Codex: Harlequin - 9th Edition

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**mokoshkana**

What are folks thinking with the new book? Light, Dark, or Twilight?

**vipoid**

For me, at first glance, Light looks like the clear winner:

- It lets all Harlequin units Advance and still fire at full effect (especially good for Skyweavers).
- It gives a defensive buff against any shooting that would hit on a 3+ or better.
- Stratagem is interesting, potentially saving a key unit from melee. Nothing outstanding but that might be for the best - since you're now reliant on using Stratagems just to unlock the actual rules for your weapons.
- Relic is very nice.
- Warlord trait is meh but I don't think that's much of an issue.

Dark and Twilight aren't bad, I just don't think they bring the same utility to the table.

One amusing thing I noticed with Dark - if you give Player of the Dark to a Death Jester with Rift Ghoul then his melee attacks will do 1 Mortal Wound on a 4+ to wound and 2 Mortal Wounds on a 5+ to wound. If you also add Suit of Hidden Knives, he can then potentially inflict another 3 Mortal Wounds at the end of the Fight Phase. I believe that comes out to 6-7 Mortal Wounds in total (plus whatever his attacks do).

I imagine there are better options but this one just tickled me a little.

**wuestenfux**

Harlies seem to be more promising than CWE in the new edition.
I dislike the inevitable troop tax in a CWE battalion.

Here is a list proposed by Goonhammer - looks different from the 8th ed lists.

Spoiler:

A combined list using patrols seems also interesting.

Spoiler:

**Insularum**

For travelling players, I think I'll be using Twilight as the Shadowseer can dish out enough defensive abilities to cover a small force pushing over the centre board on foot (possibly Seer, Troupe, Death Jester).

One combo I'll be trying is Harvester of Torment/Favour of Cegorach on the Death Jester - guaranteeing at least one unmodified six each turn after rolling meaning acing either a save or overwatch in the opponents turn and 4-12 hits in my shooting phase (average about 7.4 hits) - for 70 points and a CP he seems incredible.

**Sasori**

I'm a big fan of the new rules so far, to the point I think I may start up just a pure harlequins force.

I have to admit, I like Light and Twilight the most. Light seems like it is the perfect way to deal with some of the issues present like Tau, and stuff like the Shadowstone seems amazing on a Shadowseer. Twilight is a lot more punchy, but the army is already pretty punchy.

**teamtigerstripe**

I was thinking about starting a pure Harlequin list now with the new codex, but I am trying to figure out how to build out troupes. How are people loading out their troupes?

**Heafstaag**

teamtigerstripe wrote:
I was thinking about starting a pure Harlequin list now with the new codex, but I am trying to figure out how to build out troupes. How are people loading out their troupes?

I don't think you could go wrong with having one of each special close combat weapon. Its cheap, provides the unit with decent punch, and provides access to the strats.

Are you looking for troupes to ride in starweavers, or be on foot?

The upgrades are all pretty cheap, so throwing in a couple fusions in every squad seems like a no brainer as well. Really it just depends on points, and if you want a unit to have a dedicated purpose or have options for everything.

**teamtigerstripe**

Heafstaag wrote:

Are you looking for troupes to ride in starweavers, or be on foot?

Honestly at this juncture I am not sure. I assume some of both for different purposes on the field.

**Phoenix Lord**

I think harlequins will be very strong, all of the three saedath can do very well in the competitive scene, with both light and dark at the same level, they both offers a different playstile, the light one push for a mobility fire power with a good resistance given from the transhuman on the hit rolls and the dark one with the boosted AP and the fight on death push for a lot of troupe in foot, time will tell wich one will prevail.

I see the Twilight instead Is a little behind but only because is ability are a little bit more difficults to play but I think in capable hands It could gives a lot of satisfactions.

**Amaurosis**

Hi there;

reading the codex maybe someone can clarify following questions:

1. May the Pivotal Role "Spectre of Despair" of the Solitaire already be used in turn 1?

2. Neuro disruptor: you either do only 1 MW to non-vehicle-units on a hit (ignoring the pistol stats inclusive to wound roll etc) OR hitting a vehicle you use the pistol stats with corresponding to wound rolls/ saves etc. Correct?

3. although more like a general question: you may declare a charge on an enemy unit even if you do not have LOS (e.g. hiding behind obscuring wall close to an enemy unit on the other side)?
Thank you!

Cheers,
Amaurosis

**Spectral Ceramite**

I hate now can only take 2 fusion pistols (I like the change to nuero pistols but). Have to read more but. First indistinct because have to change or build a lot more players now, lucky I have like 30 unbuilt... (not lucky for people who designed their army around that...). I think looks strong as a patrol.

