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I was recently looking through the Marine Codex and noticed that the Sternguard Vets got strategems while VVs did not so I decided to make one.

Hammer of Wrath - 1 CP
Use this strategem when a Vanguard Veteran squad with jump packs successfully charges an enemy unit but before the fight phase. Roll a d6 for each Vanguard Veteran Model within 1" of an enemy unit. On a 4+ the unit suffers a mortal wound. If a Vanguard Veteran model is within 1" of multiple units, the player may choose to allocate the d6 to any of the units within 1" but must do so before they roll.

This strategem tries to make the VV's a bit more like shock units. It's not going to help them much with blobs of cheap infantry but the MWs would prove invaluable against elite units. I was tempted to give them a bonus versus infantry and a penalty versus characters and vehicles but I wanted to keep it relatively simple.

This strategem could also be changed to apply to <Assault Squads or Vanguard Veterans> with jump packs instead to give assault marines a bit of a needed boost.

I don't know about mortal wounds just like that. A minimum squad is killing a Custodes far too often for my liking. You're right they should have a Strategem for themselves though.

A simple Autohit with a weapon they're carrying would be better. It gives more incentive to buy Power Weapons.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I don't know about mortal wounds just like that. A minimum squad is killing a Custodes far too often for my liking. You're right they should have a Strategem for themselves though.

A simple Autohit with a weapon they're carrying would be better. It gives more incentive to buy Power Weapons.

I like that suggestion but it does become problematic when equipping them with TH. The autohits allows them to effectively mulch custodes/dreadnoughts/rhinos. Although that is significantly more expensive. Are you suggesting an autohit on top of their normal attacks? Or a normal attack becomes autohits.

Plus if they're charging a custodes with nothing but chainswords they're going to get destroyed by the remaining custodes.
A possible change would be to subtract 1 from the roll if the targets toughness is greater than 4, but that seems a bit more arbitrary than I'd like.

Vilehydra wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I don't know about mortal wounds just like that. A minimum squad is killing a Custodes far too often for my liking. You're right they should have a Strategem for themselves though.

A simple Autohit with a weapon they're carrying would be better. It gives more incentive to buy Power Weapons.

I like that suggestion but it does become problematic when equipping them with TH. The autohits allows them to effectively mulch custodes/dreadnoughts/rhinos. Although that is significantly more expensive. Are you suggesting an autohit on top of their normal attacks? Or a normal attack becomes autohits.

Plus if they're charging a custodes with nothing but chainswords they're going to get destroyed by the remaining custodes.
A possible change would be to subtract 1 from the roll if the targets toughness is greater than 4, but that seems a bit more arbitrary than I'd like.

You actually bring up a fair point.

How about just an extra attack on the charge? Wouldn't be broken, but underwhelming in certain situations.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Vilehydra wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I don't know about mortal wounds just like that. A minimum squad is killing a Custodes far too often for my liking. You're right they should have a Strategem for themselves though.

A simple Autohit with a weapon they're carrying would be better. It gives more incentive to buy Power Weapons.

I like that suggestion but it does become problematic when equipping them with TH. The autohits allows them to effectively mulch custodes/dreadnoughts/rhinos. Although that is significantly more expensive. Are you suggesting an autohit on top of their normal attacks? Or a normal attack becomes autohits.

Plus if they're charging a custodes with nothing but chainswords they're going to get destroyed by the remaining custodes.
A possible change would be to subtract 1 from the roll if the targets toughness is greater than 4, but that seems a bit more arbitrary than I'd like.

You actually bring up a fair point.

How about just an extra attack on the charge? Wouldn't be broken, but underwhelming in certain situations.

Don't think an extra attack is really worth a CP though. Possibly a rampage mechanic (+1d3 attacks) if they're outnumbered. Or if the original idea is too strong for a 1 CP strategem, just make it 2 CP. Same could go for the autohit suggestion.

Vilehydra wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Vilehydra wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I don't know about mortal wounds just like that. A minimum squad is killing a Custodes far too often for my liking. You're right they should have a Strategem for themselves though.

A simple Autohit with a weapon they're carrying would be better. It gives more incentive to buy Power Weapons.

I like that suggestion but it does become problematic when equipping them with TH. The autohits allows them to effectively mulch custodes/dreadnoughts/rhinos. Although that is significantly more expensive. Are you suggesting an autohit on top of their normal attacks? Or a normal attack becomes autohits.

Plus if they're charging a custodes with nothing but chainswords they're going to get destroyed by the remaining custodes.
A possible change would be to subtract 1 from the roll if the targets toughness is greater than 4, but that seems a bit more arbitrary than I'd like.

You actually bring up a fair point.

How about just an extra attack on the charge? Wouldn't be broken, but underwhelming in certain situations.

Don't think an extra attack is really worth a CP though. Possibly a rampage mechanic (+1d3 attacks) if they're outnumbered. Or if the original idea is too strong for a 1 CP strategem, just make it 2 CP. Same could go for the autohit suggestion.

Perhaps a +1S on the charge? That doesn't feel terribly redundant and helps with the Power Weapons, though it is mostly useless with Power Fists and Thunder Hammers.

+1 Strength would be my suggestion as well; it's not totally wasted on Power Fists and Thunder Hammers as you're still getting S10 rather than S8, so pretty nifty against tougher vehicles, plus the regular marines are getting S5, so wounding on 2's versus T3 or 3's versus more elite T4.

+1 strength on the charge, but not worth it for a CP in most cases.

+1 to wound (which mirrors the sternguard strategem) for a strategem becomes pretty scary.

Vilehydra wrote:
+1 strength on the charge, but not worth it for a CP in most cases.

+1 to wound (which mirrors the sternguard strategem) for a strategem becomes pretty scary.

This is actually not a bad idea and I don't know WHY I blanked out on that.

That would also make power weapons (which is the iconic look to me of vanguard vets) more viable.