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Made in gb
Confident Marauder Chieftain





North Wales, UK

A few of us in our local gaming group made some epic30k armies over lockdown last year and we got to try out a smaller game last night. A couple of things came up that seemed odd and I've a couple of questions if you fine folks are able to answer them:

Firefights and close combat, all attacks from the attackers and defenders are rolled at the same time? We assumed so but it's not mentioned either way in the rules we were using from EpicAU.

A Justaerin Terminator formation (4 squads and 2 spartan tanks) engaged a tactical formation with heavy support squads (8 tactical squads, 4 heavy support squads and 6 rhinos), but couldn't get into base contact. The sons of horus elite terminators were annihilated by weight of dice thrown against them, which seemed odd. They have power fists (base contact) and multi-meltas (small arms) so we figured they couldn't use the power fists as they were at range and the extra attack + macro weapon small arms multi-melta fire gave the four squads of terminators 8 attacks at 4+ to hit with their firefight value, taking down 4 of my tactical squads, while my tactical squads and support squads rolled 12 dice, 4 of them hitting on 3+, the terminators failed their saves and were wiped out. Did we play this right? We're pretty sure we did but the expensive terminators seemed a bit underwhelming.

Lastly, I was using some breacher squads, they have a firefight value of 4+ but the only weapons listed are melta-cutters (base contact) so we assumed that they can't engage in an assault unless they are physically in base contact. Is this right?

Thanks in advance, Dave.
   
Made in fi
Longtime Dakkanaut






Welcome to Epic!

While the 30k list is awesome, be mindful of it being written by people who are rather lax on details and quality control.

In engagements, both sides attack at the same time, yes.

If a unit has a FF value other than "-", it attacks normally in a firefight. Breachers have special rules (Lance, Armourbane) that apply to their CC attacks with the cutters, but they participate normally in firefights without those bonuses.

Likewise, the terminators cannot use their powerfists unless they are in base contact. They want to get stuck in and deny the opponent their usually better FF, so firefighting against a big group with support weapons just might not have been the best call from the SoH player. Did you remember to reroll the Terminators' saves due to Reinforced Armour? Even then, sometimes that happens and your 75% armour fails to keep you alive. Such is life.

Try that for a couple of times, singular events aren't usually very representative of anything. I've had my 500+ point terminator groups killed in their Thunderhawks by singular lucky shots from cheap AA-guns, that happening once doesn't mean I shouldn't keep using them.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, in general it's best to soften your targets first before going in for a decisive engagement. Shoot some blasts on them, bring an Inspiring character upgrade along, have allies nearby to provide support and THEN slam your terminator killblow in the bigger detachment to break them utterly.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/07/21 12:33:23


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Made in gb
Confident Marauder Chieftain





North Wales, UK

Thanks for the quick response! We remembered the re-roll to saves on the terminators, I think my opponent was unlucky in that regard!
   
 
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