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Made in us
Calculating Commissar




pontiac, michigan; usa

Back in the day when models were low tier competitively, gw seemed to lack an idea of how to work with them aesthetically and some armies had models and maybe rules even 8 years old. The entire model line was metal ot much of it was just terrible meanwhile gw would randomly fix things that didnt need the fixing as bad perhaps because the old model was bought enough anyway.

Anyway different editions have changed things and I'm seeing some factions that used to be stupidly OP in 7th like tau which were played frequently enough and got some huge battlesuits units and a million broken things. Now however tau are trash again and nobody wants to touch em. The opposite happened with dark eldar where in 7th you'd be nuts to try esp vs tau in 7th ed which was almost always a free win to the tau player. In 8th and 9th we've reached a point where we're one of the strongest armies and every game being played at my local flgs had a dark eldar player in it and I think they all won too.

I think the other thing is how much attention GW gives to a faction. Sisters were treated the worst outside of maybe 4 years ago. Now supposedly their army is tough and strong, they get new models and units and they get books, animated reveals that make them look cool and more. I dont think ive seen gw put this much effort into a faction aside from space marines.

This leads me to yet another possibility. Would space marines be that popular if they didnt have a million model and unit releases, constant poster boy celebrity in the universe and in the lore as well as tending to get more attention, love and OP faction books with OP units and gear?

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Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





 flamingkillamajig wrote:
Back in the day when models were low tier competitively, gw seemed to lack an idea of how to work with them aesthetically and some armies had models and maybe rules even 8 years old. The entire model line was metal ot much of it was just terrible meanwhile gw would randomly fix things that didnt need the fixing as bad perhaps because the old model was bought enough anyway.

My second edition (yet still current) phoenix lord models and various aspect warriors say hi.


Anyway different editions have changed things and I'm seeing some factions that used to be stupidly OP in 7th like tau which were played frequently enough and got some huge battlesuits units and a million broken things. Now however tau are trash again and nobody wants to touch em. The opposite happened with dark eldar where in 7th you'd be nuts to try esp vs tau in 7th ed which was almost always a free win to the tau player. In 8th and 9th we've reached a point where we're one of the strongest armies and every game being played at my local flgs had a dark eldar player in it and I think they all won too.

I mean, that's just the ebb and flow of codex creep. When a new book comes out and is OP, more people want to play them. Some of those people might be bandwagoners chasing the meta. Others might have had the army for years but didn't enjoy getting curb-stomped with the previous underpowered rules. Basically, factions get stronger and weaker over time, and there are reasons players tend to not enjoy playing underpowered factions.


I think the other thing is how much attention GW gives to a faction. Sisters were treated the worst outside of maybe 4 years ago. Now supposedly their army is tough and strong, they get new models and units and they get books, animated reveals that make them look cool and more. I dont think ive seen gw put this much effort into a faction aside from space marines.

To be fair, drukhari's 5th edition release was really well-supported. They redid the entire line (excepting some named characters and units that were dropped), released videos talking up the model design process, etc. It's rare to get that big of an overhaul but it does happen. In the case of sisters, the entire line was pewter (I think they completely skipped the finecast years) and very old. I imagine they kind of had to update everything or you'd end up with the sleek new plastic sisters standing next to ancient repentia etc.


This leads me to yet another possibility. Would space marines be that popular if they didnt have a million model and unit releases, constant poster boy celebrity in the universe and in the lore as well as tending to get more attention, love and OP faction books with OP units and gear?

Welcome to the age-old argument. Non-marine players complain about marines being oversupported. Someone points out that marines get as much support as they do because they sell so well. Someone else points out that they might not sell so well if they weren't constantly being pushed by advertising and box sets or that other factions might sell better if they got an update. Like, you're getting into the game, you go to look at models in the store, and you check out your HQ options. Do you want one of the dozen new plastic marine characters that came out in the last year or so, or do you want to buy 2nd edition Karandras whose hat is taller than he is?


ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
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Waaagh! Ork Warboss




Italy

 flamingkillamajig wrote:


This leads me to yet another possibility. Would space marines be that popular if they didnt have a million model and unit releases, constant poster boy celebrity in the universe and in the lore as well as tending to get more attention, love and OP faction books with OP units and gear?


