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Made in nl
Regular Dakkanaut





I’m still quite new to painting and have been watching lots of tutorials and trying to find out as much info as possible to improve my technique. One thing I’m curious about are the different brush types sold by GW and whether they are really needed. I bought a small layer brush and found it to be useless because it wouldn’t keep a point. I’ve now got an artificer layer brush which is much better but I’ve also got a couple of W&Ns of various sizes and I’m not sure I can do anything with the artificer that I can’t do with them. But in particular I’m confused by the GW base brushes which just seem like not very good brushes, totally incapable of holding a point. I get the thinking that you don’t need your best brush for doing a base coat but I don’t see the advantage of using a brush that seems deliberately designed to be bad. There’s a lot of small detail on most minis and surely you don’t actually want to go over the lines when painting a base coat. What I’m basically asking is (a) are the different brush types really worth it and (b) in the case of base brushes what am I not getting?
   
Made in ca
Speed Drybrushing





t.dot

There's honestly nothing wrong with having a brush that doesn't necessarily hold a sharp point. I keep a bunch of my older, more worn brushes on hand for use with rough basecoats, textural work, applying washes (sometimes, unless I need accuracy), some light drybrushing, etc. However, you have to be sure that you aren't overpaying. Investing in a couple of cheap, lower quality brushes to do some of the gruntwork that you don't want to use your better brushes for to save wear and tear is perfectly fine; I just wouldn't consider Games Workshop brushes (of any variety) as fitting that bill (as they are medium to low quality, AND overpriced).

There's a couple of brands I highly recommend:

Raphael 8404's are my bread and butter. I get them from JacksonArts, an online distributor that sells the brushes much cheaper than your average art store (I pay $15 for my Size 3's, for example), so I stock up on 1s, 2s, and 3s and do everything with these brushes. As they get used and worn, the tip goes, and they go from fine detail work over to my grunt work.

Handovers are a perfectly good substitute if you're comparing prices you'd find at an arts store. They're cheaper (retail) than 8404s and the quality isn't quite the same, but they're very close. At least for the first few weeks I'd say they're ALMOST equivalent, but I've found they do wear out faster.

Green Stuff World's synthetics are an amazing alternative if you don't want Kolinsky Sable (whether you're against the use of animal pelts, you want them for oils/enamels, personal preference, whatever). They have a green and gold line that I think are well worth the cost, although I haven't found an online distrubutor that sells them cheaper than the 8404's. One advantage (apart from being able to use them for oils/enamels) of the synthetic brushes is that you can use hot water to help reshape the brushes, correcting any hooks and getting some extra longevity out of your brushes.

RedGrass Games brushes are pretty good, but overpriced. They're actually equivalent to the Handovers both in price and quality; if you gave me a choice, I'd pick RGGs because they come with a slick metallic-red handle (and I'm a sucker for reds).

W&N 7 Series, if you can get ones from a good quality batch, are excellent. On par with 8404s, and they're also available from JacksonArts for equivalent prices, so you could use them interchangeably. My only issue is that over the past I'd say 6-7 years now, W&N has had a noticeable quality control issue, and IMO you're flipping a coin when you buy one (especially online), on whether or not it'll be a good quality brush or not. For that reason alone I've steered clear of this brand for many years now and stuck with Raphaels. If you do go this route, make sure you're not buying the Miniatures brushes (counter-intuitive, but you actually want the longer bristles; the Miniature line has really short bristles that are actually awful for painting).

I'd steer clear of Games Workshop. They're low-mid tier quality (depending on regular vs Artificer), with an insane markup because they've got the GW brand on them.


Insofar as what you actually want to look for in a good painting brushes, you want three things:

Tip, Snap, and Well.

Tip - How sharp is the Tip? How well does the brush hold it, especially as you're painting? Do the bristles splay out a lot as you apply paint or does the brush do what you want? Part of this is also keyed to longevity; how long will the brush hold this tip? Remember that brushes are a consumable good, and they wear out the more you use them (I'm lucky if an 8404 will hold it's tip for more than a few months with how much I paint, so I replace them quite often), so a brush that holds it's tip sharper, longer, is better.

Snap - How quickly and easily does the brush snap back to it's original position after each stroke? Good quality brushes have snappier bristles, doubly so by snapping back as close as possible to the sharp tip. This helps with accuracy and consistency between each stroke.

Well - This refers to the back end of the bristle, between the tip and the ferrule (the metal part attaching the bristles to the brush). A brush with a big or deep well holds more paint than a brush with a small (or no) well (this is why you don't want W&N 7 Series Miniatures, which don't have any Well in their bristles). The reason is that the more paint and moisture you can keep in your brush, the more working time you have to paint before having to return to the palette or water cup. This is particularly important when you're doing tiny details and freehand, actually. A lot of people make the (IMO) mistake of jumping immediately to the 00's and 000's, and grab the tiniest brush possible because they think it will help with accuracy, but this is actually the opposite of what you should do. Using these tiny brushes means that the brush moving through the air, plus evaporation as you wave the brush around and paint, means what little paint you have on your brush is gonna dry super fast, most likely into a tiny little clump of paint on the tip. You'll constantly have to return to your palette and re-moisturize the brush, reshape the tip to clear out that dried paint, etc. It's a headache.

