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Made in us
Hardened Veteran Guardsman




As a cheap way to put some heavy firepower on the board with a minimum of effort, would it be possible to put a Master of Ordnance, an Officer of the Fleet and ~3 Deathstrike missiles for the cost of 1 Baneblade/super-heavy tank?

Additionally, since the range of the Deathstrike is so long, and would rarely actually be on the battlefield, can those Deathstrikes be off board so as not to be fire magnets?

Finally, would those options (3 Deathstrikes, 1 Master of Ordnance, 1 Officer of the Fleet) be of any value if some form of Titan/Biotitan/anything with Macro weapons show up?

Thanks in advance?

-STS

Grey Knights 712 points Imperial Stormtroopers 3042 points Lamenters 1787 points Xenomorphs 995 points 1200 points + 1790 points 770 points 369 points of Imperial Guard to bolster the Sisters of Battle
Kain said: "This will surely end in tears for everyone involved. How very 40k."

 
   
Made in us
Morally-Flexible Malleus Hearing Whispers




The strongest anti titan gun in the game is the Shadow Sword. With 4 LC/HB Sponsons, it's likely going to kill whatever you point it at. If you want something cheaper, or less cumbersome, a Triple Squadron of Malcador Annihilators with LCs should put a Titan in it's place fairly quickly.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Leman Russ Demolisher tanks, especially tank commander variants. Give them the +6'' range. They will flat murder many many things, especially heavy vehicles of any variety. Give them all heavy bolters in the sponsons and they do pretty well at anti-horde too.
   
Made in us
Storm Trooper with Maglight





France, region of Paris

Don't even consider Deathstrike missile launchers, not even for friendly games. Not until the 9th edition codex comes out with a significant rework.

Deathstrikes are the epitomy of an unplayable unit : they cost a lot of points, they are pretty fragile, they do absolutely nothing turn after turn (unnless you get really lucky). In the case they get the chance to fire, do pretty low damage, and almost never "get their points back".

longtime Astra Militarum neckbeard  
   
Made in fi
Locked in the Tower of Amareo





Why you even bother?-) if opponent brings titan to field you have basically autowin.

If you want to list tailor vs titan(lol) just spam basic squads. No titan can remove those fast enough to win.

2024 painted/bought: 109/109 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle





In My Lab

I think the OP is more talking about Knight Titans, not Warlords and such.

Clocks for the clockmaker! Cogs for the cog throne! 
   
Made in us
Hardened Veteran Guardsman




 JNAProductions wrote:
I think the OP is more talking about Knight Titans, not Warlords and such.

Correct, but sort of want to see just how "big" a target I can kill.

The idea was to basically pay minimal points to have something that could deal with this threat.

I'd rather pay for 3 "off-board" Deathstrikes (27 points) and a Master of Ordnance and an Officer of the Fleet (4 points) I can kitbash and pay the 31 points and 0 dollars instead of buying a Baneblade variant for $140 dollars.

What is the largest type of enemy I can possibly eliminate with their combined firepower? Heavy 3d6 for each Deathstrike causing Mortal Wounds, along with a Master of Ordnance (with the Focused Bombardment stratagem) with Heavy D6 S8 AP -2 D3 damage and an Officer of the Fleet (with the Tactical Air Control stratagem, otherwise the Fleet officer is useless).

A Deathstrike could do up to 18 mortal wounds and the air strike an additional 3 mortal wounds and an Artillery Barrage doing Heavy 6 S8 AP -2 D3 (possibly up to 18 wounds)...

If all of that hits (that could be 54 +3 mortal wounds and 18 normal wounds on a single target). Since those Mortal Wounds can't be saved using a Void Shield, 50 wounds are required to take out a Warhound (50 wounds).

It is a bit of a points investment, (31 power, 2 CPs) but would cost me no actual money... plus, if there are no Imperial Knights or a single Warhound to kill... the weapons themselves are still very usable against lots of different enemy types.

Grey Knights 712 points Imperial Stormtroopers 3042 points Lamenters 1787 points Xenomorphs 995 points 1200 points + 1790 points 770 points 369 points of Imperial Guard to bolster the Sisters of Battle
Kain said: "This will surely end in tears for everyone involved. How very 40k."

 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





I am pretty sure you have been around long enough to know 'off board' deathstrikes are not a thing.
   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




I'd rather pay for 3 "off-board" Deathstrikes (27 points) and a Master of Ordnance and an Officer of the Fleet (4 points) I can kitbash and pay the 31 points and 0 dollars instead of buying a Baneblade variant for $140 dollars.


