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If I webway drop shining spears in. Can I use that Saim hann stratagem that allows them to advance and then charge. Or is the advance not allowed at all because they have been webway dropped.

If you’re using the Beta rules for Matched Play, then no, you can’t. Otherwise yes.

I’m new to 8th

What’s the difference between matched play and not matched play

 JohnnyHell wrote:
If you’re using the Beta rules for Matched Play, then no, you can’t. Otherwise yes.

warpedpig wrote:
I’m new to 8th

What’s the difference between matched play and not matched play

Matched play is basically the "balanced" (some would say "proper") way to play. It has a bunch of additional restrictions on what you can and can't do. The latest FAQ says you cannot move any further, other than charge moves, in a turn you have arrived from reinforcements.

However, JohnnyHell is incorrect, this is not a "Matched play beta rule", it's a fully fledged Special Snowflake FAQ that applies to all game modes. It is found in the Rulebook FAQ. I suspect that his comment probably refers to the beta Tactical Reserves rules, which do only affect matched play and are in beta, and concern reinforcements. Naturally as I am not the author of the comment, nor has any errata been provided, I would never suggest I knew what he intended to say, only what he wrote.

Furthermore, even without this FAQ, you couldn't do what you wanted to anyway. The stratagem only allows them to charge after advancing, it doesn't let them make a move + advance. Since you Webway in at the end of the movement phase, you can't move that turn, thus can't use the stratagem. Further, Furthermore, using the stratagem is pointless because you can charge after arriving via the webway without it.

Despite the snark, yes that’s what I meant BCB. Cheers for the head check... briefer and without the snark would be even better. Jussayin... but you do you.

 BaconCatBug wrote:
Matched play is basically the "balanced" (some would say "proper") way to play.

Need citation on this.

It wouldn’t be pointless because if you could advance then you’d have six less inches to charge.

warpedpig wrote:
It wouldn’t be pointless because if you could advance then you’d have six less inches to charge.

It would be pointless because you CAN'T advance them.

"Advancing" is not "move an extra D6", it's something you do instead of moving.

BCB is correct. Advancing is an additional 6" done while moving, so Spears would make a 22" move. But as dropping in from the Webway happens at the end of the move phase, the Spears drop in and are done moving.
You don't get to advance if you don't get to move, essentially. Using the Webway IS their move, so they don't get to advance

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 skchsan wrote:

 BaconCatBug wrote:
Matched play is basically the "balanced" (some would say "proper") way to play.

Need citation on this.

Why would you need a citation for that?

So it’s just best to move them. Quicken. And advance. Then charge.

warpedpig wrote:
So it’s just best to move them. Quicken. And advance. Then charge.

Yep.

warpedpig wrote:
So it’s just best to move them. Quicken. And advance. Then charge.

Exactly - this is how you auto win games BTW. Rinse and repeat.

 Xenomancers wrote:
Exactly - this is how you auto win games BTW. Rinse and repeat.

I wouldn't call it "auto-win". it's good, but it can fail.
The first 2 games I tried Spears with had Quicken fail on the 1st attempt, even with CP reroll. That left my Spears high and dry to get shot at. Had to waste yet more CPs on Lightning Reflexes so they didn't get zapped off the table. They still got reduced to 2-3 Spears.
I also had to use Fire-n-Fade in one game after Quicken failed, wasting so many CPs
I'm not saying it isn't a really good combo, but when it fails, it feels like your opponent is throwing your basket on the ground and stomping all over your eggs.

You need to have multiple options to make sure this tactic works and be ready when it fails to pull them back. You need like your whole army's CPs dedicated to them. That's a big investment and the main reason why I hope GW doesn't raise their points cost in the next CA

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 Galef wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
Exactly - this is how you auto win games BTW. Rinse and repeat.

I wouldn't call it "auto-win". it's good, but it can fail.
The first 2 games I tried Spears with had Quicken fail on the 1st attempt, even with CP reroll. That left my Spears high and dry to get shot at. Had to waste yet more CPs on Lightning Reflexes so they didn't get zapped off the table. They still got reduced to 2-3 Spears.
I also had to use Fire-n-Fade in one game after Quicken failed, wasting so many CPs
I'm not saying it isn't a really good combo, but when it fails, it feels like your opponent is throwing your basket on the ground and stomping all over your eggs.

