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Made in us
Steadfast Grey Hunter






Restrictions are loosening over here and with the new codex drop i'm expecting at least a DE player or two. Never played against them before and with all this talk of them being op, I just need to be filled in on what they do. List building is not needed, I'm a casual player (yes really). The raider is being mentioned a lot, and their troops wreck in cc apparently. But I need to know how and why.

Primaris fanboy: "NO, you can't just give old marines 2W, they're supposed to be squatted!" GW: "Heavy Bolters go brrrrrrrr"
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

If the argument for their uniqueness is spamming Wulfen and Thunderwolves, then it wasn't really a unique army to begin with whether you like it or not.
nervous sweating
Regal Hunt, A custom space wolf army: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/774993.page#10435681 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Assuming you're facing a reasonable casual list (IE: no DT flamer spam in play):

They're fast. More than anything else, mobility is a key to their play. From Battle Round 2 onward the entire army can advance and charge. They'll either play cagey and whittle you down with high quality shots, or rush you with extremely lethal, albeit somewhat fragile, melee units that will absolutely ruin your day. Both via volume of attacks and quality of attacks. Incubi are dedicated MEQ+ killers, while Wyches and Mandrakes absolutely obliterate GEQ-ish targets. Succubi, Drazhar and certain Archon builds are absolute blenders and will kill generally whatever they get into (barring things like 30-man horde units).

If you expect to be able to wander into the midboard and settle down, you're going to have a terrible day.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/12 22:51:23


 
   
Made in us
Steadfast Grey Hunter






Are Incubi deadly because of D2. what's the Flamer spam thing. Would a stormshield spam help mitigate the damage? (I run a ton of WG, TWC,wulfen dreads). Would a Zulu Bull Horn charge lead me to glory?

Primaris fanboy: "NO, you can't just give old marines 2W, they're supposed to be squatted!" GW: "Heavy Bolters go brrrrrrrr"
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

If the argument for their uniqueness is spamming Wulfen and Thunderwolves, then it wasn't really a unique army to begin with whether you like it or not.
nervous sweating
Regal Hunt, A custom space wolf army: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/774993.page#10435681 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Jimbobbyish wrote:
Are Incubi deadly because of D2.


They hit on 2s, wound MEQs on 3s (2s with Drazhar), and you'll at best have a 6+ save against them. They do D3 and AP -4 on 6s to wound. They can also make you fight last.

 Jimbobbyish wrote:
what's the Flamer spam thing.


A specific interaction within a Coven subfaction that turns them into S4, AP2, D2 with a +1 to wound.

 Jimbobbyish wrote:
Would a stormshield spam help mitigate the damage? (I run a ton of WG, TWC,wulfen dreads).


It will make life harder on your opponent for sure, but a smart Drukhari player is just going to put their darklight weapons into those harder targets. Lances doing a minimum 4 damage means every failed save is a dead wolf rider.

 Jimbobbyish wrote:
Would a Zulu Bull Horn charge lead me to glory?


Against an inexperienced Drukhari player, if you can catch them out and slam them before they slam you, maybe. Against one that knows their army, you're just not fast enough.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




SW are the best marines against DE, because they have access to cheap screens the other chapters don't in the form of the wolves.

Thunderwolves etc are terrible vs DE, the problem with DE is they trade up. The way to beat a faction that relies on trading up is either not to give them targets to trade up into, or to take units so hard to kill that trading up into them doesn't actually win the game. Generic Space Marines have neither, which is why DE rolls them so hard. Space Wolves don't have anything hard enough to take the punch, but they do have wolves, so they can put some cheap units on the table that can't be traded up into. SW are still at a disadvantage vs DE - everybody is - but the disadvantage is probably the least of any of the marine varieties.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Great advice from Sterling so far. If I were sitting across from space wolves with my drukhari, I'd basically ask myself whether or not you have any run-forward-and-charge units. If you do, I'm probably going to deploy safely away from you, whittle you down for a turn if I think I can afford it, and then pounce on your scariest, most in-my-face thing on turn 1 or 2 with both shooting and my eff-you melee units.

Generally speaking, drukhari are great at playing the distance game and picking off isolated enemy units. So if you have a first wave of T-cav, a second wave of dreadnaughts, and some backfield fire support, I'm going to keep my distance, hug the board edges, and try to keep those waves separate from each other while I whittle them down.

Our basic guns wound non-vehicles on a 4+ regardless of toughness meaning your T-Cav make excellent targets for our most common weapons. Storm Shields do make splinters pretty inefficient at taking you out, but we also have disintegrators or even dark lances that will kill you t-cavs pretty cost effectively.

Against your dreadnaughts, we'll be relying on dark lances, blasters, heat lances, and maybe haywire blasters. Ask your opponent which units have those weapons before the game. If your opponent didn't bring a lot of them, you might be able to give him a hard time by focusing on killing those weapons early.

Our biggest weakness is that we die pretty easily when you put shots into us, BUT we also have some non-obvious defensive tricks that can help us to negate your attacks against us. For instance, all of our vehicles have 5+ invuln saves. So while shooting a raider or venom with a lascannon isn't a bad idea, plan around us ignoring 1/3rd of your succesful to-wound rolls when deciding how much firepower you need. We have a strat that can give one of our units a -1 to being hit for the remainder of the phase, so if you're obviously planning to put all of your shots into a certain unit, expect it to suddenly become -1 to hit. One of our basic troops has a 4+ invulnerable save in the fight phase and the ability to prevent your units from falling back. So even though you'll probably beat them in melee in the long run, you might find your power weapons hitting less hard than expected and spend more turns than you intended stuck in one spot.

