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+++ New Roster (Warhammer 40,000 9th Edition) +++

++ Outrider Detachment -3CP (Imperium - Adeptus Astartes - Dark Angels) [103 PL, 12CP, 1,990pts] ++

+ Configuration +

**Chapter Selection**: Dark Angels

Battle Size [12CP]: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points)

Detachment Command Cost [-3CP]

Ravenwing Outrider Detachment [3CP]

+ No Force Org Slot +

Ravenwing Apothecary [6 PL, 115pts]: Bolt pistol, Chapter Command: Chief Apothecary, Frag & Krak grenades
Black Knight Bike: Plasma Talon

Ravenwing Champion [4 PL, 70pts]: Bolt pistol, Frag & Krak grenades, Master-crafted power sword, The Burning Blade
Black Knight Bike: Plasma Talon

+ HQ +

Sammael [8 PL, 150pts]: 4-6. Master of Manoeuvre, Bolt pistol, Frag & Krak grenades, Master-crafted plasma cannon, Raven Sword, Twin storm bolter, Warlord

+ Elites +

Ravenwing Black Knights [12 PL, 225pts]
Ravenwing Black Knight: Bolt pistol, Corvus Hammer, Frag & Krak grenades, Plasma Talon
Ravenwing Black Knight: Bolt pistol, Corvus Hammer, Frag & Krak grenades, Plasma Talon
Ravenwing Black Knight: Bolt pistol, Corvus Hammer, Frag & Krak grenades, Plasma Talon
Ravenwing Black Knight: Bolt pistol, Corvus Hammer, Frag & Krak grenades, Plasma Talon
Ravenwing Huntmaster: Bolt pistol, Frag & Krak grenades, Plasma Talon, Power sword

Ravenwing Black Knights [12 PL, 225pts]
Ravenwing Black Knight: Bolt pistol, Corvus Hammer, Frag & Krak grenades, Plasma Talon
Ravenwing Black Knight: Bolt pistol, Corvus Hammer, Frag & Krak grenades, Plasma Talon
Ravenwing Black Knight: Bolt pistol, Corvus Hammer, Frag & Krak grenades, Plasma Talon
Ravenwing Black Knight: Bolt pistol, Corvus Hammer, Frag & Krak grenades, Plasma Talon
Ravenwing Huntmaster: Bolt pistol, Frag & Krak grenades, Plasma Talon, Power sword

+ Fast Attack +

Invader ATV Squad [12 PL, 245pts]
Invader ATV: Bolt pistol, Onslaught Gatling Cannon, Twin auto bolt rifle
Invader ATV: Bolt pistol, Multi-melta, Twin auto bolt rifle
Invader ATV: Bolt pistol, Onslaught Gatling Cannon, Twin auto bolt rifle

Invader ATV Squad [12 PL, 245pts]
Invader ATV: Bolt pistol, Onslaught Gatling Cannon, Twin auto bolt rifle
Invader ATV: Bolt pistol, Multi-melta, Twin auto bolt rifle
Invader ATV: Bolt pistol, Onslaught Gatling Cannon, Twin auto bolt rifle

Invader ATV Squad [12 PL, 245pts]
Invader ATV: Bolt pistol, Onslaught Gatling Cannon, Twin auto bolt rifle
Invader ATV: Bolt pistol, Multi-melta, Twin auto bolt rifle
Invader ATV: Bolt pistol, Onslaught Gatling Cannon, Twin auto bolt rifle

Ravenwing Darkshroud [7 PL, 130pts]: Heavy bolter

Storm Speeder Hammerstrike [9 PL, 170pts]: Hammerstrike missile launcher, 2x Krakstorm Grenade Launcher, Melta destroyer

Storm Speeder Hammerstrike [9 PL, 170pts]: Hammerstrike missile launcher, 2x Krakstorm Grenade Launcher, Melta destroyer

++ Total: [103 PL, 12CP, 1,990pts] ++

Not sure yet what constitutes a "Ravenwing Bike Squad" for the purposes of the Detachement ObSec ability - I was working on my Combi-wing and started thinking outside the box. In the Invaders, Black Knights or both get ObSec this could be fun. Park the ATV's on 3 objectives, Dakka all comers, Use the Black Knights for counter charges. Maraud with the two Melta Speeders protected by the Darkshroud, and the three characters can run around being annoying. I'm going to assume they need to be bikes themselves but I took a break from trying to squeeze DW and RW and went all one or the other and this turned into something weirdly mesmerizing. If the Invaders don't count, well I'd go back to DW/RW together which I will anyway - but here I'd probably doubleDet with speeders in one, bikes in another. I like making the new speeders kind of scary. And I like the high levels of plasma the Black Knights would be bringing. Rule of 3 and limit three prevents doing much with Outriders at this points level. Its half your FA slots (in single Det) but less than a quarter of your points.
Which could start to look like this....