Tip is what determines accuracy, not size, and I do a lot of my freehand with my Size 2 and 3 (a lot easier too) precisely because they have big wells. They hold more paint and give me more working time, and combined with a sharp tip and good snap means I can paint the finest of lines more easily and consistently than if I were to use a 00 or 000.

Bit of a ramble, but I hope that helps answer your questions and steer you in some form of a clearer direction.

   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





GW do tooo many brushes to be honest, but there are uses for different brush types and shapes.

To games workshops credit their drybrushes are really good and I do buy them when needed. The Cambridge hard to clean by I think they are worth it. Their shade brush is good as it holds a lot of shade but it’s not necessary. That’s it for GW, the rest are over priced and not very good.

Really what you need is a good quality synthetic. Well a few different sizes. I use Windsor and Newton cotman 111 round brushes. Good price and work really well and last for a long time if you take care of them.

On that note never let paint get in the ferule and get some brush soap.

I use green stuff world brush cleaner, it’s great. I haven’t had anything from green stuff world that isn’t really good so interesting to hear about their synthetics above. I have their kolinsky brushes for detail and they are good.

Some people will tell you that you just have to have kolinsky and synthetics are a waste of time, nonsense you just need good synthetics that don’t have the bristles pointing in all directions.

I typically use a size 6, 3, 2 and 1. Have a big brush like a size 6 for priming and basing and doing large areas like on vehicles. I started off doing everything with a number 2 and getting impatient on large areas and putting too much paint on the brush and then it’s goodbye brush.

But ultimately you need to find what works for you
   
Made in ca
Speed Drybrushing





t.dot

mrFickle wrote:

I typically use a size 6, 3, 2 and 1. Have a big brush like a size 6 for priming and basing and doing large areas like on vehicles. I started off doing everything with a number 2 and getting impatient on large areas and putting too much paint on the brush and then it’s goodbye brush.


Especially for army/grunt work, I highly recommend investing in an airbrush, even something simple and basic (like a cheap dual action Master brand, which are like $30-$40 on eBay) to do basecoats and maybe even initial blends. Priming by hand and painting tanks by hand just sounds awful and would take the wind out of my sails for any project.

   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Yes an airbrush is good but it’s a different subject to be honest, you can’t replace your hairy brush with and airbrush, it’s just another tool.
   
Made in nl
Regular Dakkanaut





Thanks for the comments everyone. As always really useful and I’m becoming increasingly glad I’ve joined this site. Not sure about an airbrush though. I could see how that would work for big stuff and especially 40k vehicles but the standard size figures I’m painting - Orcs!, elves etc. Need about 8 diff colors for the base coat and some on an area of a couple of square millimeters. Think I’ll stick to a brush!
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





People with really posh airbrushes could paint a whole ork with an airbrush but it would take a long time to get to that level of skill.

An airbrush can be a great tool for priming and basing (quick and quality) and using special effects paints but it’s a big outlay if your happy with a hairy brush.

I think the main advantage is that you will get a smoother finish with an airbrush than a rattle can when priming. APart from that it’s not essential at all.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
People with really posh airbrushes could paint a whole ork with an airbrush but it would take a long time to get to that level of skill.

An airbrush can be a great tool for priming and basing (quick and quality) and using special effects paints but it’s a big outlay if your happy with a hairy brush.

I think the main advantage is that you will get a smoother finish with an airbrush than a rattle can when priming. APart from that it’s not essential at all.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/02 19:55:23


 
   
Made in ca
Regular Dakkanaut





Oh Canada!

I have three general classes of brushes in rotation at all times.

• The Best Brush - Top quality, excellent point, can do everything I ask of it. Save for finishing up models and fiddly, exacting jobs.
• The Good Brush - most of the early painting tasks are handled by a retired former Best Brush. Base coats, washes, blocking in, etc.
• The Gnarly Brushes - everything you don't want to do with the above. Drybrushing, mixing paint, stippling, applying basing materials, etc. Big ol' bucket of synthetics, watercolours, boar bristles, and not-good-enough-to-be-Good-Brush-anymore retirees.


IMO GW offers way too many expensive brushes and sizes that aren't necessary, and their brush quality is whoomp-whoomp. *thumbs down* Like most miniature company brushes, it's just rebranded, marked up stuff from someone else. Go buy your 'Best' brush from an actual brush making company. I love my Raphael 8404's.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/03 10:14:47


 
   
Made in nl
Trigger-Happy Baal Predator Pilot




netherlands

i use only the fine detail brush from gw and the rest are cheap brushes and they work well,
it all depends on what you like to archive.
good tabletop or pieces of art
i even use cheap disposual brushes for fine detail they are ment for weathering powders or other brush killing work.
but they retain a nice pointy tip so i did some detail work with it and im impressed with it.
so i would say try some out to see if they fit you paint techniek.

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Made in us
Incorporating Wet-Blending






Haven't used a GW brush, although I only paint to advanced tabletop.

Here's the hiearchy:
* Expensive Hobby brushes: Only when I can't use another brush. Too easy to ruin when you're a beginner.
* Cheap natural brushes: Brushing on primer, washes, basecoating, etc.
* Cheap Synthetic brushes with a point: Metallics and whatnot.
* Cheap Makeup brushes: Terrain.
* Brushtip pens and 005 pens: Eyes, quick touch-ups.

I swear I clean my hobby brushes, but they seem to lose their tip eventually.

Also subscribe to Jackson Art's mailing list. Maybe every year they have a sale on hobby brushes!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/10 04:45:43


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