I think the thing a SW (or Blood Angel) player could do that I would find the most frustrating to deal with would be to simply keep your units (especially your forward units) close enough to each other to retaliate when I try to commit to the attack. If I spend more than one turn hiding in my backfield, I basically lose the game thanks to objectives. But if I go full throttle and try to murder your whole army on turn 2, there's a good chance I'll leave too many survivors and end up getting murderized on your following turn. Remember, we die when you attack us. Keep your dudes spaced to utilize Heroic Intervention and Counter-Offensive. Use Auspex Scan if you get the chance. Try to hold onto board control, and be ready to make us pay for any big offensive pushes we make.

Hope that helps. Happy gaming!


ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
Made in fr
Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'






Special Sw heroic intervention is how you can win, but it is not easy to set up against DE. If you face many DT liquefiers you have 0 chance of winning though, but you being a casual player that should not be the case.

Do you know the skill level you will be facing?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/13 07:25:09


Ere we go ere we go ere we go
Corona Givin’ Umies Da good ol Krulpin they deserve huh huh 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

Well, I'd have a look into the top-ranked Drukhari lists at 40stats.com.
You can expect lots of infantry paired with fast moving units.
Wyches and Incubi are decent in cc and at the end of the day will own your close-quarter fighters if they come close.
You can also expect several Raiders that transport their cargo into your face.

Former moderator 40kOnline

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Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Wyldhunt wrote:

Generally speaking, drukhari are great at playing the distance game and picking off isolated enemy units. So if you have a first wave of T-cav, a second wave of dreadnaughts, and some backfield fire support, I'm going to keep my distance, hug the board edges, and try to keep those waves separate from each other while I whittle them down.


To expand on this a bit, 9th edition Drukhari have effectively no reliance on aura support for their shooting. Their heavy hitters are either non-CORE or inside transports. Their efficiency gains come from innate rules and subfaction specific bonuses. This means they don't need to huddle up around a character or other unit to retain their shooting output, and are arguably the best skirmishing army in 40k right now. They *want* to be on the move and circling you to find the weak points in your formations to exploit. You can't just snipe out a support character and watch their order of battle collapse.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/13 14:00:29


 
   
Made in us
Steadfast Grey Hunter






Wyldhunt wrote:

Generally speaking, drukhari are great at playing the distance game and picking off isolated enemy units. So if you have a first wave of T-cav, a second wave of dreadnaughts, and some backfield fire support, I'm going to keep my distance, hug the board edges, and try to keep those waves separate from each other while I whittle them down.
That's all I got lol


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 addnid wrote:
Special Sw heroic intervention is how you can win, but it is not easy to set up against DE. If you face many DT liquefiers you have 0 chance of winning though, but you being a casual player that should not be the case.

Do you know the skill level you will be facing?
I started playing late 2018, and only played 2 tournaments (~20 games total) because that's what everyone was focused on. But even then it didn't feel like i was playing against "that guy" or try hards. I will say my first game ever was against a large Knight / SM soup with centurion death star being revived by a medic... that was an experience lol.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Are DT liquefiers the flamers mentioned earlier? I had comically bad experiences with eldar flamers. I am stacking fight last and no overwatch abilities too so maybe i have an edge. Thanks for the help guys.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I should clarify that even though I played nothing but tournament matches, I didn't get gud.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/05/13 18:04:45


Primaris fanboy: "NO, you can't just give old marines 2W, they're supposed to be squatted!" GW: "Heavy Bolters go brrrrrrrr"
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

If the argument for their uniqueness is spamming Wulfen and Thunderwolves, then it wasn't really a unique army to begin with whether you like it or not.
nervous sweating
Regal Hunt, A custom space wolf army: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/774993.page#10435681 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





 Jimbobbyish wrote:
Wyldhunt wrote:

Generally speaking, drukhari are great at playing the distance game and picking off isolated enemy units. So if you have a first wave of T-cav, a second wave of dreadnaughts, and some backfield fire support, I'm going to keep my distance, hug the board edges, and try to keep those waves separate from each other while I whittle them down.
That's all I got lol

Don't sweat it too much. As I said before, keeping things close enough together to support each other will make it much harder for the drukhari player to engage you the way he wants. If he doesn't dive into your lines, he'll lose on board control. If he does attack your lines all at once, you'll lose a bunch of stuff and then hopefully kill even more points worth of his stuff. Drukhari generally try to dissect your army and lockdown your offense on the turn they dive in. They don't like getting hit back. Ignoring OW and forcing fights last should both be helpful in that regard. Consider reversing the formation I described above: put your infantry out front with dreads and T-cav behind them ready to counter-charge whatever he sends to kill your infantry off of objectives. It also might be worth considering putting a couple units into strategic reserves; drukhari hate getting alpha struck, and units coming in from the board edges will make them less comfortable trying to surround you.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Are DT liquefiers the flamers mentioned earlier? I had comically bad experiences with eldar flamers. I am stacking fight last and no overwatch abilities too so maybe i have an edge. Thanks for the help guys.

Liquifiers are the drukhari version of a flamer mentioned above, yes. The main unit to utilize them is a troop choice called "wracks." Despite being T4 or 5 (there's a character that makes them T5 with an aura), they're actually reasonably squishy. They'll try to use their liquifiers while sitting safely inside a transport, but they'll still have to get close to you to use them. So if you're really worried about them, consider making their transport a priority target. They die fast enough once you have them out of the boat.

Oh, and remember to stand in cover. Splinters and liquifiers actually kind of care whether or not you're benefitting from light cover, and only a single subfaction can reliably ignore light cover.


ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
 
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