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Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





I have not played 40k in some time. The last time i played was when the Deamonhunter and Witchhunter codexes were released. I was really drawn to these armies becouse I was able build a force that looked and acted like a personal army of the Inquisitor leading it. I took stormtroopers, inquisitor warbands, Death Cultists, Arbites, Assassins, and the like. I did alright in a battle and pretty fair in a tournament. I loved it becouse i brought something to the table no one expected or knew how to fight it.

I itching to get out to the store and start playing again. I really like Rogue Trader Warbands and the Inquistor Warbands past and present. I wanted to know if i could build a army that was not a IG, Battle Sister or Space Marine army lead by a inquisitor or rogue trader. Also i heard that command points are a major part of the game now and game really punishes when you take what you want. What can you veteran players advise toward this end.

Also this may be a minor issue, where can i find the rules for the Rogue Taders, Inquisitors, and the other odd bits that make the game fun, like the Navy Breachers, Zoat and Ambull?
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka




NE Ohio, USA

The easiest to use source for all the weird stuff like the Zoat, Ambull, Rogue Traders, etc is Whahapedia.
It'll also list the actual books/sources these things came from.

   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Lone Wolf Sentinel Pilot





Leicester, UK

You may struggle to make an army out of the rules available for Inquisitors and Rogue Traders. You may have to use datacards from other armies to 'count as' your guys. For example, if you need some death cult fanatics, you can use the rules for Repentia (sisters). If everyone's got the Imperium keyword the army will be legal but you may need multiple detachments.... I won't try and explain the army building rules here, but as mentioned, Wahapedia is an invaluable rescource. Good luck and hope you can show some stuff in the painting and modelling section!

My painting and modeling blog:

PaddyMick's Chopshop: Converted 40K Vehicles

 
   
Made in us
Guard Heavy Weapon Crewman




South Africa

Okay, so one of the first things to know is that playing in 9th your army needs to be in Detachments, and they need to share a faction keyword. This does limit the ability to create Inquisitor and Rogue Trader forces, but there is an exception to this. In the early years of 8th you could very easily build a force just using the Imperium Keyword.

Rogue Traders and Voidsmen have a rule called Agents of the Imperium which allows them to not have to share a faction keyword. This means you can add 1 Rogue Trader and up to 3 units of 10 voidsmen to any Imperium Force.

The inquisitor also has a similiar rule, but unfortuneatly his acolytes don't. Which means you are effectively limited to a single inquistor.

To my mind the best force to run either Rogue Trader or Inquistor's with is Imperial Guard (Rename Astra Militarum). This is because the book has a variety of options, especially if you are using count as. For example. Bullgryn can be counted as any large model on a 40mm base that looks beefy.

So below are some of my models, these are the three Rogue Trader models that have been released:

Spoiler:






This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/09/01 20:13:48


 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Pretty much what the others have said. I think the toughest part to pull off is this bit:

I wanted to know if i could build a army that was not a IG, Battle Sister or Space Marine army lead by a inquisitor or rogue trader.


The rules for inquisitors, their henchmen, rogue traders, their voidsmen, and assassins make it pretty easy to splash some combination of those units into an army, but you might find it tough to completely avoid using IG or sisters or marines or what have you.

You'd probably find it much easier to use one of the more mainstream factions as a starting point and then just add the weirder stuff (inquisitors, assassins, etc.) into that. So let's say you want to make an army of arbites lead by an inquisitor and his henchmen. You could:

* Take a scion (or whatever) detachment that uses your arbites models.
* Add an inquisitor and a unit of inquisitorial henchmen into that detachment.
* Add an assassin onto that.

Basically, it's pretty easy to add *some* of the weirder factions into your army. It's just harder to add a ton of them all at once.


ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





Thanks for your help


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I downloaded the GW army builder app. Are Blackstone Fortress models legal units and models?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/03 02:08:27


 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka




NE Ohio, USA

 Paymaster Games wrote:
Thanks for your help


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I downloaded the GW army builder app. Are Blackstone Fortress models legal units and models?


Yes.
Each of them has 40k rules. [i]Most[u] also include the stipulation that only 1 copy of a particular unit can be used.
It's buried in the text box under the stat block.
For example, only 1 Zoat.
Even for a few units where it makes little sense - like my beloved Spindel Drones (the only unaligned TROOP unit in the game).
   