I've always thought BIG NO, but of course it's just speculation.

It's true that a large fraction of players choose an army that works, not one that looks good or is strong in the lore. It's also true that cheaper armies (made from starters or elite oriented ones) are appealing for someone. And many others avoid armies that don't work very well or are too expensive, regardless of how the models look or their lore.

 
   
Made in it
Shas'la with Pulse Carbine





 flamingkillamajig wrote:
Back in the day when models were low tier competitively, gw seemed to lack an idea of how to work with them aesthetically and some armies had models and maybe rules even 8 years old. The entire model line was metal ot much of it was just terrible meanwhile gw would randomly fix things that didnt need the fixing as bad perhaps because the old model was bought enough anyway.

Anyway different editions have changed things and I'm seeing some factions that used to be stupidly OP in 7th like tau which were played frequently enough and got some huge battlesuits units and a million broken things. Now however tau are trash again and nobody wants to touch em. The opposite happened with dark eldar where in 7th you'd be nuts to try esp vs tau in 7th ed which was almost always a free win to the tau player. In 8th and 9th we've reached a point where we're one of the strongest armies and every game being played at my local flgs had a dark eldar player in it and I think they all won too.

I think the other thing is how much attention GW gives to a faction. Sisters were treated the worst outside of maybe 4 years ago. Now supposedly their army is tough and strong, they get new models and units and they get books, animated reveals that make them look cool and more. I dont think ive seen gw put this much effort into a faction aside from space marines.

This leads me to yet another possibility. Would space marines be that popular if they didnt have a million model and unit releases, constant poster boy celebrity in the universe and in the lore as well as tending to get more attention, love and OP faction books with OP units and gear?

Just to nitpick: Tau are still one of the most popular factions in terms of sales, despite the low number of tournament participants. A lot of newcomers that join the hobby start Tau just because of the battlesuits, rules are not a consideration they make when they choose which faction to start. Source: hearsay from multiple FLGS owners I know.
Armies with a very distinct look have more chances to be more popular than others. Also having good looking models and not too many resin or 20+ years old kits helps, as older kits don't compare too well with the newer ones in terms of details and quality.

That is re: popularity for a newcomer. Popularity for players already into the hobby depends a bit more on rules: when some faction receives broken rules, kits go out of stock for months. Meta-chasing drives sales, no doubt.


 
   
Made in gb
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend





Port Carmine

I would assume that, in the short-term, rules affect an army's popularity, but model releases and range refreshes (or the lack thereof) have the most profound impact, particularly over an extended period.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/06/21 07:26:30


VAIROSEAN LIVES! 
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





really the only army that showed a MASSSIVE popularity boost with new minis that we know of for sure was sisters of battle. And thats an army that had a buncha old metal minis finally replaced with gorgous new plastic sculpts. other armies do see an upsurge when they get new releases but I don't think sisters should be viewed as the NORM.

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
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Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend





Port Carmine

BrianDavion wrote:
really the only army that showed a MASSSIVE popularity boost with new minis that we know of for sure was sisters of battle. And thats an army that had a buncha old metal minis finally replaced with gorgous new plastic sculpts. other armies do see an upsurge when they get new releases but I don't think sisters should be viewed as the NORM.


I think there was a surge in interest in Death Guard after their range got new stuff, and I would imagine that GSC were similar. Popularity is obviously relative.

VAIROSEAN LIVES! 
   
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Witch Hunter in the Shadows





 flamingkillamajig wrote:
Sisters were treated the worst outside of maybe 4 years ago. Now supposedly their army is tough and strong, they get new models and units and they get books, animated reveals that make them look cool and more. I dont think ive seen gw put this much effort into a faction aside from space marines.
All of the 'minor' factions that didn't bring a large base of units and models with them from 2nd/3rd/4th edition has the same kind of big update release that the sisters are getting - 5e crons, DE, grey knights, etc. The sisters are just getting theirs 10 years late.

Of course having nice new models is great if you are a painter and collector, they only go so far if taking them out of your model case and putting them back into your model case sums up their use on the tabletop.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka




NE Ohio, USA

That was quite the build up just to trot out this old complaint again.

 flamingkillamajig wrote:

This leads me to yet another possibility. Would space marines be that popular if they didnt have a million model and unit releases, constant poster boy celebrity in the universe and in the lore as well as tending to get more attention, love and OP faction books with OP units and gear?