+++ New Roster (Warhammer 40,000 9th Edition) +++

++ Outrider Detachment -3CP (Imperium - Adeptus Astartes - Dark Angels) ++

+ Configuration +

**Chapter Selection**: Dark Angels

Battle Size: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points)

Detachment Command Cost

Ravenwing Outrider Detachment

+ HQ +

Sammael: 4-6. Master of Manoeuvre, Warlord

+ Fast Attack +

Invader ATV Squad
Invader ATV: Onslaught Gatling Cannon
Invader ATV: Multi-melta
Invader ATV: Onslaught Gatling Cannon

Invader ATV Squad
Invader ATV: Onslaught Gatling Cannon
Invader ATV: Multi-melta
Invader ATV: Onslaught Gatling Cannon

Invader ATV Squad
Invader ATV: Onslaught Gatling Cannon
Invader ATV: Multi-melta
Invader ATV: Onslaught Gatling Cannon

Outrider Squad: Outrider Sgt
2x Outrider: 2x Astartes Chainsword, 2x Frag & Krak grenades, 2x Heavy Bolt Pistol, 2x Twin Bolt rifle

Outrider Squad: Outrider Sgt
2x Outrider: 2x Astartes Chainsword, 2x Frag & Krak grenades, 2x Heavy Bolt Pistol, 2x Twin Bolt rifle

Outrider Squad: Outrider Sgt
2x Outrider: 2x Astartes Chainsword, 2x Frag & Krak grenades, 2x Heavy Bolt Pistol, 2x Twin Bolt rifle

++ Outrider Detachment -3CP (Imperium - Adeptus Astartes - Dark Angels) ++

+ Configuration +

**Chapter Selection**

Detachment Command Cost

+ HQ +

Lieutenant(s)
Ravenwing Talonmaster

+ Fast Attack +

Ravenwing Darkshroud: Heavy bolter

Storm Speeder Hammerstrike

Storm Speeder Hammerstrike

++ Total: [95 PL, 9CP, 1,965pts] ++

Hey, this seems intresting, however, the obsec rules apply only for regular bikes. I've been playing with two separate detachment (one for speeder, other for bikes). Also, I think that your list could use more assets from objective point of view. The new and shiny primaris models are more expensive, and even Black Knights are suprisingly fragile. Maybe more bodies, as regular marines, could be useful.

Both Bike Squads and Outrider Squads get ObSec from the Ravenwing Outrider detachment, but not ATVs or Attack Bikes or anything else.

I think mixing your ATV squads with different weapons is a mistake. If you insist on running that many ATVs, at least put all the meltas in one unit to increase efficiency. In fact, I would run 2 units of MM ones and one unit of Gatling ones. Personally I think losing the ability to be revived by the Apothecary killed their competitive usefulness or at least severely hamstrung them, as they are already lacking CORE.

Second list is definitely better and would be fun to play for sure!

Also, you should always make your talonmaster (if included in lists) your warlord and take brilliant strategist. Master of maneuver is just so meh.

 skchsan wrote:
Also, you should always make your talonmaster (if included in lists) your warlord and take brilliant strategist. Master of maneuver is just so meh.

Yeah, that's some tweaking I'll do after I finally get my book.

I like the ATV's (At this point in theorycrafting) for sitting on objectives thus the two Gats and one MM. This was really just done to take a break from trying to fit one RW and DW Det into a single army as a palette cleanser sort of thing.

I personally prefer regular bikers over outriders, as they seem more pts efficient, but ymmv

Vulshra wrote:
I personally prefer regular bikers over outriders, as they seem more pts efficient, but ymmv

Regular bikes may be cheaper per model, but the big selling point for bikes is not being 3 and only 3, with some residual value for special weapons bombs and attached Attack Bikes before dropping into mathhammer things like 3W/4W vs D2/D3 weapons.

Efficiency is pretty much a wash. 150 points of Outriders gets you 19 chainsword attacks on the charge, 150 points of No Frills Bikers gets you 16 - 150 points of Outriders gets you 12 Bolt Rifles, 150 points of (No Frills) Bikers gets you 20 Bolt Guns. As a basic rule for myself I generally agree as I hate 3 and only 3 units. Eliminators, Outriders, etc. They should all be 3, upgrade to 5 at the least or 10. If for no other reason than my eye twitches when I try and divide 100 Space Marines by 3 (and 6) man squads.

The other benefit to regular bikes here is indirect but a result of increased squad size. Unless you want to pay 3CP to Double Det (GW still can't get that right) you've got 6FA slots in the matching (Outrider/Vanguard) Det and the 3 and only 3 limit on Outriders chews up a FOC slot faster than it chews up points. 3 Outrider squads can make it hard to efficiently spend 2,000 points in a single Det. Especially if your other three FA slots are the Darkshroud+2 Hammerstrikes that's REALLY getting stuck in my brain.

On of the things I wish they would have kept was the old Ravenwing Squadron 6 bikes, an Attack Bike, and a Land Speeder Of Some Sort that deployed as one, but fought as 3 units. (similar to how Lieutenants do now you place both Lieutenants from 1 FOC at the same time, but they're independent of each other) A Primaris Ravenwing Squadron with 6 Outriders, 1 Invader ATV and one -Strike speeder would chew a lot of points for one FOC but it would be somewhat fluffy (assuming most of us are correct and the DA-Hates-Primaris fluff is just a stall until they finish retooling the product line/units to cover Chapter flavor) and fun.

Vulshra wrote:
I personally prefer regular bikers over outriders, as they seem more pts efficient, but ymmv

One advantage bikers have over outriders as of rules now is that they can take up to 3 special weapons (1 of which is combi). While this significantly bumps your ppm, if this is what you need, then you have that option.

Bare biker vs outrider, outriders are a bit more point efficient.