1. It says Deep Strike (no rule over-riding the Turn 2 rule, maybe missed it, so in Turn 2+)
2. If a hit scored (non vehicle), it is a mortal wound, no roll to wound. If vehicle, treat as normal weapon.
3. If you declare a charge out of LOS of enemy (you can do that so the enemy cannot overwatch or set to defend etc)

**Amaurosis**

Thanx, Spectral Ceramite!

Spectral Ceramite wrote:

1. It says Deep Strike (no rule over-riding the Turn 2 rule, maybe missed it, so in Turn 2+)

It actually says nothing about "deep strike", not even about being put in reserves. Only haunting the foe instead of setting it up and putting it on the battlefield in the reinforcement step of one of your movement phases. Or is there some errata/faq that the reinforcement step in turn 1 is to be skipped?

**JNAProductions**

Amaurosis wrote:
Thanx, Spectral Ceramite!

Spectral Ceramite wrote:

1. It says Deep Strike (no rule over-riding the Turn 2 rule, maybe missed it, so in Turn 2+)

It actually says nothing about "deep strike", not even about being put in reserves. Only haunting the foe instead of setting it up and putting it on the battlefield in the reinforcement step of one of your movement phases. Or is there some errata/faq that the reinforcement step in turn 1 is to be skipped?

It's in the Mission details, I think.

You cannot use Reinforcements from out of the board turn one.

**ThePauliPrinciple**

Does the webway gate work as advertised in the warhammer community article, or was it a total scam?

Can we effectively use it with harlequin?

**Elfric**

Apparently the Webway gate is amazing. I don't have one but I can see it having massive utility. I dont think we will see transports and rather see larger foot slogging squads of Troupes. The army is so fast now and has lots of tricks and defensive buffs. From personal experience a pure Harlie army feels very strong and I wonder if the luck mechanic wont get FAQ'd at some point. Having 5-6 free single re rolls each turn is very powerful

**Sasori**

Elfric wrote:
Apparently the Webway gate is amazing. I don't have one but I can see it having massive utility. I dont think we will see transports and rather see larger foot slogging squads of Troupes. The army is so fast now and has lots of tricks and defensive buffs. From personal experience a pure Harlie army feels very strong and I wonder if the luck mechanic wont get FAQ'd at some point. Having 5-6 free single re rolls each turn is very powerful

I don't know about that. Starweavers are pretty aggressively costed for the platform with two Shuriken cannons and being a transport that is pretty tanky.

My gut feeling is the top comp lists are going to be 6-9 Voidweavers, 3-4 Starweavers and then either bikes or some foot harlies to sprinkle.

**Elfric**

Sasori wrote:
Elfric wrote:
Apparently the Webway gate is amazing. I don't have one but I can see it having massive utility. I dont think we will see transports and rather see larger foot slogging squads of Troupes. The army is so fast now and has lots of tricks and defensive buffs. From personal experience a pure Harlie army feels very strong and I wonder if the luck mechanic wont get FAQ'd at some point. Having 5-6 free single re rolls each turn is very powerful

I don't know about that. Starweavers are pretty aggressively costed for the platform with two Shuriken cannons and being a transport that is pretty tanky.

My gut feeling is the top comp lists are going to be 6-9 Voidweavers, 3-4 Starweavers and then either bikes or some foot harlies to sprinkle.

9 Voidweavers is about 810 points but that gets you 18 Str 12, -4AP 2D3 damage which is amazing. And that's just the anti tank profile. Light Saedeth would be the obvious choice there.

**Sasori**

Just a heads up to anyone. Troupes are back on the GW website and I bought some yesterday and they shipped today. It's not ideal (I much prefer supporting my LGS) but this the quick method if you need some more Troupes now.

**wuestenfux**

Now 3x3 voidweavers are possible.
A viable way to go?

**Sasori**

wuestenfux wrote:
Now 3x3 voidweavers are possible.
A viable way to go?

Yeah, absolutely. This is going to be the staple of many comp lists.

**Niiru**

Sasori wrote:
wuestenfux wrote:
Now 3x3 voidweavers are possible.
A viable way to go?

Yeah, absolutely. This is going to be the staple of many comp lists.

If you have a 3D printer, voidweavers are a great pick right now.

If you're actually going to be spending money on them..... I'd highly suggest not, at least until after the first dataslate.

'cos odds are high that voids will get a points increase or some kind of nerf.

(This is just if you were planning on getting 9, cos chances of that remaining the best choice for the points is kinda slim. For sure you should get 3 though, if you don't already.)

**wuestenfux**

Niiru wrote:
Sasori wrote:
wuestenfux wrote:
Now 3x3 voidweavers are possible.
A viable way to go?

Yeah, absolutely. This is going to be the staple of many comp lists.

If you have a 3D printer, voidweavers are a great pick right now.