Made in us
Veteran Inquisitorial Tyranid Xenokiller





Some backwater sump

I was thinking about how to make an Inquisition/RT army and came to the conclusion using GSC rules and proxied models was a viable solution.

Sub in roughly equivalent models from various Imperial armies under the cult rules and I think you could get it right. For HQ, the Magus could just be a psychic Inquisitor and the Primus a more melee-oriented one. Use a SoB Paragon Warsuit for the Patriarch. Lots of the single-character options could be various Imperial agents. Different heads on Neophyte Hybrids to make them conscripted troops, etc.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/07 20:52:41


New Career Time? 
   
Made in gb
Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant






Dirk Reinecke wrote:

Rogue Traders and Voidsmen have a rule called Agents of the Imperium which allows them to not have to share a faction keyword. This means you can add 1 Rogue Trader and up to 3 units of 10 voidsmen to any Imperium Force.



Isn't it only 1 agents of the imperium unit per detachment though?

Wait, are you adding them in as a separate detachment where they fill slots? Does this mean you have a agents of the imperium detachment, of the 1x RT and 3x VM and then in your main battle force detachment you could take another agent of the imperium, such as an inquisitor or assassin?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/08 00:28:20


My hobby instagram account: @the_shroud_of_vigilance
My Shroud of Vigilance Hobby update blog for me detailed updates and lore on the faction:
Blog 
   
Made in ca
Longtime Dakkanaut





It is true, you can only add one unit with Agent of the Imperium to each detachment.

But it is also true that you can add an Agent to an Inquisition or Rogue Trader detachment, despite the fact that said detachment will itself include units which may also have the Agent rule.
   
Made in us
Impassive Inquisitorial Interrogator






 The Power Cosmic wrote:
I was thinking about how to make an Inquisition/RT army and came to the conclusion using GSC rules and proxied models was a viable solution.

Sub in roughly equivalent models from various Imperial armies under the cult rules and I think you could get it right. For HQ, the Magus could just be a psychic Inquisitor and the Primus a more melee-oriented one. Use a SoB Paragon Warsuit for the Patriarch. Lots of the single-character options could be various Imperial agents. Different heads on Neophyte Hybrids to make them conscripted troops, etc.


That could actually work really well. Especially since the "Kill Team Elucidian Starstriders" just came back, giving you great fodder for the charecters, especially since there are 10 of them (barring the Jackal Alphus and the Patriarch).

EDIT: Honestly, this has just gotten the wheels turning for me. Neophytes can just be guardsmen but otherwise unchanged. Acolytes can be made from Sister Novitiates, get two squads of 5 in one box, since they have Autopistols and Power-swords, as well as whips. If you want to, you could give the autogun and standard arms to the neophytes to help with WYSWYG. Deathwatch vets or any SMs really would be great metamorphs, and GK termies could work as abberants. If you need more HQs or elites, the Guard HQ/elite metal models, like the psykers, or the Regimental advisors.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2022/09/09 00:02:59


 
   
Made in us
Strangely Beautiful Daemonette of Slaanesh





Denver, CO

I am building a 1k Inq list which uses Adeptus Ministorum infantry and Sisters vehicles. Without taking the insane LR tax for Inq, you will need to use someone else's vehicles. Given the Flyer restrictions for matched play, that becomes a problem. I'll drop my BS list in an edit but the basics of my current build are:

Greyfax
2x 5 man Acolytes Plasma pistol/Chainsword
1x 5 man Acolytes with Hotshots
Jokero

Jacobus
2x 6 man Crusaders
2x Immolators w/multi meltas
1x Exorcist
2x Penitant Engines

The Immolators and Exorcist are the only Sisters keyworded items. But since 2 are transports I'm not concerned. I conceded on the vehicles but refuse to use any actual Sisters/Astartes/IG models for this list.

So it can be done. I think this list will be fun to run and relatively competitive in a casual environment. I'd still prefer to have my Acolytes zipping around in an open-topped FA vehicle but that is not to be.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
This line of reasoning broke 7th edition in Fantasy. The books should be as equal as possible, even a theoretical "Codex: Squirrels with Crustacean allies" should have a fair chance to beat "Codex: God".