   
Made in gb
Battleship Captain





Bristol (UK)

I think the main reason Sisters saw such an uptick was that they had almost become a legend, like the Half Life 3 of wargames.

I know several people that bought Sisters, then kinda forgot about them and went back to their normal armies.

New shinies definitely increase the popularity of an army. Good rules do too.
Price of entry can also be a factor, starting Guard is a rough proposition when you're looking at £29 boxes for ~60pts of infantry for example.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





I can’t speak for wait for anyone else, but my own personal experience suggests model support and advertising plays a big part in popularity.

I took a break from the hobby for a number of years and got back into it shortly after the launch of 8th Ed. I walked past a FLGS and they had a cardboard cutout of a Primaris marine in the window, I popped in and had a look and after some thought, decided to give 8th edition a try.

I’d never collected space marines in my previous time with Warhammer, so thought it might be a nice entry point back into the hobby. The range was brand new, and all plastic and they came in the dark imperium starter box. And I knew that they would continue to be supported, no repeat of Squats or Witch Hunters!

I genuinely considered eldar, especially with all the talk of Ynnari refreshing then, but when I looked at the models, it’s often the same as when I started the hobby, the only difference was that what had been metal was now finecast, not even plastic! I had a metal Maugan Ra back in the day, I had no interest in collecting such an out of date range of miniatures. If Eldar were all plastic and the sculpts were up to date, I would quite probably have some in my collection.

So, for me at least, rules support, and strength in the game have no bearing on which faction appeals to me, it’s all about the models.

As it stands, when I finally get through my unassembled and unpainted space marines, I quite fancy the look of the latest necrons, and the ones I have from the Indomitus box will be a nice start to that.

Edit:
Another appeal to me was a relatively low model count. I just don’t fancy painting hundreds of guardsmen/orks/gaunts etc. or lots of vehicles.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2021/06/21 09:29:25


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Cost, rules and look all factor in. All of them I hear countless times with why a new player starts a force and who, which is frequently less these days as the cost is just so high for some forces.
   
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Devastating Dark Reaper





BrianDavion wrote:
really the only army that showed a MASSSIVE popularity boost with new minis that we know of for sure was sisters of battle. And thats an army that had a buncha old metal minis finally replaced with gorgous new plastic sculpts. other armies do see an upsurge when they get new releases but I don't think sisters should be viewed as the NORM.


Necrons also had a massive popularity boost in the aftermath of Indomitus and all the starter edition sets featuring them and their shiny new models. According to this metawatch article they were second only to marines in number of games played in whatever events they were collecting the data over:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/01/28/metawatch-is-warhammer-40000s-first-turn-advantage-a-thing-of-the-past/

It remains to be seen how enduring that popularity will be, I suspect it will tail off as other factions get major releases, but it is still a pretty good indicator that if GW builds it and markets it right they will come.
   
Made in us
Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba






I think there's four factors at play that impact a faction's popularity at any given time:

1) attention. I think this is the surest thing that will impact whether a faction is popular or not, the amount of time since they've last had a major release/how much of their range is comparatively old and outdated.

2) Core appeal/nicheness of interest. I think there are some factions that will always be more popular with people regardless of effort, particularly with newer players. Data from massive multiplayer games with millions and millions of players in multiple countries like WoW have shown that people tend to start with something that they know on average (so a recognizable race like 'that's an Ork' will always be more popular as a first character than 'weird cow person, what's that') and will most typically choose to play as something that's recognizably 'a good guy' before choosing to play as 'a bad guy.' The most popular races for a first character in WoW are human, then Elf, then Ork, and the most popular races for second characters are Ork and Undead. Yes, I understand that by the fluff *technically* there are no 'good guys' in 40k, but most people arent actually considering that when looking at the models, they're seeing clean designs, bright colors and recognizable heroic imagery vs dark colors, spikes, and recognizable evil imagery.

