimum unit size of skellys/zombies as battleline and fill in the rest with mainly NH and some standard necros, but it does ruin the image of a pure spirit army that way)

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Nighthaunt got a ton of stuff they didn't have before, the only nerf was to the 'death save' allegiance ability that was scaled back for all the death factions. Allies are also a thing now, though the lack of Deathmages being an option seems a massive oversight.


if i faced a low model elite army i used ruler of the night(5+ wound save). if i faced a standard sized army i used supernatural horror as having battleshock doing the job for you helps when you dont have many models on the table.
the 5+ save might have been strong for the soup, but not for elite armys like NH, deathlords and soulblight.
and in ghb17, supernatural horror was not listed as a NH trait, it is a generic death trait....(from a fluff point of view, what on earth can be more scary for the living then fighting the spirits of the dead?)
the NH command traits has simply alot less utility and options in them.


and then you have the morngoul nerf, that i think only arrived as people where using 1-2 of them when you started to hit the 1250+ battles, but what other options do you have when the faction only have 2 units and 2 heros..........

btw this is how i experienced it as a casual NH player. i dont do turnys so i have no idea how it was there.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2018/01/07 23:59:54


darkswordminiatures.com
gamersgrass.com
Collects: Wild West Exodus, SW Armada/Legion. Adeptus Titanicus, Dust1947. 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




 FrozenDwarf wrote:
Thommy H wrote:
 FrozenDwarf wrote:

yea, good old gw:
put a bandaid rule on the blackcoach cuz they where to dumb to see their own mistakes when they first made the rules for it, but in the same prossess remove/nerf all the utility tools they needed to actualy make the subfaction work..............
there is a reason to why i refuse to play with ghb17 if im playing my nighthaunts...

i can only hope they have seen the light if NH is part of this book, but i have my doubts.


Am I missing something? Surely all the GHB '17 added was optional extra rules for Nighthaunts; you can still use the Death abilities which are mostly unchanged from '16, can't you?


it is a choise.
play NH and you get ALOT more utility from the heros and the coach becomes usefull but give up the generic death traits that are overall better then NH, or play generic death soup but you can no longer run a pure NH army.
(shure you can just add bare minimum unit size of skellys/zombies as battleline and fill in the rest with mainly NH and some standard necros, but it does ruin the image of a pure spirit army that way)

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Nighthaunt got a ton of stuff they didn't have before, the only nerf was to the 'death save' allegiance ability that was scaled back for all the death factions. Allies are also a thing now, though the lack of Deathmages being an option seems a massive oversight.


if i faced a low model elite army i used ruler of the night(5+ wound save). if i faced a standard sized army i used supernatural horror as having battleshock doing the job for you helps when you dont have many models on the table.
the 5+ save might have been strong for the soup, but not for elite armys like NH, deathlords and soulblight.
and in ghb17, supernatural horror was not listed as a NH trait, it is a generic death trait....(from a fluff point of view, what on earth can be more scary for the living then fighting the spirits of the dead?)
the NH command traits has simply alot less utility and options in them.


and then you have the morngoul nerf, that i think only arrived as people where using 1-2 of them when you started to hit the 1250+ battles, but what other options do you have when the faction only have 2 units and 2 heros..........

btw this is how i experienced it as a casual NH player. i dont do turnys so i have no idea how it was there.


You can still make a Nighthaunt army and use generic Death traits/artifacts (you just can't mix and match). That is how it worked before and is still very much an option.
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Yeah, if you're playing a pitched battle, you can use the allegiance abilities for your Grand Alliance without losing the actual allegiance of your army (it's in the last paragraph of page 77 in the GHB '17). So your army could still be Nighthaunt to get Spirit Hosts and Hexwraiths as battleline, but you'd use the generic Death traits and artefacts. You still wouldn't have acess to the useful Nighthaunt traits, but you haven't lost anything from '16 (except for the general Deathless Minions nerf).
   
