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What if there was a universal rule that allows weapons to hit at maximum possible damage on a natural 6 on to wound rolls? It would only apply to weapons that had vaeiable damage characteristics.

So a lascannon would hit for 6D if you rolled a 6 to wound.

It feels very off when you critically wound something but it ends up just taking 1 damage.

No. This should not be available to everyone.

No. You want to make it easier to kill things in edition where things already die laughably easy?

I'd say talk it over with an opponent and give it a shot if you want but I think it would make the game even deadlier and probably favor IG. Armies like Orks that don't have a lot of D6 weapons (or a codex) would be at a disadvantage.

Also consider that the lowest strength d whatever weapons will always do max damage when wounding high t models.

Anything multi wound strength 5 vs a t 10 as an example.

 Lance845 wrote:
Also consider that the lowest strength d whatever weapons will always do max damage when wounding high t models.

Anything multi wound strength 5 vs a t 10 as an example.

How much multi-damage S5 stuff is there?

How much T10 stuff is there?

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:
Also consider that the lowest strength d whatever weapons will always do max damage when wounding high t models.

Anything multi wound strength 5 vs a t 10 as an example.

How much multi-damage S5 stuff is there?

How much T10 stuff is there?

Does it matter? The rules would allow for it.

 Lance845 wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:
Also consider that the lowest strength d whatever weapons will always do max damage when wounding high t models.

Anything multi wound strength 5 vs a t 10 as an example.

How much multi-damage S5 stuff is there?

How much T10 stuff is there?

Does it matter? The rules would allow for it.

It does since such weapon wont "always" be doing max damage, but only when you roll a 6?

 skchsan wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:
Also consider that the lowest strength d whatever weapons will always do max damage when wounding high t models.

Anything multi wound strength 5 vs a t 10 as an example.

How much multi-damage S5 stuff is there?

How much T10 stuff is there?

Does it matter? The rules would allow for it.

It does since such weapon wont "always" be doing max damage, but only when you roll a 6?

If they only wound on a 6 then the only damage they will ever be doing is max damage. Im just saying this rule creates a wonky situation where something like that shooting at something like a titan creates a scenario where that weapon somehow becomes better vs a titan because the damage is no longer variable. It's a flat max on the only result on the dice roll that matters.

This guy has a point. A critical mechanic in a Warhammer scale game is an aweful idea and will only slow the game down more.

 skchsan wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:
Also consider that the lowest strength d whatever weapons will always do max damage when wounding high t models.

Anything multi wound strength 5 vs a t 10 as an example.

How much multi-damage S5 stuff is there?

How much T10 stuff is there?

Does it matter? The rules would allow for it.

It does since such weapon wont "always" be doing max damage, but only when you roll a 6?

And what you need to roll to wound T10 when you have S5? Yeah that's right 6.

Albeit you can make a rule where if you need 6 to wound critical hit doesn't want.

Still biggest issue is that things are already too deadly resulting in 1-2 turn games. You want games to be 0.5 turn long?-)

 skchsan wrote:
What if there was a universal rule that allows weapons to hit at maximum possible damage on a natural 6 on to wound rolls? It would only apply to weapons that had vaeiable damage characteristics.

So a lascannon would hit for 6D if you rolled a 6 to wound.

It feels very off when you critically wound something but it ends up just taking 1 damage.

In addition to the concerns others have pointed out, I'm not sure your proposed mechanic fixes the problem you've called out. Sure, 1/4th of a marine's lascannon shots and 1/3rd of a guardsman's shots will automatically do max damage (which does weird things to the average damage output of a guardsman compared to a marine by the way), but you still haven't eliminated that chance of a feels bad moment where you only do 1 damage. You've made those moments less common, but you've only eliminated 1/3rd or 1/4th of the instances that they occur in BS 4+ and 3+ armies.

So it doesn't do a ton to address the original concern and introduces some wonky side-effects.

Wyldhunt wrote:

 skchsan wrote:
What if there was a universal rule that allows weapons to hit at maximum possible damage on a natural 6 on to wound rolls? It would only apply to weapons that had vaeiable damage characteristics.

So a lascannon would hit for 6D if you rolled a 6 to wound.

It feels very off when you critically wound something but it ends up just taking 1 damage.

In addition to the concerns others have pointed out, I'm not sure your proposed mechanic fixes the problem you've called out. Sure, 1/4th of a marine's lascannon shots and 1/3rd of a guardsman's shots will automatically do max damage (which does weird things to the average damage output of a guardsman compared to a marine by the way), but you still haven't eliminated that chance of a feels bad moment where you only do 1 damage. You've made those moments less common, but you've only eliminated 1/3rd or 1/4th of the instances that they occur in BS 4+ and 3+ armies.

So it doesn't do a ton to address the original concern and introduces some wonky side-effects.

Umm how you get 1/4? Marine hits on 3+ so 2/3*1/6=1/9 shots(assuming no hit modifiers) result in maximum damage hit. Similarly for IG trooper it's 1/2*1/6=1/12 shots. Nowhere near 1/3.