You need to have multiple options to make sure this tactic works and be ready when it fails to pull them back. You need like your whole army's CPs dedicated to them. That's a big investment and the main reason why I hope GW doesn't raise their points cost in the next CA

-

Yeah the 1 time I beat my friends siamhan list was when he failed literally every psychic power including a reroll on quicken- he saved his runes for fourtune when it failed and got it off - then he failed protect. it also helped that I was playing a dark eldar and aliotic flyer list - but he had 18 spears. I don't play with spears. I still only managed to kill 8 of his front line spears leaving the autarch alive and only 5 of the other unit. The next turn he nearly swung it around with the void lance autarc 1 shotting a hemlock between shooting and assault and the remain spears killing the other. 3++ saves saved them from the overwatch. The other autarch popped a raider in assault. It was looking really bad but my ravagers ended up blowing up all hs dive avengers turn 2 and the my archon gibbed his warlord (very unlikely) and eldard got off a super smite. For a game that should have been auto win after 2 pricey units were served up to me - it was sure a battle. If everything goes right for that army though it's unbeatable.

Spears do need about a 5-7 point hike. Also I think psychic denial needs to change. If you are casting buffs on a unit and I have a psyker within 24" of that unit - I should be able to deny. It's one of the main reasons this tactic is so powerful - because your psychic ranges are 18 - you will never be denied if your psykers are on jetbikes! lol.

Any suggestions on a 2000 point Saim hann fluff list. I have enough for 18 spears I also have 3 fire prisms. 9 vypers. Wave serpents. Wraith guard. All the HQ units on bikes. Hemlocks. Crimson hunters. Scorpion super heavy. Etc.

I was considering


++ Outrider Detachment +1CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [111 PL, 2001pts] ++

+ HQ +

Autarch Skyrunner [6 PL, 122pts]: 5: Mark of the Incomparable Hunter, Banshee Mask, Craftworlds Warlord, Reaper Launcher, Shuriken Pistol, Twin Shuriken Catapult

Farseer Skyrunner [7 PL, 135pts]: 2. Doom, 3. Fortune, Shuriken Pistol, Twin Shuriken Catapult, Witchblade

Warlock Skyrunner [4 PL, 70pts]: 5. Quicken/Restrain, Shuriken Pistol, Twin Shuriken Catapult, Witchblade

+ Elites +

Wraithguard [20 PL, 240pts]: Wraithcannon, 6x Wraithguard

+ Fast Attack +

Shining Spears [14 PL, 279pts]
. 8x Shining Spear: 8x Laser Lance, 8x Twin Shuriken Catapult
. Shining Spear Exarch: Laser Lance, Twin Shuriken Catapult

Vypers [12 PL, 240pts]
. Vyper: Bright Lance, Shuriken Cannon
. Vyper: Aeldari Missile Launcher, Shuriken Cannon
. Vyper: Shuriken Cannon, Starcannon

Vypers [12 PL, 240pts]
. Vyper: Bright Lance, Shuriken Cannon
. Vyper: Bright Lance, Shuriken Cannon
. Vyper: Bright Lance, Shuriken Cannon

Vypers [12 PL, 240pts]
. Vyper: Bright Lance, Shuriken Cannon
. Vyper: Bright Lance, Shuriken Cannon
. Vyper: Bright Lance, Shuriken Cannon

+ Heavy Support +

Night Spinner [8 PL, 145pts]: Crystal Targeting Matrix, Twin Shuriken Catapult

Night Spinner [8 PL, 145pts]: Crystal Targeting Matrix, Twin Shuriken Catapult

Night Spinner [8 PL, 145pts]: Crystal Targeting Matrix, Twin Shuriken Catapult

++ Super-Heavy Auxiliary Detachment (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [28 PL, 560pts] ++

+ Lord of War +

Cobra [28 PL, 560pts]: Shuriken Cannon

++ Total: [139 PL, 2561pts] ++


The idea being to make a bubble of vypers around the Autarchs for the reroll 1s. Start everything in cover. At range. Then swarm one side of the board with my superior speed. Doom the biggest threat and concentrate as much fire as needed to kill it. Then wheel round with everything. The beauty is that with such speed and range I can concentrate the full firepower of the army in one area at a time to absolutely destroy one sector of the board. I also have plenty of anti personnel firepower that can hit anywhere. And with doom. Even the doomweaver shots can cause serious damage to heavy targets.

My list would be almost immune to half their army since you can hardly catch me or get within 24” range. Anything that does will be concentrated down or charged. The wraiths can webway strike in to help kill backside targets or large threats that have a gap in bubble wrap.
Created with BattleScribe

That army starts with 5 command points and 4 if you plan on deep striking the wraithgaurd.

You Abolsutely want the relic lance on your autarc - perhaps switching up weapons on your vypers to make the points (lance and reaper launcher is a great build for him.


Other that that it's pretty straight forward zip around and blast away. command rerolls probably spent giving your vyper unit under pressure -1 to hit.

Fire prisms in my experience are much better than night spinners as well - thought the night spinners arent bad at all. I'd give this a try - looks really funn.

This is YMDC; please posts army lists in the Army List forum.

Thanks!