 Redbeard wrote:

- Cost? FW models cost more? Because Thudd guns are more expensive than Wraithknights and Riptides. Nope, not a good argument. This is an expensive game. We play it knowing that, and also knowing that, realistically, it's cheaper than hookers and blow.
 
   
Made in us
Strangely Beautiful Daemonette of Slaanesh





Denver, CO

Something got screwed up in the translation from iPad to desktop but this is pretty much it. The idea is to have the Penitent Engines and CC Acolytes in the Immolators to push the frontlines, Crusaders and Exorcist holding down the fort while the remaining group of Greyfax, Acolytes, Jokero and Crusaders take the mid board and hold. Originally I wanted to use Hotshots and Jokero in Repressors to take and hold midfield but felt the odd squad sizes weren't synergizing well enough. Regardless, the whole idea is in flux and being tested still. I had another list dropping a squad of Acolytes and Crusaders to runn a max squad of Flagellants with a Preacher and using Karamyzov instead of Greyfax. Lots of opportunities in my opinion.

++ Vanguard Detachment -3CP (Imperium - Inquisition) [58 PL, 3CP, 1,000pts] ++

+ Configuration +

Battle Size [6CP]: 2. Incursion (51-100 Total PL / 501-1000 Points)

Detachment Command Cost [-3CP]

Gametype: 1. Eternal War

Order Convictions: Order: Argent Shroud

+ HQ +

Inquisitor Greyfax [5 PL, 90pts]: 6) Castigation, Hereticus - No Escape, Warlord

Uriah Jacobus [Legends] [3 PL, 50pts]

+ Elites +

Acolytes [5 PL, 75pts]: Ordo Hereticus
. Acolyte: Chainsword, Plasma pistol
. Acolyte: Chainsword, Plasma pistol
. Acolyte: Chainsword, Plasma pistol
. Acolyte: Chainsword, Plasma pistol
. Acolyte: Chainsword, Plasma pistol

Acolytes [5 PL, 75pts]: Ordo Hereticus
. Acolyte: Chainsword, Plasma pistol
. Acolyte: Chainsword, Plasma pistol
. Acolyte: Chainsword, Plasma pistol
. Acolyte: Chainsword, Plasma pistol
. Acolyte: Chainsword, Plasma pistol

Acolytes [5 PL, 50pts]: Ordo Hereticus
. Acolyte: Bolt pistol, Hot-Shot Lasgun
. Acolyte: Bolt pistol, Hot-Shot Lasgun
. Acolyte: Bolt pistol, Hot-Shot Lasgun
. Acolyte: Bolt pistol, Hot-Shot Lasgun
. Acolyte: Bolt pistol, Hot-Shot Lasgun

Crusaders [3 PL, 55pts]
. 5x Crusaders: 5x Power sword

Crusaders [3 PL, 55pts]
. 5x Crusaders: 5x Power sword

Jokaero Weaponsmith [1 PL, 20pts]: Ordo Hereticus

+ Heavy Support +

Exorcist [8 PL, 160pts]: Exorcist Missile Launcher

Penitent Engines [6 PL, 100pts]
. Penitent Engine: 2x Penitent buzz-blades
. Penitent Engine: 2x Penitent buzz-blades

+ Dedicated Transport +

Immolator [7 PL, 135pts]: Hunter-killer missile, Twin multi-melta

Immolator [7 PL, 135pts]: Hunter-killer missile, Twin multi-melta

++ Total: [58 PL, 3CP, 1,000pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/09/30 19:41:07


 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
This line of reasoning broke 7th edition in Fantasy. The books should be as equal as possible, even a theoretical "Codex: Squirrels with Crustacean allies" should have a fair chance to beat "Codex: God".

 Redbeard wrote:

- Cost? FW models cost more? Because Thudd guns are more expensive than Wraithknights and Riptides. Nope, not a good argument. This is an expensive game. We play it knowing that, and also knowing that, realistically, it's cheaper than hookers and blow.
 
   
Made in ca
Longtime Dakkanaut





That's a sweet list, and Sisters are the Hereticus Chamber Militant so it's as fluffy as it gets. I also think Greyfax looks great with a Sisters army.