This doesn't work. You can't fire anything from off-board.
   
Made in us
Hardened Veteran Guardsman




So it really IS an escalation of commitment thing :( If the Officer of the Fleet and the Master of Ordinance both use attacks that are explicitly off board, why not Deathstrikes? It isn't like there isn't a model for artillery or fliers that can be used to represent air strikes?

I guess that caps my IG, er Astra Militarum where it is now.

Not as a rules question, but as a common sense thing, why would any commander have heavy missiles fire at targets at 45% or less of their range (using on Onslaught board of 90"). I understand the idea of buy more stuff, er... cost equality, but having strategically important weapons like that intentionally close is sorta moronic (per IOM SOP, I guess).

Grey Knights 712 points Imperial Stormtroopers 3042 points Lamenters 1787 points Xenomorphs 995 points 1200 points + 1790 points 770 points 369 points of Imperial Guard to bolster the Sisters of Battle
Kain said: "This will surely end in tears for everyone involved. How very 40k."

 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle





In My Lab

slade the sniper wrote:
So it really IS an escalation of commitment thing :( If the Officer of the Fleet and the Master of Ordinance both use attacks that are explicitly off board, why not Deathstrikes? It isn't like there isn't a model for artillery or fliers that can be used to represent air strikes?

I guess that caps my IG, er Astra Militarum where it is now.

Not as a rules question, but as a common sense thing, why would any commander have heavy missiles fire at targets at 45% or less of their range (using on Onslaught board of 90"). I understand the idea of buy more stuff, er... cost equality, but having strategically important weapons like that intentionally close is sorta moronic (per IOM SOP, I guess).
A Guardsman can move 24" in a single turn, with Move Move Move!
A White Scars Marine can move 30" in a single turn-6" move, 6" Advance, 12" Charge, and two 3" Consolidates. 36" if they can fight twice, such as with the Assault Intercessor stratagem.

Why do I bring this up? The range of a Bolter or Lasgun is 24". So, in the time it takes to kill one man at most (two if in Rapid Fire or benefiting from Bolter Discipline or some such) a Marine can outrun the range of their bullets. And a Guardsman can match it.

Ranges in 40k are completely and utterly nonsensical. Even more than most things in 40k.

Clocks for the clockmaker! Cogs for the cog throne! 
   
Made in us
Hardened Veteran Guardsman




 JNAProductions wrote:


Ranges in 40k are completely and utterly nonsensical. Even more than most things in 40k.

No lie detected...but 200" is a bit more than 36." I mean you can almost allow for those short ranges due to battlefield conditions. It is pretty hard to shoot accurately in the middle of a battle where you and your targets are moving and intervening stuff gets in the way...especially in urban or dense forest/jungle. You can't see more than 50m in most forests, much less have time to accurately engage targets. That is why indirect fires are so important...you can just drop rounds in places you can't see. Mortars and grenades are still around for a reason, just like big guns...and you don't put big guns close enough that the enemy can kill them with direct fires.

-STS


Grey Knights 712 points Imperial Stormtroopers 3042 points Lamenters 1787 points Xenomorphs 995 points 1200 points + 1790 points 770 points 369 points of Imperial Guard to bolster the Sisters of Battle
Kain said: "This will surely end in tears for everyone involved. How very 40k."

 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





The only reason the deathstrike model exists is because GW graced us with the opportunity to make memes about front-line ICMBs. If your not playing an apoc game on an 8'X10' table then their max range is meaningless.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/28 05:58:53


 
   
Made in de
Boom! Leman Russ Commander






Also the "up to 18 mortal wounds" number is... very VERY optimistic. The chance for that happening:
0,46% to roll 18 shots x 0.006% to hit every single one of these 18 shots rerolling 1s from the MoO = 0,000028%.

On another note: It's also very VERY situational and I have no idea if it would be possible to pull this off, but regarding "cheap anti titan firepower" for less points than a Baneblade:
A Hades Breaching drill costs 80 points. And as of now Straken still gives all Catachans (even the vehicles) +1 attack as far as I know (correct me if I'm wrong). IF (big if, because it might be very difficult) you manage to get it into CC and attack before it is killed it makes on average 6 attacks, 3 hits, 2 wounds (with S14 I assume it wounds any titan at 3+), 6 damage against vehicles with a 4++, 12, should it have no InvSv.
If you can use "Crush them" that increases to 7.5/15 damage.

But overall the Shadowsword remains the most effective option by far.

~6550 build and painted
819 build and painted
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