Made in us
Enigmatic Chaos Sorcerer




Tampa, FL

I decided for now to go with Maggotkin as I already have a Death army (Flesh-Eater Courts, weak as they might be for me) and I'm generally not a fan of hordes. Maggotkin for now will let me dabble in something more elite and meaty that I've wanted since at least October of 2016 (also way different playstyle), and I can always revisit another Death army afterwards depending on how this book is. Probably something based around Arkhan the Black since he's always interested me.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/08 14:23:33


- Wayne
Formerly WayneTheGame 
   
Made in no
Longtime Dakkanaut






Thommy H wrote:
Yeah, if you're playing a pitched battle, you can use the allegiance abilities for your Grand Alliance without losing the actual allegiance of your army (it's in the last paragraph of page 77 in the GHB '17). So your army could still be Nighthaunt to get Spirit Hosts and Hexwraiths as battleline, but you'd use the generic Death traits and artefacts. You still wouldn't have acess to the useful Nighthaunt traits, but you haven't lost anything from '16 (except for the general Deathless Minions nerf).


fair enugh, i dident bother to read page 77 as i only read rules of 1 on p76 and head straight ot the points and traits for death. the rest of the content of the book was and is of no inntrest to me.

but that move in reality solves nothing, as all it would give me is a nerfed NH army.
if i play NH allegiance but using death general traits, i can no longer summon as necros dont have NH keyword, lv up the coach for the same reason, my wound save remains nerfed but i get back the double flee and the mournghoul is still nerfed.

all in all, NH still remain nerfed in gbh17 compared to 16, and none of their problems from 16 has been solved.

so yea, for NH i only play with 16 rules, for death soup i play with 17 rules.
hopefully this changes with this new book!

darkswordminiatures.com
gamersgrass.com
Collects: Wild West Exodus, SW Armada/Legion. Adeptus Titanicus, Dust1947. 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






'Nerfed' being 'dealing with the same thing all Death factions have' while ignoring all of the new tools NH have to work with. Oh, and the mourngul isn't totally OP anymore. So sad.

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in us
Pious Palatine




 NinthMusketeer wrote:
'Nerfed' being 'dealing with the same thing all Death factions have' while ignoring all of the new tools NH have to work with. Oh, and the mourngul isn't totally OP anymore. So sad.


Nighthaunt finished highest death at Blood and Glory. They're really powerful, just super swingy and a bit finicky.


 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




fair enugh, i dident bother to read page 77 as i only read rules of 1 on p76 and head straight ot the points and traits for death. the rest of the content of the book was and is of no inntrest to me.


It is not a new rule. If you were indeed playing a Nighthaunt Allegiance in 2016, you would have been doing this exact thing.

but that move in reality solves nothing, as all it would give me is a nerfed NH army.
if i play NH allegiance but using death general traits, i can no longer summon as necros dont have NH keyword, lv up the coach for the same reason, my wound save remains nerfed but i get back the double flee and the mournghoul is still nerfed.


Allies did not exist at all in 2016. You have more list building options now than then. In 2016 you were limited to 100% Nighthaunt. Now 20% of your list can be non-nighthaunt units. You had zero options for mages before, now you have access to Soulblight and Deathlords mages (whether you go the Nighthaunt or Death traits and artifacts).

all in all, NH still remain nerfed in gbh17 compared to 16, and none of their problems from 16 has been solved.


Besides the Mourngul, things only improved for Nighthaunt (other than things that literally effect everything in Death).

so yea, for NH i only play with 16 rules, for death soup i play with 17 rules.
hopefully this changes with this new book!


So you continue to play without mages, complaining you don't have access to mages, when you could play the current rules and have mages.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/09 02:57:33


 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Texas

So I went to my local game shop this past weekend to see if I could find a box of ghouls.... no such luck. The guy at the counter mentions they got a couple old units by mistake - a Vampire lord on horseback, and Krell - which is now a Wight King w/ Black Axe. I ask if they have warscrolls (the packaging wasn't even AOS, it was the old WH Fantasy) .... he shows them to me, and then tells me about the new Nagash tome coming.

Holy crap! Pretty excited to see what is coming for Death players. I went in on a FEC starter box, but I can stick with them on skirmish games. From what I have been reading, it looks like this update has been a LONG time coming for us.

Any new rumors on units or anything like that? It seems that the 5 of the 6 factions have been figured out - not counting "generic" as a faction. Would the Tomb Kings make a showing?

No Pity! No Remorse! No fear! 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




Tomb Kings almost certainly aren't coming back. Left in a world long abandoned....

tremere47-fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to triple riptide spam  
   
Made in gb
Eternally-Stimulated Slaanesh Dreadnought





pm713 wrote:
Tomb Kings almost certainly aren't coming back. Left in a world long abandoned....


Yup, they pretty much killed off the faction in the first end times book.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/16 17:03:34


 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






Death does need a reboot and I am glad to see they are getting it

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in us
Clousseau




the Undead book (pre vampire count / tomb king split) was my first fantasy army in the long ago. Tomb Kings were a primary army of mine (I stiill have my tournament TK army from the early 00s in my bags). I'm definitely watching to see what they do with the undead. This will likely be my 2019 campaign force.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/01/16 17:37:54


 
   
 
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