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New to AoS, but a vet of 40k. I'm going to be collecting Bonereapers, starting with the starter box. I've been coming up with lists in advance so I can plan out my purchases.

Inevitably, one list I will be facing is an Ironjaws double battalion MSU army. I've seen it in action; 24" move at the cost of a wound, interrupt charge, +1 rend, +1 wound, fight in Hero phase and melee phase. Don't know specifics, but he has at least 40-50 Ard Boyz, 2-3 Destroyers, and 2 Warchantas.

I'm looking through the book, but I'm not seeing anything that can reliably and efficiently deal with this list. The guy with the list (great guy, tough player but always gives advice to his opponents on what to do next time) suggested throwing Deathriders at them and having the rest hold out as long as they can on objectives. However, that doesn't seem fun and I don't feel like praying to Nagash that I could hold out long enough to win (I don't feel it would be guaranteed).

Any suggestions on what I could bring to help against their list?

Mortek guard bubble wrapping two harvesters. When a mortek guard dies, pull a model within 3" of both harvesters and you get two 4+ rolls to bring it back. Statistically you can survive an infinite amount of damage to the mortek guard that way, forcing him to shoot/magic the harvesters to death first. He'll need arrowboyz to do that, which will take away from his front line melee.

Coming back to this, I've figured out a good chunk of the list:

He takes Gordrakk, one Megaboss on Maw-Crusha, and two basic Ardfist battalions.

I've only watched him play, never have gone up against the list myself, so I'm not sure what relics he takes, but he's able to move his Ardboys 24" consistently. I think he's able to charge after. I'm pretty sure his Maw-Crusha and Gordrakk have fast 'un, as I've seen them across the board turn 2-3.

I'm not seeing anything in the Ossiarch units that can deal with these. It seems like the only battleplan is just to hold onto as many objectives as possible, possibly using the Mortek Guard bubble and two Harvesters as listed above, and just throw things in the way. I'm not seeing anything else that can be done against that list though.

Bar an errata, mortek + double harvester will literally take all the damage he deals with next to no casualties, guaranteed, every single time. Note that damage is allocated one at a time, so even if he deals 40 damage at once it doesn't matter. You put one damage on a guy, he dies, you roll two dice and bring a dead model back for each 4+. You allocate the second damage, he dies, roll two dice... Essentially kill & revive the same model 40 times, or 20, or 69, or however much he deals. Then you swing back.

Errata is up!

You now only get to roll one dice, regardless of how many harvesters are in range.

Yeah, so that option is taken out. Any other suggestions? Or am I pretty much just going to have to throw units in the way and pray to Nagash that the rest of the list can survive/hold objectives long enough?

Petrifex Elite trait, Mortek Shield Corps battalion to get an extra relic, a free Shield-wall per turn and a bonus RDP per battle-round. The Shield-Corp needs everything your army should have already, 3x Mortek Guard + a wizard. For the relic, I like Helm of the Ordained on a Liege Kavalos for a huge offensive bonus to your army.

The Gothizzar Harvesters are nerfed, but still a strong piece of the army. Petrifex Elite and rerolling saves on Mortek Guard will help you weather the storm. Then, you have the powerful Bludgeon Command ability avalible for when you punch back. Unlike a lot of other command abilities, you don't need to use Bludgeon before the unit fights, allowing you to pick full-health units as they're fighting to benefit from additional -1 rend on their weapons.

Morghasts with Halberds, precision-stance Necropolis Stalkers and Immortis Guard will punch back with -3 rend that not even 'Ard Boyz get an armor save against.

Let your Morteks eat damage, but have them in big enough squads to survive one unit trying to murder you so the Ironjawz player can't just chain "Smashing and Bashing" on you. Small units benefit the Ironjawz player.

Put the Morteks up front, everything a safe distance behind them.

 Stux wrote:
Errata is up!

You now only get to roll one dice, regardless of how many harvesters are in range.

And thank goodness for that.

The tactic does, however, remain the same. You will need to do petrifax elite for the extra save and use shield wall on them every turn. This gives them a 4+ re-rollable against rend -1 (which is most of his attacks) that negates 3/4 of his damage output right off the bat. You then get your deathless minions 6+ roll, then finally a 4+ to recover a model every time one dies (and every time an enemy model dies within 3" of the harvesters as well). While not guaranteed you will still be able to weather huge amounts of offense with ease.

Gordrakk and the Megaboss on Maw-Crusha each have fly. Each on average kill a harvester in a single charge with their chain

Meaning I will have to be absolutely perfect with positioning or the Destructive bulk and On The Rampage will have them kill a Harvester and then the 20 man Mortek Guard squad protecting it after.

Or does Fly not work the same as 40k?

EDIT: I do want to thank you all for your help thus far. You've helped me realize that those Mortek Guard with a Harvester can weather most of the opponents list easily. I did the (dice) math and, on a "good" average (average rounded up), a single 20man blob of Morteks supported by a Harvester would require the use of most of, if not all of, this guy's list, if starting with the Morteks.

However, this guy I'll one day be going against is really good. I'd dare say that if it wasn't for the pressures of his job, he could go to tournaments. Like, the only time I've seen him lose with his list was due to poor dice rolls and an opposing list that could throw mortal wounds like no tomorrow. He's good enough to know that he would need to take out the Harvesters first. With the two tough units with Fly, I don't see any way to prevent him from bypassing the Morteks and going straight to the Harvester other than absolute perfect positioning.

I can guarantee that he'll use one or both of those big flyers to hold key objectives, forcing me to try to take them, and then using the flyers to kill the Harvesters and Morteks in one fell swoop.

I'm trying to prepare myself for that game, and trying to figure out a way around everything he can throw at me. I'm just drawing up a lot of blanks on my end at the moment.

You need to make a bulwark around the harvester so there is literally no possible way for the models to get within attacking range. This will work out as a long U when you move them forward, leaving a gap that the harvester can move through. By making the U too narrow for the massive maw-crusha base to fit into you ensure he must land outside of it, and by putting .5" (or 1.5" should he be using the 2" range weapon option) between the harvester and the line of mortek you ensure that when he engages the guard he still cannot attack the harvesters. Also remember that when a model dies & comes back you don't have to put it back in the same spot; once the maw-crushers are engaged you can pull morteks from the back and return them to life up front so they can then swing. Orruks do not have any means to retreat & charge. I think you will be surprised how easy this is to achieve in practice, the tactic is essentially a ranged damage check for your opponent. Also note that instead of bringing mortek guard back the harvester can heal itself instead.

I wouldn't worry too much about objectives the first two rounds; your goal is to outlast him.



Also, there is another option you can do against his list specifically. Bring four blobs of 40 mortek guard (160 in total), take crematorians, and throw them all forwards. He'll be dead by round 4.

Come to think of it that works against a lot of armies...