If you're actually going to be spending money on them..... I'd highly suggest not, at least until after the first dataslate.

'cos odds are high that voids will get a points increase or some kind of nerf.

(This is just if you were planning on getting 9, cos chances of that remaining the best choice for the points is kinda slim. For sure you should get 3 though, if you don't already.)

Indeed, voidreavers (the new black) are a candidate for being nerfed at the next opportunity.
But 2x3 voidreavers seems to be a compromise. I'm adding 3 to my existing 3 voidreavers and reduce the number of skyweavers.

**Phoenix Lord**

Void weavers are a very strong unit, the possibility tu put them in squadrons is uge, I dont'known if put 9 of them in a list will be a good tactics but at least trhee or six of them Will be very annoing for the opponents, if supported by bikes and star weavers, but I think we'll always need troupe for performing actions a gives some punches, so maybe put 9 of them in a list won't be the right go.

**wuestenfux**

Phoenix Lord wrote:
Void weavers are a very strong unit, the possibility tu put them in squadrons is uge, I dont'known if put 9 of them in a list will be a good tactics but at least trhee or six of them Will be very annoing for the opponents, if supported by bikes and star weavers, but I think we'll always need troupe for performing actions a gives some punches, so maybe put 9 of them in a list won't be the right go.

Six voidweavers is a good compromise atm.
They are sold out atm and you won't annoy the opponent that much.
Moreover, you can reckon that the next dataslate will ''fix'' them (point increase?).

**Elfric**

I cannot imagine that Harlequins will be able to field 9 Void Weavers for too long. On the other hand, they can always be converted into transports if people suddenly have more than they can field.

**NewTruthNeomaxim**

Void Weavers are clearly too good for the points, but the Light/Dark bonuses are so innately incredible that I have no idea how GW is going to balance us. Supposedly the Art of War guys are already talking to GW as they expect Harlies to outright break competitive 40k.

**Sasori**

Elfric wrote:
I cannot imagine that Harlequins will be able to field 9 Void Weavers for too long. On the other hand, they can always be converted into transports if people suddenly have more than they can field.

it's the only heavy support choice they have. I don't think they are going to go the Ork way of doing it. It'd just be a points increase.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
Void Weavers are clearly too good for the points, but the Light/Dark bonuses are so innately incredible that I have no idea how GW is going to balance us. Supposedly the Art of War guys are already talking to GW as they expect Harlies to outright break competitive 40k.

Break it more than Ad Mech, Drukhari, and what Tau and Custodes are doing now? Doubtful.

That being said, I do expect some points adjustments heading Harlequins way for sure, it's pretty clear that Void Weavers are a bit too cheap. I don't think they are going to need serious adjustments beyond that at this point though.

**Amishprn86**

Insularum wrote:
For travelling players, I think I'll be using Twilight as the Shadowseer can dish out enough defensive abilities to cover a small force pushing over the centre board on foot (possibly Seer, Troupe, Death Jester).

One combo I'll be trying is Harvester of Torment/Favour of Cegorach on the Death Jester - guaranteeing at least one unmodified six each turn after rolling meaning acing either a save or overwatch in the opponents turn and 4-12 hits in my shooting phase (average about 7.4 hits) - for 70 points and a CP he seems incredible.

Harvest and Favor is a must DJ IMO. A fun alternative DJ is Suit and Rift Ghoul (mostly for Dark/Twilight). But Harvest and Favor are way too good not to take.

**Phoenix Lord**

Sasori wrote:
Elfric wrote:
I cannot imagine that Harlequins will be able to field 9 Void Weavers for too long. On the other hand, they can always be converted into transports if people suddenly have more than they can field.

it's the only heavy support choice they have. I don't think they are going to go the Ork way of doing it. It'd just be a points increase.
]

Break it more than Ad Mech, Drukhari, and what Tau and Custodes are doing now? Doubtful.

That being said, I do expect some points adjustments heading Harlequins way for sure, it's pretty clear that Void Weavers are a bit too cheap. I don't think they are going to need serious adjustments beyond that at this point though.

Yeah I 'm right with you, I think voidweavers or the entire harlequins factions will get a points adjustments and stop, they're always been an army that relais on special tricks, cut away something could put them from very strong to nearly unplayable in a moment, It would be a pity.

**Niiru**

So a slightly annoying thing I've realised...

Craftworlds can make an army, get strands of fate, and include a small harlequins detachment.

But Harlequins can't make an army, get luck, and include a small craftworlds detachment.

Might be the fluffy way of doing things, but still screws up my cool army list idea lol. If you want your army to be mostly harlequins but have some cwe units, you have to give up luck for 90% of your army. (Though you do gain strands on the 10% remaining, for what thats worth).