3) accessibility - 40k is an expensive hobby and some of the armies are orders of magnitude more expensive than others. Also, some armies (always marines, and one other) come in the starter boxes, and people are likely to get invested into things that they already have. This is why in basically every edition, the 'not marine army' in the starter box always seems to be the second most popular army for people to pick up, and the least popular tend to be very expensive horde armies like GSC/Daemons/nids.

4) competitiveness. I actually think this is the least important factor in non-tournament settings, though you always have a small core of players for whom this is the very top priority who will drop their current army if it sinks down below middle tier and pick up a new army that is currently "The Hotness." Anecdotally I've found this is about ~10-15% of players, typically people who have been in the hobby for a while.

"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"

"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"

"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"

"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"  
   
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Inquisitorial Keeper of the Xenobanks






your mind

 kirotheavenger wrote:
I think the main reason Sisters saw such an uptick was that they had almost become a legend, like the Half Life 3 of wargames.

I know several people that bought Sisters, then kinda forgot about them and went back to their normal armies.

New shinies definitely increase the popularity of an army. Good rules do too.
Price of entry can also be a factor, starting Guard is a rough proposition when you're looking at £29 boxes for ~60pts of infantry for example.


In either case, maybe we want most what is denied us, for different reasons. Then, with access, the value disappears.

Opposite for me with restartes in 40k and recastes in Ao$ ... cannot get away from them, do not want to see them let alone collect them.

   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





 jeff white wrote:
 kirotheavenger wrote:
I think the main reason Sisters saw such an uptick was that they had almost become a legend, like the Half Life 3 of wargames.

I know several people that bought Sisters, then kinda forgot about them and went back to their normal armies.

New shinies definitely increase the popularity of an army. Good rules do too.
Price of entry can also be a factor, starting Guard is a rough proposition when you're looking at £29 boxes for ~60pts of infantry for example.


In either case, maybe we want most what is denied us, for different reasons. Then, with access, the value disappears.

Opposite for me with restartes in 40k and recastes in Ao$ ... cannot get away from them, do not want to see them let alone collect them.


Can you actually make a post without complaining about Primaris Marines? just curious.

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in de
Battlefield Tourist






Nuremberg

Scotsman: Your point about competitiveness has a secondary dimension though - if you are new and pick an army that is not competitive and have a lot of bad experiences because of it, you will likely not stick around in the hobby for as long as someone who happens to pick a competitive army. So while I think it doesn't factor into faction choice nearly as much as the model design or faction concept, I think it plays a huge role in long term viability and popularity.

   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




I think the importance of competitiveness depends on how stable a meta exists. In 8th and now 9th, the absolutely 100% best faction to crush your friends has tended to bounce around a lot. If its going to take you 12 months to put an army together, the meta will likely look very different to what it does today.

By contrast, I felt things were far slower historically. You had multiple years of effective stasis.

6th and 7th certainly seemed to produce "just play Eldar" and we saw an awful lot of Eldar players through those years. (See also "just spam riptides"/"do whatever you have to do to make Marines top tier now").
   
Made in us
Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba






 Da Boss wrote:
Scotsman: Your point about competitiveness has a secondary dimension though - if you are new and pick an army that is not competitive and have a lot of bad experiences because of it, you will likely not stick around in the hobby for as long as someone who happens to pick a competitive army. So while I think it doesn't factor into faction choice nearly as much as the model design or faction concept, I think it plays a huge role in long term viability and popularity.


This is something I have seen in the past, but is far less common now in my experience. To use a pretty salient example - we've got a new player currently starting up Chaos Marines, one of the armies I would consider to have the greatest need for updates.

It is so obvious what that army needs and doesn't have that I have yet to see a single person play against this guy playing a more current army that hasn't just given him the extra wound on all his stuff. His W2 marines cost less than their W2 marines but...they get doctrines and buffed datasheets and better chapter tactics, and he's new and is fairly likely to lose anyway. He doesn't ask for it, his opponents just go 'your stuff's still waiting for updates, so go for it.'

That wasn't so much a thing in earlier editions.

"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"

"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"

"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"

"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"  
   
Made in de
Battlefield Tourist






Nuremberg

That's really cool! Good on your playing group. I hope that attitude really is becoming more widespread in the hobby. Certainly, I was surprised at how positive and friendly the Warhammer Reddits were compared to like...most communities on Reddit.

