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Why is it that the birth of the other Chaos gods didn't cause the fall of the Eldar to happen earlier?
When Slaanesh was born, his/her/its birth shrieks killed or drove mad most of the Eldar.
Surely when Tzeentch was born, his would have been worse given that he is the god of psychic shenanigans. Not to mention that there were two more chaos gods, and unless the lore was changed without me knowing, they were born relatively recently in galactic history in 40k.
I apologize if this has been explained elsewhere
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/10/11 11:54:03
1500pts Kabal of the Blood Moon
200pts Order of Ash and Silver
Slaanesh was directly caused by Aeldari emotions and excess, so it's got a closer tie to it's 'parent' species.
When Khorne, Nurgle and Tzeentch were born? Well, who knows. There's at least one school of thought that they were previously 'neutral' gods, that become corrupted.
Tzeentch was a God of Hope. Khorne of Martial Honour. Nurgle of Life. As The Warp fell out of balance, the negative emotions grew, and changed the relevant entities.
Now that's not actually canon as such, just one of a number of theories.
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Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Slaanesh was directly caused by Aeldari emotions and excess, so it's got a closer tie to it's 'parent' species.
When Khorne, Nurgle and Tzeentch were born? Well, who knows. There's at least one school of thought that they were previously 'neutral' gods, that become corrupted.
Tzeentch was a God of Hope. Khorne of Martial Honour. Nurgle of Life. As The Warp fell out of balance, the negative emotions grew, and changed the relevant entities.
Now that's not actually canon as such, just one of a number of theories.
That's quite an interesting way of thinking about it. I guess none of the gods existed at one stage, but the balance thing is quite cool. It's the "from a certain point of view" thing. They might not be evil if people didn't commit evil, but in 40K it's nearly always a downward spiral.
I seem to remember it written that some gods weren't "created" in a single event, but grew with no discernible point at which they achieved consciousness. Also I've read that... once a god comes into existence, due to the vaguries of the warp, it has always existed. This is hard to understand and really messed up the time.
With Slaanesh that was very specifically based around the Eldar themselves. Their lust, pain, pleasure, hedonism was broiling in the warp as psychic waves and emotions until it achieved a point at which a new god was created, rather than just the waves and ripples.
How did the "Old Ones" and original Necrontyr influence the warp?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/10/11 13:17:29
Well, there is also a theory that the Maelstrom (which was shrinking before the recent Cataclysm) is indeed the tear caused by one of the gods birth, much like the Eye of Terror for Slaanesh. Most likely as the other 3 gods are not specifically tied to a single species (that we know of*), the aftershock of their births was not felt in a specific manner. Although the Black Plague is thought to have either been the result of Nurgle's "birth" or the cause of it
* It's entirely possible that there could have been a species directly responsible for the birth one of the other gods, but their birth completely obliterated that particular species and it was such a long time ago that no records or even hints of their existence can ever be found
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/10/11 13:39:22
the answer is in your question, you just have it the wrong way round. The birth didnt cause the fall, the fall(into depravity)of the Eldar caused the birth of the god, which then proceeded to eat their souls.
As I recall the 3rd (4th?) Necron codex pegged Nurgle after the creation of the Krok to account for their rude good health. I like to think of Mork and Gork as Tzeentch and Khorne, respectively.
real space time and warp time whilst connected don't always align
each sentient races emotions most likely created lesser powers that slowly absorbed or merged with each other to create the greater powers
where Slaanesh differs is the Eldar being the most psychic of the mortal races meant Slaanesh grew very powerful very quickly and gobbled up all the other previous beings that shared her remit, along with all the Eldar gods (bar Khaine and Clownogach) until blasting into self awareness wrecking the Eldar and causing the Eye
"AND YET YOU ACT AS IF THERE IS SOME IDEAL ORDER IN THE WORLD, AS IF THERE IS SOME...SOME RIGHTNESS IN THE UNIVERSE BY WHICH IT MAY BE JUDGED."