She's a bit of a Puritan to countenance a Xeno among her retinue... But hey, it's your army.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





 purplkrush wrote:
Something got screwed up in the translation from iPad to desktop but this is pretty much it. The idea is to have the Penitent Engines and CC Acolytes in the Immolators to push the frontlines, Crusaders and Exorcist holding down the fort while the remaining group of Greyfax, Acolytes, Jokero and Crusaders take the mid board and hold. Originally I wanted to use Hotshots and Jokero in Repressors to take and hold midfield but felt the odd squad sizes weren't synergizing well enough. Regardless, the whole idea is in flux and being tested still. I had another list dropping a squad of Acolytes and Crusaders to run a max squad of Flagellants with a Preacher and using Karamyzov instead of Greyfax. Lots of opportunities in my opinion.


How did you get the Sisters units without taking a Sisters Detachment?
Looking at your list you would need a Inquisitor Vanguard detachment and Sisters Spearhead detachment to make this work, but a solid army none the less.

   
Made in us
Strangely Beautiful Daemonette of Slaanesh





Denver, CO

 Paymaster Games wrote:
 purplkrush wrote:
Something got screwed up in the translation from iPad to desktop but this is pretty much it. The idea is to have the Penitent Engines and CC Acolytes in the Immolators to push the frontlines, Crusaders and Exorcist holding down the fort while the remaining group of Greyfax, Acolytes, Jokero and Crusaders take the mid board and hold. Originally I wanted to use Hotshots and Jokero in Repressors to take and hold midfield but felt the odd squad sizes weren't synergizing well enough. Regardless, the whole idea is in flux and being tested still. I had another list dropping a squad of Acolytes and Crusaders to run a max squad of Flagellants with a Preacher and using Karamyzov instead of Greyfax. Lots of opportunities in my opinion.


How did you get the Sisters units without taking a Sisters Detachment?
Looking at your list you would need a Inquisitor Vanguard detachment and Sisters Spearhead detachment to make this work, but a solid army none the less.



It is two detachments, as you said. I believe you have them correct as well. The SoBs have access Adeptus Ministorum units which were traditionally allowed Inquisition which is why I settled on them. Using IG would have allowed me another Inquisitor but HQs were otherwise not optimal and SM allowed a Command Rhino as a non-SM HQ which is fluffy but not quite what I was looking for.

My problem is so many people talk about Inquisition like it’s this rag-tag, dirty group of fanatical hobos. But when I read the fiction (like the Eisenhorn series), it’s a small retinue which gathers spec ops forces for each major confrontation. Using only the AM units gives that very what-is-sitting-in-that-containment-bay-right-now-because-we-leave-in-five kind of vibe, while still allowing some flexibility and basic list-building strategy.

So when I start fleshing things out for larger games, I’m thinking about an IG detachment that’s a mechanized Ministorum force with Arco Flagellants and Necromunda enforcers (as IG Vets) with armored transports, pull in a second Inquisitor and an Assassin but overall keep it a mobile strike force where even the heavier armour is intended to deliver troops to the front and not sit back and shoot, like the Immolators. Obviously, the Exorcist would be the exception but even then it would be the practical TT equivalent of having mobile, pre-assault bombardment meant to shake the enemy before the troops storm the gates type of thing.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
This line of reasoning broke 7th edition in Fantasy. The books should be as equal as possible, even a theoretical "Codex: Squirrels with Crustacean allies" should have a fair chance to beat "Codex: God".

 Redbeard wrote:

- Cost? FW models cost more? Because Thudd guns are more expensive than Wraithknights and Riptides. Nope, not a good argument. This is an expensive game. We play it knowing that, and also knowing that, realistically, it's cheaper than hookers and blow.
 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





Right now for my inquisitor army i am looking at a Inquisitor vanguard detachment (the only one you can really take for a Inquisitor force) and a IG or Stormtrooper Detachment.

I have a bunch of old Inquisitors, Henchmen (Acolytes) and a squad of 9 arbites (that i plan on using as Navy Breachers since they are armed with shotguns). Right now i am thinking One unit for Acolytes, and One Jekkro Weaponsmith per Inquisitor. One Demonhost for the Warlord's unit (since i only have the one). I plan on taking at least two to three Inquisitors (named or generic i have not decided yet) to the total army.

I am planning to add the second detachment to add Stormtroopers, Crusaders, and transports (Valkaries and/or Chimeras), this detachment will be lead by a Inquisitor.

I am still playing around with the points to figure out what i am going to get to rebuild my Inquisitor army from third edition.
   
 
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