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Hello everyone. I have a Slaanesh and Tzeentch army I enjoy very much, but there are some rules I would like your help to get the right interpretation and your opinion.


- The impossible robe + Warp Surge. This relic adds +1 to the invulnerable save of a character. I like to put it on my Lord of Change, to grant him +3 invulnerable (+4 for being demon of tzeentch +1 for the robe). What happens when I decide to use the Warp Surge stratagem? According to the stratagem rule, the unit of demons get +1 to their invulnerable save BUT with a maximum of +3. Question is: does the stratagem apply before or after the relic? would the stratagem boost the Lord of Change invulnerable save from +4 to +3 and then the relic would boost it to +2, or would the stratagem be worthless, because the Lord of Change has a +3 invulnerable save already which cannot be further boosted?

- Smite!! : I know that the demons of Tzeench, chaos god of magic, are less proficient in smiting, than, for exemple Grey Knights, and the smite power difficulty gets increased by +1 for each successful cast. Does this apply to the smite caused by Horror's squads? For your informations, Horrors only manifest smite on a roll of 5 or 6 on a single dice.

- Warp Surge: I see in every battle report that the player choose to spend two command points and use Warp Surge stratagem whenever one of his units (normally a big demon) is chosen as a target by the other player. If we read carefully the stratagem you must choose it at the beginning of the phase , thus allowing your opponent to simply ignore your boosted demons and choose another fruitful target.

Beast of Slaanesh: Good units, single beasts that block units from fleeing combat <check>, not very expenisve <check>, ugly model by forgeworld, but easily remplaced by other beast models <check>, not bad attacking <check>, makes psykers at 12" to manifest powers at -1 <che...> hey, wait.. is it ENEMY Psykers or ALL Psykers???? After careful reading apparently it is all and everyone, included your own!! now, that sucks. For comparaison the blue horrors that you can put in a Tzeentch Chariot for 5 points make ENEMY psykers to make their psychic tests at -1.

Beast of Slaanesh and Tweentch chariots aura: It is normally accepted that auras of the same type doesn't stack, thus two beasts of slaanesh won't give a -2 to physic tests, or three tzeentch chariots won't give a -3; but do they stack if they are from different units? I mean, could I give the enemy a -1 if I move a beast of Slaanesh next to their psyker and another -1 for a Chariot for a total of -2??? Eldar tears? Just delicious.

Talking now about an Apocalypse game I'm having in october; Let's say I deploy Zarakynel LoW of Slaanesh in the army, and I have quite some PL stashed for invocations. If by any misfortune she is lasersniped to oblivion, could I invoque her to the field again (provided I stilll have the allocated freed points) even if she's a Character, a lord of War and a "one single of the kind" can be in the army? Same thing for other named characters, such as the Masque, the Changeling or the Blue Scribes.

Thank you very much. Don't hesitate to add some more of your doubts here that aren't covered in the FAQ, and perhaps we could have some arguments when these questions appear in tournaments and games.

 samus41k wrote:
Hello everyone. I have a Slaanesh and Tzeentch army I enjoy very much, but there are some rules I would like your help to get the right interpretation and your opinion.


- The impossible robe + Warp Surge. This relic adds +1 to the invulnerable save of a character. I like to put it on my Lord of Change, to grant him +3 invulnerable (+4 for being demon of tzeentch +1 for the robe). What happens when I decide to use the Warp Surge stratagem? According to the stratagem rule, the unit of demons get +1 to their invulnerable save BUT with a maximum of +3. Question is: does the stratagem apply before or after the relic? would the stratagem boost the Lord of Change invulnerable save from +4 to +3 and then the relic would boost it to +2, or would the stratagem be worthless, because the Lord of Change has a +3 invulnerable save already which cannot be further boosted?

Your misunderstanding comes with how Ephemeral Form works. It does not improve your invulnerable, so Tzeentch Daemons actually DON'T have a 4++. Ephemeral Form adds one to the saving roll. Tzeentch Daemons have a 5++ save, like all daemons, but add one to the roll. So their saves go from 5-7, or natural 4-6.
When a Lord of Change equips the Robe, his save goes from 5 to 4. When you Warp Surge, it goes from 4 to 3. Now you add one to all your rolls, so natural 2s become 3s. Nothing breaks and it's all extremely simple, legal, and not even remotely WAAC.

- Smite!! : I know that the demons of Tzeench, chaos god of magic, are less proficient in smiting, than, for exemple Grey Knights, and the smite power difficulty gets increased by +1 for each successful cast. Does this apply to the smite caused by Horror's squads? For your informations, Horrors only manifest smite on a roll of 5 or 6 on a single dice.

There is nothing to suggest anywhere that this might be the case. Horror units are unable to successfully cast Smite if it is the 3rd or higher Smite in that phase, since 7 can't be rolled on 1d6.

- Warp Surge: I see in every battle report that the player choose to spend two command points and use Warp Surge stratagem whenever one of his units (normally a big demon) is chosen as a target by the other player. If we read carefully the stratagem you must choose it at the beginning of the phase , thus allowing your opponent to simply ignore your boosted demons and choose another fruitful target.

Yes, they're cheating, or else are ignorant. It clearly states at the beginning of a phase.

And yes to the last question. You can summon (if its what you’re asking?) a character you had in your army and has died but only if it’s dead.

See it like the daemon dies and go back too the warp and another daemon on the mortal plane summons it back from the warp again. It’s really hard too do and you still need too have the spare points for it.

Thank you very much for your answers so far. You have shed A LOT of light on ephemeral form for Tzeentch, my Lord of Change has cawed in glee for his newfound 2++.. or not? Warp surge is really difficult to pull up well. I believe that everyone treat it as a theRotate Shield stratagem in an Imperial Knight.

For the character invocation, I have asked for your opinion because I had been in that situation before where I had to defend my interpretation of the ritual. I got The Mask of Slaanesh slayed and I summoned her again to the table, which caused an untold amount of salt from my opponent, who said that I couldn't have the same character twice in my army, even if he slayed the first one.

Let's see if we got some answers for the rest of the questions.