Turnip Jedi wrote: real space time and warp time whilst connected don't always align
each sentient races emotions most likely created lesser powers that slowly absorbed or merged with each other to create the greater powers
where Slaanesh differs is the Eldar being the most psychic of the mortal races meant Slaanesh grew very powerful very quickly and gobbled up all the other previous beings that shared her remit, along with all the Eldar gods (bar Khaine and Clownogach) until blasting into self awareness wrecking the Eldar and causing the Eye
and maybe Isha- she keeps getting mentioned as maybe being imprisoned and tortured, rather than dinner. An Avatar of Isha is looking like a distinct possibility nowadays.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/10/11 21:07:42
ChargerIIC wrote: If algae farm paste with a little bit of your grandfather in it isn't Grimdark I don't know what is.
Haighus wrote: and maybe Isha- she keeps getting mentioned as maybe being imprisoned and tortured, rather than dinner. An Avatar of Isha is looking like a distinct possibility nowadays.
Not maybe, definitely. Isha is a prisoner of Nurgle, who constantly feeds her his new diseases to test them out. She, in turn, secretly smuggles cures to those diseases to the mortal world.
Haighus wrote: and maybe Isha- she keeps getting mentioned as maybe being imprisoned and tortured, rather than dinner. An Avatar of Isha is looking like a distinct possibility nowadays.
Not maybe, definitely. Isha is a prisoner of Nurgle, who constantly feeds her his new diseases to test them out. She, in turn, secretly smuggles cures to those diseases to the mortal world.
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If it is that explicitly stated, I think it is only a matter of time till the Ishari are a faction. Perhaps that would be the Exodites, when I think about it. I can only hope!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/10/11 22:33:29
ChargerIIC wrote: If algae farm paste with a little bit of your grandfather in it isn't Grimdark I don't know what is.
Turnip Jedi wrote: real space time and warp time whilst connected don't always align
each sentient races emotions most likely created lesser powers that slowly absorbed or merged with each other to create the greater powers
where Slaanesh differs is the Eldar being the most psychic of the mortal races meant Slaanesh grew very powerful very quickly and gobbled up all the other previous beings that shared her remit, along with all the Eldar gods (bar Khaine and Clownogach) until blasting into self awareness wrecking the Eldar and causing the Eye
and maybe Isha- she keeps getting mentioned as maybe being imprisoned and tortured, rather than dinner. An Avatar of Isha is looking like a distinct possibility nowadays.
And not forgetting that now we have the newest edition to the Eldar pantheon: Ynnead. Also, how come Cegorach never got an avatar, or is there one on Forgeworld that I missed?
Given how the warp works slaanesh could quite easily been the catalyst of its own birth as after it was born is influenced the eldar to make sure it was born..... THE WARP LADIES AND GENTLEMAN.
Turnip Jedi wrote: real space time and warp time whilst connected don't always align
each sentient races emotions most likely created lesser powers that slowly absorbed or merged with each other to create the greater powers
where Slaanesh differs is the Eldar being the most psychic of the mortal races meant Slaanesh grew very powerful very quickly and gobbled up all the other previous beings that shared her remit, along with all the Eldar gods (bar Khaine and Clownogach) until blasting into self awareness wrecking the Eldar and causing the Eye
and maybe Isha- she keeps getting mentioned as maybe being imprisoned and tortured, rather than dinner. An Avatar of Isha is looking like a distinct possibility nowadays.
And not forgetting that now we have the newest edition to the Eldar pantheon: Ynnead. Also, how come Cegorach never got an avatar, or is there one on Forgeworld that I missed?
A literal daemon Harlequin may well be one of the more terrifying concepts in 40k.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/10/12 12:57:09
ChargerIIC wrote: If algae farm paste with a little bit of your grandfather in it isn't Grimdark I don't know what is.
Well if we look at ancient and polytheistic religions in history, having the fertility/life god, the war god, and the 'giver of knowledge' are all very central to many different cultures. It is not hard to imagine that such would be common to others as well. Why would Slaanesh be different? Because the idea of hedonism does not come into popularity until later; only civilizations that produce a large excess of resources and extremely specialized avenues of profession give rise to the idea of excess as Slaanesh embodies. Now there are certainly earlier versions, and similarly Slaanesh existed before the fall in a sense (within the warp time has no substance; Slaanesh both has always existed and never will exist) but due to time being very much a law in the materium I suspect his 'retroactive' influence would be limited. The latter is just my theory though.