   
Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut



Bamberg / Erlangen

 the_scotsman wrote:
This is something I have seen in the past, but is far less common now in my experience. To use a pretty salient example - we've got a new player currently starting up Chaos Marines, one of the armies I would consider to have the greatest need for updates.

It is so obvious what that army needs and doesn't have that I have yet to see a single person play against this guy playing a more current army that hasn't just given him the extra wound on all his stuff. His W2 marines cost less than their W2 marines but...they get doctrines and buffed datasheets and better chapter tactics, and he's new and is fairly likely to lose anyway. He doesn't ask for it, his opponents just go 'your stuff's still waiting for updates, so go for it.'

That wasn't so much a thing in earlier editions.

That's funny. I had an introductionary game for two new guys at the local club last Sunday. I played against CSM and told him right away to use the same points but count one more wound for his stuff as well.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/06/22 13:27:13


   
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Battleship Captain





Bristol (UK)

My local chaos player refused the +1 wound!
TBH I think he likes having the excuse in case he loses, which is every single time.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/06/22 13:31:53


 
   
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Swift Swooping Hawk





 kirotheavenger wrote:
My local chaos player refused the +1 wound!
TBH I think he likes having the excuse in case he loses, which is every single time.


As people have pointed out in the past, it's really not a needle mover for CSM. The issues are much deeper than just the extra wound on Marines and Terminators.

I think it's a slippery slope in terms of houserules, but I 100% get it in the case that Scotsman mentions.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/06/22 19:08:49


 
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





 Da Boss wrote:
That's really cool! Good on your playing group. I hope that attitude really is becoming more widespread in the hobby. Certainly, I was surprised at how positive and friendly the Warhammer Reddits were compared to like...most communities on Reddit.


I wonder if covid is partly responsable. as it's made people look to small local communities more and forget about "the big tournies"?

If so I hope that shift lasts.

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Fluff and new models/units combined with codex power.

Take Ultramarines for example -- they always get new fluff and new models. Always popular. Literal poster boys.

Black Templars USED to get tons of fluff and unique units, but support for them has died off. There are lots of people who have old BT armies that have never been updated.

Contrast this to Iron Hands -- very little fluff and until recently had zero unique units. Even in 30k novels they have very little fluff due to losing Manus so soon. Consequently, very few have an actual Iron Hands army (no I'm not referring to the black primed marines at the end of 8th people used to win tourneys please don't include that).
   
Made in gb
Walking Dead Wraithlord






I think big bundle boxes + New models play a big part in people picking up armies.

Secondly would be the rule of cool. Everyone has their own likes and dislikes so this would differ from person to person. Other non TT 40k content media like comics, games and films/animations will certainly play a big part in this. For example I think some people got into 40k/new armies based on DOW games.

But ultimately I don't think either of those things is relevant in terms of player retention.

When you first start 40k you generally look at the most cost efficient things that are the coolest...
Rules and support rear its ugly head only after you've already started at the hobby. I think this is a huge barrier to player retention.

Like if someone picks GSC as their first army because they been thinking about it for a while, and a new big discount battlebox will be just the right push. However as soon as they make their 500-1k little army, get familiar with 40k, and play some games, it will become aparent that GSC are currently not a very good army. I dont think such people would likely loose interest fast. Cant blame them.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/06/22 21:56:40


https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/772746.page#10378083 - My progress/failblog painting blog thingy

Eldar- 4436 pts


AngryAngel80 wrote:
I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "


 Eonfuzz wrote:


I would much rather everyone have a half ass than no ass.


"A warrior does not seek fame and honour. They come to him as he humbly follows his path"  
   
Made in nl
Inquisitorial Keeper of the Xenobanks






your mind

BrianDavion wrote:
 jeff white wrote:
 kirotheavenger wrote:
I think the main reason Sisters saw such an uptick was that they had almost become a legend, like the Half Life 3 of wargames.

I know several people that bought Sisters, then kinda forgot about them and went back to their normal armies.

New shinies definitely increase the popularity of an army. Good rules do too.
Price of entry can also be a factor, starting Guard is a rough proposition when you're looking at £29 boxes for ~60pts of infantry for example.


In either case, maybe we want most what is denied us, for different reasons. Then, with access, the value disappears.