He simplified it. If marines shoot 6 times 4 hits. 1 of those 4 should be a 6. 1/4

IG hit on 4+. 6 shots. 3 hit. 1 crits. 1/3rd crit.

 Lance845 wrote:
He simplified it. If marines shoot 6 times 4 hits. 1 of those 4 should be a 6. 1/4

IG hit on 4+. 6 shots. 3 hit. 1 crits. 1/3rd crit.

But 3 hits don't average out to 1 crit. You roll 6 shots. 3 hits. Then you roll for wounds. Each 6 to wound results in crit. That's 0.5 crits. 0.5 is nowhere near 1/3 of 6 shots.

 skchsan wrote:
What if there was a universal rule that allows weapons to hit at maximum possible damage on a natural 6 on to wound rolls? It would only apply to weapons that had vaeiable damage characteristics.

So a lascannon would hit for 6D if you rolled a 6 to wound.

It feels very off when you critically wound something but it ends up just taking 1 damage.

A 6 to wound doesn't represent that you've "critically wound" something, just that it was a wound.

A 6 on the damage roll indicates that you scored a crit.

 Asmodai wrote:

 skchsan wrote:
What if there was a universal rule that allows weapons to hit at maximum possible damage on a natural 6 on to wound rolls? It would only apply to weapons that had vaeiable damage characteristics.

So a lascannon would hit for 6D if you rolled a 6 to wound.

It feels very off when you critically wound something but it ends up just taking 1 damage.

A 6 to wound doesn't represent that you've "critically wound" something, just that it was a wound.

A 6 on the damage roll indicates that you scored a crit.

Touche. This is very well put.

Then can we also take out the crit mechanisms on other weapons? Maybe they have to roll another d3 or something to get the effect off.

tneva82 wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:
He simplified it. If marines shoot 6 times 4 hits. 1 of those 4 should be a 6. 1/4

IG hit on 4+. 6 shots. 3 hit. 1 crits. 1/3rd crit.

But 3 hits don't average out to 1 crit. You roll 6 shots. 3 hits. Then you roll for wounds. Each 6 to wound results in crit. That's 0.5 crits. 0.5 is nowhere near 1/3 of 6 shots.

I agree. I was saying thats how I assume he got those numbers.

 Lance845 wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Lance845 wrote:
He simplified it. If marines shoot 6 times 4 hits. 1 of those 4 should be a 6. 1/4

IG hit on 4+. 6 shots. 3 hit. 1 crits. 1/3rd crit.

But 3 hits don't average out to 1 crit. You roll 6 shots. 3 hits. Then you roll for wounds. Each 6 to wound results in crit. That's 0.5 crits. 0.5 is nowhere near 1/3 of 6 shots.

I agree. I was saying thats how I assume he got those numbers.

Nah. I brainfarted and conflated the to-hit roll with the to-wound roll. My point stands though. If the issue being addressed is that rolling a 1 for damage with a d6 damage weapon stinks, then "critting" on a to-wound roll of 6 will only address the "feels bad" moments when you happen to roll a 6 to wound. A lascannon wounds almost everything on either a 3 or a 2. The proposed rule change only avoids the "feel bad" situation 1 out of 5 times against a marine and 1 out of 4 times against a rhino. So you don't do a ton to mitigate the feels bad, but you do cause shifts to the overall lethality of the game that might be unintentional and/or problematic.

To avoid feels bad moments, converting the d6 damage to 2d3 or or d3 + 3 or something would probably work better. Encourages a more reliable average damage instead of a swingy damage.

If the intention is not to avoid the feels bad of low damage rolls but rather to introduce crits because crits are cool, well... You'll just have to be comfortable with raising the lethality of the game. Which isn't an innately bad idea, but others have voiced reasonable concerns on the matter.

I suppose you could replace bonus damage/automatic max damage with some sort of on-crit effect. A to-wound roll of 6 with a multi-damage weapon causes a target character, monster, or vehicle to suffer a -1 to all to-hit rolls until the start of your next turn? Seems like it could get problematic fast.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 skchsan wrote:

 Asmodai wrote:

 skchsan wrote:
What if there was a universal rule that allows weapons to hit at maximum possible damage on a natural 6 on to wound rolls? It would only apply to weapons that had vaeiable damage characteristics.

So a lascannon would hit for 6D if you rolled a 6 to wound.

It feels very off when you critically wound something but it ends up just taking 1 damage.

A 6 to wound doesn't represent that you've "critically wound" something, just that it was a wound.

A 6 on the damage roll indicates that you scored a crit.

Touche. This is very well put.

Then can we also take out the crit mechanisms on other weapons? Maybe they have to roll another d3 or something to get the effect off.

Eh. I mean. You're talking about nerfing things like snipers, balefire blasts, shuriken weapons and hammerhead rail rifles. Is there any particular reason you feel those weapons need to be nerfed?