Opposite for me with restartes in 40k and recastes in Ao$ ... cannot get away from them, do not want to see them let alone collect them.


Can you actually make a post without complaining about Primaris Marines? just curious.


Sure. Search my posts. I counted 25 posts between this one and the next in which I express dislike for restartes.

You might make use of the conveniently placed “ ignore “ button.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Da Boss wrote:
That's really cool! Good on your playing group. I hope that attitude really is becoming more widespread in the hobby. Certainly, I was surprised at how positive and friendly the Warhammer Reddits were compared to like...most communities on Reddit.


I wonder sometimes if GW isn’t doing things purposely, so that we write our own rules and they can focus on toys and comic books...

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/06/23 04:10:27


   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut





From my observations it depends heavily on the type of player:

For the new player, the popular faction is whatever took their initial fancy. This is almost always Space Marines and quite frankly I don't blame them these days as they are in the starter box and are an easy choice for a new player

For the experienced player that takes it seriously (tournaments etc) then it's usually in line with the meta. They know that [insert army name here] is strong in a certain way so they play and practice ready for the next tournament.

For the hobbyist that doesn't take it seriously - then it's usually what is new. Space Marines run out a new edition with a ton of new models - they have been bought, painted and played even if they know they suck because that's the hobby. Notably, these players in my experience tend to play a lot of AOS as well.

Ultimately however, what makes a faction go from Popular to Unpopular is 3 things:
GW model support. Almost nobody in my local meta has started a Craftworld army in the last 2 / 3 years
GW Rules support. If your army sucks by default, people generally stop playing it as being steamrolled every game is not fun. It's rare to see Tyranids or Genestealer Cults played at my local meta.
Online forums. People keep saying an army sucks or another is overpowered - people believe it. We're just hardwired this way as a species to follow the majority.
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





Sumilidon wrote:
From my observations it depends heavily on the type of player:

For the new player, the popular faction is whatever took their initial fancy. This is almost always Space Marines and quite frankly I don't blame them these days as they are in the starter box and are an easy choice for a new player

For the experienced player that takes it seriously (tournaments etc) then it's usually in line with the meta. They know that [insert army name here] is strong in a certain way so they play and practice ready for the next tournament.

For the hobbyist that doesn't take it seriously - then it's usually what is new. Space Marines run out a new edition with a ton of new models - they have been bought, painted and played even if they know they suck because that's the hobby. Notably, these players in my experience tend to play a lot of AOS as well.

Ultimately however, what makes a faction go from Popular to Unpopular is 3 things:
GW model support. Almost nobody in my local meta has started a Craftworld army in the last 2 / 3 years
GW Rules support. If your army sucks by default, people generally stop playing it as being steamrolled every game is not fun. It's rare to see Tyranids or Genestealer Cults played at my local meta.
Online forums. People keep saying an army sucks or another is overpowered - people believe it. We're just hardwired this way as a species to follow the majority.


I think there's also a spot on that list for "lore support" for lack of a better term, if a faction features in a number of scenerios and appers and bad ass people are more apt to find it appealing.IF the army works as described in the fluff.

If someone's imagination is taken by say.... a hoard of orks blizting across the battlefield he may be less inclined to keep being intreasted if orks only work if played as an "elite gunline army" just for example

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/06/29 00:05:25


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 Blackie wrote:
 flamingkillamajig wrote:


This leads me to yet another possibility. Would space marines be that popular if they didnt have a million model and unit releases, constant poster boy celebrity in the universe and in the lore as well as tending to get more attention, love and OP faction books with OP units and gear?


I've always thought BIG NO, but of course it's just speculation.

It's true that a large fraction of players choose an army that works, not one that looks good or is strong in the lore. It's also true that cheaper armies (made from starters or elite oriented ones) are appealing for someone. And many others avoid armies that don't work very well or are too expensive, regardless of how the models look or their lore.


There's also the corollary that if Space Marines didn't received (at least) 50% of the game focus, all that effort would go into other factions, perhaps spread across multiple factions a la AoS, and we wouldn't be in a situation where some armies in desperate need of updating are ignored for many years, even whole editions.

It's really hard to accurately predict how much Space Marines' popularity impacts the rest of the hobby.
   
 
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